While we are discussing California .......

[cornelis 816]

Out of the diary of Viscaino ..... The general returned to the pueblo and an indian woman brought him two pieces of figured China silk , in fragments , telling him that they had got them from people loke ourselves , who had negroes ; that they had come on the ship which was driven by a strong wind to the coast and wrecked , and that ot was farther on . The general endeavored to take two or three indians with him , that they might tell him were the ship had been lost , promising to give them clothes . The indians consented and went with himto the captains ship , but as we were weighing anchor preparatory to leaving the indians said they wished to go ahead in their canoe , and that they did not wish to go aboard the ship, fearing thatwe would abduct them , and the general , in order notto excite thwm said : ,, very well ,, . We set sail , and on leaving the port a head wind struck us , which prevented our going where the indians indicated ; therefor we stood out to sea and the indians returned to their pueblo . ( the island of Catalina ) . Cornelius

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Treasure of Victoria Peak - Grab it through Amazon!

[Mackaydon]

Cornelius:
No doubt an interesting wreck or two is off the backside of Catalina, but if you dropped your hook in that area, at least a dozen agencies would be standing in line to file against you; or worse.
Don...........

 

[cornelis 816]

I understand it Don . You and I , and a few other people have spent a lifetime in research and actual diving . The reward we are getting is that whatever time and trouble we had are not adding up to anything . A few office boys have beaten us in all we did . Cornelius

 

[cuzcosquirrel]

Who knows, might have been that one ship sent from Pinal, China that never arrived. That would have been wrecked about 1596 I think. I'll see if I can find the information if I have time today. It's not on the galleon list, and I have been meaning to contact Cruikshanks about it.

"The affair went so far, that, having been brought before a court of justice, silence was
imposed upon the Portuguese of Macan, under penalty of severe corporal
punishment; while the Castilians were given and assigned a port on
the same coast, named El Pinal [Pine Grove], twelve leguas from the
city of Canton, where they might then and always enter and make a
settlement of their own; and they were given sufficient chapas [i.e.,
edicts or passports of safety] and provisions therefor. Thereupon
Don Joan de Camudio, entered El Pinal with his ship and there he was
furnished with everything needful by the Chinese at a moderate price
while the Spaniards went to and fro on the river upon their business
to Canton in lorchas [106] and champans. While the Spaniards were
detained, in the said port they were always well received in the city
and lodged in houses within its walls. They went about the streets
freely and armed, a thing which is new and unique in China in respect
to foreigners."

Letter from Govenor Tello to King of Spain, ~1600.

"That the city of Cebu sent a ship to Castilla, in the year 1597, which was lost on the sea. Your Majesty having granted the city of Cebu authority to despatch a ship to Mexico, it did so; and the ship
left Cebu about two years ago, carrying merchandise both for the citizens of that city and of Manila,
which was considered best; but, from the time when it left until now, there has been no word of it. It is
thought that it was lost, which is no slight matter for this country, coming in addition to the loss of the ship
"San Phelipe;" with which, and the retention of their money which the citizens of
Manila have suffered, and other hardships, this commonwealth is hard smitten, as is the courage of its people.
If there is any way in which to resuscitate it, it will be for your Majesty to give permission for the citizens
thereof to despatch a ship of three hundred toneladas to Peru every two or three years, with the products of
this country; they will not undertake to carry anything more than flagstones, ivory, and other things which are
not carried from España, and this will not cause any loss to the royal customs duties of your Majesty."

Wonder if I had this wrong? I think I might have, or read some bad information. I'm pretty sure this is another ship, and that no ship sailed directly from Pinal. This kind of stuff begins to make Manila Galleon traiffic seem more erratic than otherwise presented. They are even talking about sending a ship to Peru to discourage the Peruvians from coming in and hogging the traffic in the regular Mexico galleon, which they were doing.