1715 plate fleet wreck north of Sabastian Inlet. Florida?

[cobra]

I am seeking information, thoughts, and opinions on a possible 1715 plate fleet wreck just north of Sebastian Inlet, Florida.
There is a area about 1.5 miles north of the inlet commonly referred to as the Bonsteel Park and Chucks Steakhouse area.
Spanish cobs from the time of the 1715 fleet sinking are still being found on this beach, yet no known wrecksite has been identified. The Mel Fisher Group still own the rights to this general area. Wonder what they know?

It is also generally agreed that this beach is where a large qty of spanish coins were found right after hurricane Jeanne came ashore. This story was widely covered by the media.

Some think the San Roman(cabin wreck) broke apart at the gun ports and the upper deck was pushed north by the hurricane. Others think a small salvage sloop loaded with recovered treasure was attacked by the pirate Henry Jennings in 1716 and in a effort to outrun the attack capsized near the beach. The reefs extend north along the coast. The present day inlet was not there in 1715.

It is known that Henry Jennings used the campfire lights from each of the salvors camps(about 8 miles apart) to coordinate night time attacks on the Spanish camps, so a raid on a small sloop loaded with recovered treasure is not unthinkable. It is my understanding that there were several attacks on the Spanish camps during the recovery efforts.

If anyone has information about this time period, or location I would appreciate any information you could provide.
Thanks very much.

Richard

 

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[FISHEYE]

Richard,
if you want some history on the 1715 plate fleet,check out Tom Gidus's web site.

link:http://www.wreckoverysalvage.com/page11.html

 

[rgecy]

Cobra,
I don't think it has never been definately proved either way that that area is yielding coins from an unknown 1715 wreck or a salvage wreck. For the amount of coins being revealed, I personally think it is one of the 1715 fleet. The one thing we do know is the duneline in 1715 was farther back. It's possible the wreck could lie under the existing beach. I don't think it would be improbable to say that there definitely could be an unknown wreck in that vicinity.

I think there are going to be some major finds this year along the Treasure Coast!

Good Luck,

Robert in SC

 

[mad4wrecks]

None of the archival documents available to us indicate that a ship from the 1715 fleet went down in the area of Chuck's Steak House. The beach at Bonsteel Park is known as reale beach for all the 1 and 1/2 reales recovered there. Extensive magnetometer surveys have not revealed any large anomalies associated with a major shipwreck (iron rigging, cannons, anchors etc...) No ballast pile has been found. And although the area is deep sand, no pottery has been recovered, which is light and tends to stay in the top layers and shift around. There is a theory that a section of the Cabin Wreck (the Nuestra Senora de la Regla-not the San Roman), 3 miles to the south, drifted up that way. There is the theory that you mentioned, about one of the salvage boats at that time going down-not at the hands of Jennings, however. It was probably overloaded and just overturned. I think this ship being lost is mentioned in the book Pieces of Eight or possibly, Gold, Galleons & Archaeology. A small salvage vessel would not be expected to have many cannon on board, if any, smaller anchors, little ballast, etc.. and being lighter may have washed up on the beach, which would explain the absence of these items.
Tom G

 

[cobra]

Thanks for the replies. All of this information is very helpful. First regarding the San Roman. In his book "Shipwrecks near Wabasso Beach" Bob Weller indicates the cabin wreck to be the San Roman, and the Corrigan wreck to be the Regla.
In his book "pieces of Eight" Kip Warner notes a possible wreck almost at the entrance of the inlet. This is noted in Wellers book as the Pines wreck, although no hard evidence has been found. I wonder if when the inlet was deepened right after WWII was the wrecksite destroyed by workers who knew nothing about the wrecks? Could be.

If there is another salvage camp north of the inlet, which is possible, then that would seem to indicate a wreck north of the inlet.
I personally beleive Mel Fisher knew something about this area or he would not have claimed the salvage rights there.

I know a lady who lives on the beach north of the Chucks area, She has found spanish cobs in her yard. Given the current dunes to be appx 75 feet back from the dunes in 1715 one could understand another campsite possibility. In 1715 all north -south travel was done on the beach. Inland travel was to hard and dangerous given the underbrush and Ais indians in the area.

BTW the survivors/salvage campsite on which the McLarty museum is located was spread out for about 3000 feet to the south from the current day museum all along the dunes, and from the dunes back to the river.

Thanks to all for the information. If I come across any additional unpublished information I shall share it with all here.
Personally I find this most interesting. Hell...half the fun is the speculation.

Also...the dunes at Chucks and Bonsteel have been renourished with sand trucked in over the past 3-4 weeks.

 

[cobra]

Half the fun of studying the 1715 fleet is the research. The three books which contain much of the information are "Pieces
of Eight" by Kip Wagner, "Shipwrecks on Wabasso Beach" by Bob Weller and Ernie Richards, and Hurricane Treasure by Reilly, Rowe, and Maranville. These are all good reading.

