Some lies coin dealers will tell you

[jeff of pa]

Some of you are looking into putting your IRA or 401K funds into a safe investment. A lot of the traditional holdings aren't doing so well in protecting your accumulated wealth. There is even talk of the U.S Government losing their AAA credit rating if they nationalize Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae. That would mean all of our U.S. Treasury Bills and U.S. Savings bonds might not be as safe as they once were. So, people are turning to precious metal investments.

Some very large companies selling gold, silver, and platinum are a little on the greedy side in the fees they charge getting you coins in your retirement account. The tell their customers that they are going to put "Mint Condition" bullion coins in the person's IRA and because these are "Mint" and sealed in a special case they have collector's value. That is not true. Bullion coins are valued ONLY by the weight in the precious metal. They also might try to sell you a "First Strike" bullion coin. There is no added value to the coin no matter if it was first off the assembly line or last. This is just a way to get you to pay the collector's premium (30% spread quoted-some large companies actually charge 43%) when they shouldn't be charging more than 10% for a bullion transaction. If you find that a company is lying to you about the type of coin you are getting collectable/bullion, please don't trust them at all. What else are they lying to you about?

http://denver.yourhub.com/CastlePine...ry~501375.aspx

[snake35]

Very true!!!! The t.v. coin dealers are the worst. Like the 9/11 silver plated currency from Liberia, good for the face value of $20.00 in Liberian money. I am not sure what the exchange rate is, but it can not be much. I also feel that paying a premium to save state quarters is nuts. Scarcity makes coins more valuable. How many people are saving them?

[jeff of pa]

Very true!!!! The t.v. coin dealers are the worst. Like the 9/11 silver plated currency from Liberia, good for the face value of $20.00 in Liberian money. I am not sure what the exchange rate is, but it can not be much. I also feel that paying a premium to save state quarters is nuts. Scarcity makes coins more valuable. How many people are saving them?

Struck in .999 Pure Silver Leaf! So what does it weigh 1/1000th of a gram ?


The tv ad makes an effort to convince the viewer that the item is completely redeemable for $20.00. What they don't tell you is that it's $20.00 Liberian which, with the current exchange rate (http://www.oanda.com/convert/classic), is 32¢ U.S.

http://www.ecauldron.net/forum/index...e;topic=6148.0

::shakes head::

Help On Cancelling Orders on 911Twenty.Com?

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...4100601AAFhadk

[snake35]

I knew the exchange rate was low, but WOW!

[jeff of pa]

it's part of africa they are using Weelbarrows these days to shop.

[Zephyr]

I wonder how many wheelbarrows of money you need to buy a wheelbarrow there...?

[chong2]

r u serious? .32 cents? why dont someone call the company and bitc....complain, like really. well im sure its been done but............ thats just bull. especially now they all hear invest in gold and silver.................. OMG not cool, im gonna close this post so i can speak my mind in ways that "good" forums never get to see

[jim4silver]

I mean this with all due respect, but whomever buys their gold and silver from TV ads or shopping channels, is probably not a very informed investor.

As far as dealers lying, many times a buyer will go to a dealer and ask that dealer's opinion on what they should buy, or what is a good deal. I have seen this myself firsthand while at a coin shop. To me, this is like going to a used car dealer and asking how much you should pay for a car and which car should you buy. Some dealers are honest and will give good advice. But some are not so honest. Some like to push graded gold claiming it is confiscation proof, which is BS. The law can change at anytime and if the gov wants to take gold and/or silver, they can write a new law that includes or exempts whatever they want. I don't believe gold or silver confiscation will occur because so few of the populace actually owns any and neither circulate as actual currency here like they did in 1933, but some dealers use this claim to sell overpriced graded coins/bullion to people who don't know any better.

People need to be responsible for their own research on this subject. It is not too difficult. If unsure, stick with 90% coins or name brand silver bars/rounds. For gold, stick with the best bullion for the money, Krugs, maple leafs, etc. Avoid the gimmicky crap and you will do well. No numismatics unless you know what you are doing or have someone you trust completely to guide you.

Just my thoughts.

Jim

[Immy]

I've been in coins for over 30+ years and a couple years ago I was talking to a jeweler who had been in biz for at least that long. I was telling him about some sovereigns I had just bought and he said "Be careful who you buy from" cuz there are a lot of disreputable dealers out there. Then he told something that floored me about a butt-load of bogus gold coins imported from Israel back in the 70s IIRC. I had never heard of this in 30 years of reading coin news.

Just shows how careful you gotta be.

[jim4silver]

I've been in coins for over 30+ years and a couple years ago I was talking to a jeweler who had been in biz for at least that long. I was telling him about some sovereigns I had just bought and he said "Be careful who you buy from" cuz there are a lot of disreputable dealers out there. Then he told something that floored me about a butt-load of bogus gold coins imported from Israel back in the 70s IIRC. I had never heard of this in 30 years of reading coin news.

Just shows how careful you gotta be.

I have done alot of research into gold coins, etc. and have never heard of this either. Since neither you nor I have heard of it, it simply may not be true. Either way, the good thing with gold is that it is not too hard to spot a fake. Due to gold's unique specific weight, you can spot a coin not made of gold easily.

If you know the proper dimensions of the gold coin you seek, simply weight it and measure it. If it weighs and measures accurately, you can be sure it is made of gold. The only two metals that can be used to replace gold in a fake are platinum or tungsten. For obvious reasons nobody would use platinum nowadays to fake gold, since platinum is worth more. Tungsten is difficult to work with, and while I have seen photos of fake gold bars with tungsten cores that have weighed properly, I don't think it is possible to fake coins with Tungsten. At least not that I am aware of from what I have read. Bars are more easily made than complicated designs of coins like Krugs, Maples, etc.

Thus, a fake gold coin is either going to be light if its dimensions are correct, or too large if its weight is correct assuming it does not contain Platinum or Tungsten.

For sure there are counterfeits made with the proper amount of gold/copper, etc, such as high quality St. Gaudens or Liberty knock offs, but since I stay aware from numismatics and buy only for bullion value, I do not worry about buying one of these. I have read, although I am not sure that I believe it, that there have been high quality counterfeits which have made their way successfully into slabs and have been graded by some of our well respected coin graders receiving high MS designations. I think if you stick to modern bullion coins or well circulated old US gold coins, your chance of getting taken are slim if you know what to look for.

Jim