C
cachenut
Guest
Opponents of HB2078
I believe we are making progress in stopping this bill. Yesterday I heard the bill was being changed to help it pass. I don?t know what changes but I hope they are going to strike sections 2307 and 2308. I hope? As of last night the bill is still in the sub-committee and waiting for the next meeting on Friday, tomorrow. It also appears to have moved to the bottom slot, last bill in the last section of the agenda. Bottom of the barrel. I hope this means it is going to fail to pass the committee.
We can still help by emailing the committee members today. They are evaluating HB2078 based on legal issues. Several members of these forums have said the committee members want our input so writing to them is a good idea. Even if you do not hear back they may still be reading your emails. Its do or die time.
So here are the emails of the committee members.
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
I suggest writing to them about the criminal or legal issues in the bill. Use your reasons and your email.
1. It will be a felony to sell a relic without written permission. A felony!!! Crock.
2. Misdemeanor to dig without written permission. What?s wrong with oral permission?
3. It is already a felony to trespass, steal, sell stolen property. Why more laws?
4. There are a lot of us. How will they enforce it on 5000 relic hunters out on sunny day.
5. What good will it all do, trespassers will still trespass.
6. Anyone who wants to exploit a great site only needs written permission. It won?t help.
7. Costs of enforcement, courts, etc will be high if they do it.
8. Do they really want to throw someone in jail for selling a relic on EBAY?
9. BLAME the bill. It was poorly written and is confusing. Bad bill. Bad.
Remember the legislators are there to represent us, even the ones who proposed the bill are just representing those who want it. All are trying to look out for Virginians. Show them respect but show them relic hunters do not want this bill to pass. The delegates already on our side might say ?give me a good reason?. Well, give them several good reasons in an email. Send them another email. It will help.
Another issue to bring up is the impact statement. These are submitted when the bill is created and are supposed to describe what the bill will do and what it will cost. The impact statements with this bill are each about two pages long. One is for criminal matters (legal) and the other is for money (fiscal).
These two impact statements are not complete. They sound good but they left stuff out. This legislation will affect a lot of people and they don?t know how many. And the impact statement says this. We don?t know. They are saying I don?t know but we don?t think it is very many. They are wrong about this. Completely wrong. This impact statement needs to be rewritten to reflect the real impact. This is a good reason as I mentioned above.
The link below is the one on cost but I think it still leaves some stuff out. Archaeologist will need his own truck, backhoe to do his work and operators, office, staff, computers, etc ? There is a lot more money involved than they let on.
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?051+oth+HB2078F122+PDF
Here is the legal impact statement.
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?051+oth+HB2078F160+PDF
This bill affects so many people that they will not be able to enforce it. Most of us use only oral permission now. Will everyone just suddenly switch to written? Nope. How will they even begin to check which relics sold have written permission associated with them. They cannot. If they tried they could end up with 5000 misdemeanor charges filed and as many felonies too. It is ridiculous. What good does it do? Who will it stop?
The reason I said to challenge the impact statement is (of course they are wrong) the bill may be sent back again to get them updated and corrected.
The bill affects so many people but what will it do? Most of the crimes in the bill are already illegal. Why should a bill create new crimes? Are we criminals?
So if you have not written your committee members yet get off your duff and do it before it is too late. And if you have already have, do it again.
One more thing, they asked for short letters and to the point. Not like mine. Start with your point. Give them a paragraph or two and then close with your point again.
If enough of us write today and tomorrow morning we can get this bill halted. Take the time and pay ten minutes today or in the future it won?t be so easy.
Joe Wolfe
I believe we are making progress in stopping this bill. Yesterday I heard the bill was being changed to help it pass. I don?t know what changes but I hope they are going to strike sections 2307 and 2308. I hope? As of last night the bill is still in the sub-committee and waiting for the next meeting on Friday, tomorrow. It also appears to have moved to the bottom slot, last bill in the last section of the agenda. Bottom of the barrel. I hope this means it is going to fail to pass the committee.
We can still help by emailing the committee members today. They are evaluating HB2078 based on legal issues. Several members of these forums have said the committee members want our input so writing to them is a good idea. Even if you do not hear back they may still be reading your emails. Its do or die time.
So here are the emails of the committee members.
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
I suggest writing to them about the criminal or legal issues in the bill. Use your reasons and your email.
1. It will be a felony to sell a relic without written permission. A felony!!! Crock.
2. Misdemeanor to dig without written permission. What?s wrong with oral permission?
3. It is already a felony to trespass, steal, sell stolen property. Why more laws?
4. There are a lot of us. How will they enforce it on 5000 relic hunters out on sunny day.
5. What good will it all do, trespassers will still trespass.
6. Anyone who wants to exploit a great site only needs written permission. It won?t help.
7. Costs of enforcement, courts, etc will be high if they do it.
8. Do they really want to throw someone in jail for selling a relic on EBAY?
9. BLAME the bill. It was poorly written and is confusing. Bad bill. Bad.
Remember the legislators are there to represent us, even the ones who proposed the bill are just representing those who want it. All are trying to look out for Virginians. Show them respect but show them relic hunters do not want this bill to pass. The delegates already on our side might say ?give me a good reason?. Well, give them several good reasons in an email. Send them another email. It will help.
Another issue to bring up is the impact statement. These are submitted when the bill is created and are supposed to describe what the bill will do and what it will cost. The impact statements with this bill are each about two pages long. One is for criminal matters (legal) and the other is for money (fiscal).
These two impact statements are not complete. They sound good but they left stuff out. This legislation will affect a lot of people and they don?t know how many. And the impact statement says this. We don?t know. They are saying I don?t know but we don?t think it is very many. They are wrong about this. Completely wrong. This impact statement needs to be rewritten to reflect the real impact. This is a good reason as I mentioned above.
The link below is the one on cost but I think it still leaves some stuff out. Archaeologist will need his own truck, backhoe to do his work and operators, office, staff, computers, etc ? There is a lot more money involved than they let on.
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?051+oth+HB2078F122+PDF
Here is the legal impact statement.
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?051+oth+HB2078F160+PDF
This bill affects so many people that they will not be able to enforce it. Most of us use only oral permission now. Will everyone just suddenly switch to written? Nope. How will they even begin to check which relics sold have written permission associated with them. They cannot. If they tried they could end up with 5000 misdemeanor charges filed and as many felonies too. It is ridiculous. What good does it do? Who will it stop?
The reason I said to challenge the impact statement is (of course they are wrong) the bill may be sent back again to get them updated and corrected.
The bill affects so many people but what will it do? Most of the crimes in the bill are already illegal. Why should a bill create new crimes? Are we criminals?
So if you have not written your committee members yet get off your duff and do it before it is too late. And if you have already have, do it again.
One more thing, they asked for short letters and to the point. Not like mine. Start with your point. Give them a paragraph or two and then close with your point again.
If enough of us write today and tomorrow morning we can get this bill halted. Take the time and pay ten minutes today or in the future it won?t be so easy.
Joe Wolfe