Shipwrecks near Wabasso Beach indicates the cabin wreck to be the San Roman and the Corrigan site to be the Regla.
Hurricane Treasure-1715 beach sites indicates just the opposite.

I realize much has been published about the 1715 fleet. We are all probably reading the same books, and have the same dreams. I'm trying to dig up some additional unpublished material. As with any historical event time is the enemy.

I am particularly intriqued now by the mel Fisher map Jeff Davis mentioned. Maybe this will lead to something new!
And yes..I also think the hurricanes of 2004 will have changed the reefs enough to make it a great summer exploration season.

Thanks,

Richard

 

[rgecy]

This is only hear say! But I have heard that coins had been found even across the road on the edge of the river side?? Can anyone lend any validity to this story?

Could it be possible, that some debris was even swept over the dunes and came to rest in the shallows on the river side?? We know the storm was very strong and waves were over 20ft!? With a storm surge, this seems possible!

Any comments?

Robert in SC

 

[cobra]

now THATS a very interesting scenerio to ponder! Gret stuff!...thanks!

 

[wreckdiver1715]

Jeff, just a little trivia for you. There are actually five ships (not two), of the combined fleets of 1715 that have yet to be located. Can anyone name them?

 

[Jimi D Pirate]

Concepcion, San Miguel, Rosario, El ZCiervo, and Maria Galante ... I think!

 

[wreckdiver1715]

Four out of five is good Jim. However, the Nuestra Senora del Rosario is about 500 feet off shore at Sandy Point.

Q

 

[rgecy]

Is the Hampton Court the last one?

Robert

 

[Jimi D Pirate]

How about the "Refuerzo"?

FOUND:
Nuestra Senora de la Regla "Cabin Wreck"
Urca de Lima "Wedge Wreck"
Nustra Senora de las Nieves "Colored Wreck"
Santo Cristo de San Roman "Corrigans Wreck"
Nuestra Senora del Carmen "Rio Mar Wreck"
Nuestra Senora del Rosario "Sandy Point Wreck"

LOST:
Nuestra Senora de la Conception
San Miguel
El Cievo
Maria Galante
Refuerzo

Griffon made it ! maybe?

I have dove on several of these sites thru the years and will again this year but I have found most under the sand on the beach, many pieces of eight through the years but no escudos as of yet!! yet!!

 

[mad4wrecks]

The 'refuerzo' and the Urca De Lima are one and the same. Refuerzo is a type of vessel rather than the actual name. Also, check out the 1715 history on my website (www.wreckoverysalvage.com), where respected researcher Mr. John DeBry, a Frenchman, claims there is no historical eveidence that the French ship Griffon survived the disaster, as often reported.

 

[Jimi D Pirate]

gdaddy thank you for the information. You have a great site and thanks for the link, I'll visit often.

 

[wreckdiver1715]

Nuestra Senora de la Regla, aka Cabin Wreck
Urca de Lima aka Santissima Trinidad aka Wedge Wreck
Nuestra Senora de las Nieves aka Colored Beach Wreck
Santo Cristo de San Roman aka Corrigan's Wreck
Nuestra Senora del Carmen aka Rio Mar Wreck
Nuestra Senora del Rosario aka Sandy Point Wreck

Maria Galante - Missing
Nuestra Senora de la Concepcion ?Missing, she reportedly wend down on the South side of Cape Canaveral
El Senor San Miguel - Missing
La Olandesa aka San Miguel ? Missing, probably between Rio Mar and Sandy Point
El Cievro aka La Galleria - Missing

 

[mad4wrecks]

Re: 1715 plate fleet wreck north of Sebastian Inlet. Florida?

Re: the San Miguel. It is my opinion that it lies off the coast of Vero Beach between the Corrigans wrecksite and the Rio Mar wrecksite. This 5 mile long stretch of coastline is under lease to HRD Inc. I have helped them work this area since 1998. It is producing material (timbers, iron rigging, artifacts and coins) from the early 18th century, identical to what has come off the other 1715 sites. We were featured on the Travel Channel's Worlds Best Lost Treasures, exploring this site.

In his 2001 book, In the Wake of Galleons, Bob Marx (who is an HRD consultant!) claims that the San Miguel lies in deep water off St. Augustine. In 1991 he excavated the site using an ROV and recovered material consistant with the 1715 shipwrecks.

Of course, this is all opinion. NONE of the 1715 wrecks have been positivelly identified. And the ships from that fleet were certainly not the only early 18th century ships to go down along the Florida coast.

 

[JAVIER]

if I want to go and treasure hunt over sabastian inlet, do I need any permission from someone?

 

[mad4wrecks]

Re: 1715 plate fleet wreck north of Sebastian Inlet. Florida?

Javier: Treasure hunt on the beach...no. Treasure hunt in the water......call Taffi Fisher at 772-589-9875

 

[rgecy]

GDaddy or Wreckdiver,

So which ship was the Hampton Court?

Robert in SC