robocurran
Greenie
- Aug 8, 2018
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I just purchased a used JW Fisher Proton 4 mag. By any chance does anyone have the computer software??
namaste
john
namaste
john
JW Fisher Proton 4 Magnetometer software
- Thread starter robocurran
- Start date
agflit
Hero Member
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Ummm...did you not receive the console unit?.. or am I suspecting you bought just the towfish?
ag
Proton 4 Metal Detector
ag
Proton 4 Metal Detector
Salvor6
Silver Member
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Read the description you posted:
"Connect a GPS and position coordinates with mag readout data can be captured with the OPTIONAL Tracker software."
robocurran
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no no,,,, i got the entire system including the digital numeric and alarm console...... i was just hoping to get a hold of the additional software for graphical display of anomalies....... JW wants a grand for the software which i find outrageous...... i thought a couple hundred for photoshop was bad,, holy crap.........
- Jun 3, 2007
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Tracker 3 data collection and storage software: $995
Proton 5 Metal Detector
That's really not a bad price, if you consider how many copies they sell...and I bet that is a low number.
I have learned a little about magnetometers in the last several months. One of those things is that pretty much all modern magnetometers output data in NEMA sentences.
(If you are not familiar with NEMA comms protocols, here are a couple of references -the first one written by one of the great Open Source computer gurus of all time, Eric S Raymond, author of "The Cathedral and the Bazaar"
< NMEA Revealed >
and
< https://www.trimble.com/oem_receiverhelp/v4.44/en/NMEA-0183messages_MessageOverview.html >)
Anyway...your mag generates these NEMA sentences that look like these CSV (comma seperated values) files..these have had a good bit of extraneous data deleted, and the fish was on the deck, therefore the big cell-2-cell deltas "
The gist of all this is that what you are really doing with that mag software is reading these values, storing it in either a csv format or some proprietary file type which is most likely a csv file with a different name and then looking at it, either in this sort of format or some graphic visual representation.
At the heart of all this, pared down to the barest minimum, what you are looking for is the field signal and the GPS location of the fish at a given time. That gives you the field strength at that location. I put a column in there called cell2celldelta" that calculates the change between consecutive cells to easily show the hits that register above your interest threshold, be it 1,2 3 or 5 gamma. You can dump that data into MS Excel and have a spreadsheet or you can get
Terry Armstrong's (Signum Ops) DigTrakR software, it will do this as well. DigTrakR is the best option IMO, and Terry deserves a lot of credit for developing this piece of software for the treasure salvage business. Heis the one who got me started looking at the data instead of the pretty pictures.
You can map that mag information right into DigTrakR or Google Earth
It's pretty cool stuff...but it DOES require a good bit of study to do it right. I am still studying.
Hope this might help someone.
Proton 5 Metal Detector
That's really not a bad price, if you consider how many copies they sell...and I bet that is a low number.
I have learned a little about magnetometers in the last several months. One of those things is that pretty much all modern magnetometers output data in NEMA sentences.
(If you are not familiar with NEMA comms protocols, here are a couple of references -the first one written by one of the great Open Source computer gurus of all time, Eric S Raymond, author of "The Cathedral and the Bazaar"
< NMEA Revealed >
and
< https://www.trimble.com/oem_receiverhelp/v4.44/en/NMEA-0183messages_MessageOverview.html >)
Anyway...your mag generates these NEMA sentences that look like these CSV (comma seperated values) files..these have had a good bit of extraneous data deleted, and the fish was on the deck, therefore the big cell-2-cell deltas "
| Reading_Date | Reading_Time | Magnetic_Field | cell2cell delta | Signal_Quality | Depth | Measurement_Time | Signal_Strength | Reading_ID | System_Time | Mag_Latitude | Mag_Longitude | GPS_Latitude | GPS_Longitude |
| 18-Jul-18 | 07:10.5 | 20640.047 | 99 | 0.3 | 465 | 198 | 2 | 07:14.9 | 27.77617 | -80.3964953 | 27.77601167 | -80.3964 | |
| 18-Jul-18 | 07:11.5 | 20772.342 | -132.295 | 99 | 0.3 | 465 | 198 | 3 | 07:15.9 | 27.77616 | -80.39649074 | 27.77600417 | -80.396395 |
| 18-Jul-18 | 07:12.5 | 20573.205 | 199.137 | 99 | 0.3 | 465 | 197 | 4 | 07:16.9 | 27.77615 | -80.39648141 | 27.77598833 | -80.396386 |
| 18-Jul-18 | 07:13.5 | 20651.738 | -78.533 | 99 | 0.3 | 465 | 199 | 5 | 07:17.8 | 27.77613 | -80.39647185 | 27.77597167 | -80.396378 |
| 18-Jul-18 | 07:14.5 | 20595.296 | 56.442 | 99 | 0.2 | 466 | 198 | 6 | 07:18.8 | 27.77612 | -80.39646228 | 27.775955 | -80.396369 |
| 18-Jul-18 | 07:15.5 | 20576.41 | 18.886 | 99 | 0.2 | 465 | 196 | 7 | 07:19.9 | 27.7761 | -80.39645247 | 27.7759375 | -80.396362 |
| 18-Jul-18 | 07:16.5 | 20651.856 | -75.446 | 99 | 0.3 | 465 | 200 | 8 | 07:20.9 | 27.77608 | -80.39644246 | 27.77591917 | -80.396355 |
| 18-Jul-18 | 07:17.5 | 20554.103 | 97.753 | 99 | 0.3 | 465 | 198 | 9 | 07:21.9 | 27.77607 | -80.39643277 | 27.77590167 | -80.396348 |
| 18-Jul-18 | 07:18.5 | 20579.495 | -25.392 | 99 | 0.2 | 465 | 199 | 10 | 07:22.9 | 27.77605 | -80.39642332 | 27.775885 | -80.396338 |
The gist of all this is that what you are really doing with that mag software is reading these values, storing it in either a csv format or some proprietary file type which is most likely a csv file with a different name and then looking at it, either in this sort of format or some graphic visual representation.
At the heart of all this, pared down to the barest minimum, what you are looking for is the field signal and the GPS location of the fish at a given time. That gives you the field strength at that location. I put a column in there called cell2celldelta" that calculates the change between consecutive cells to easily show the hits that register above your interest threshold, be it 1,2 3 or 5 gamma. You can dump that data into MS Excel and have a spreadsheet or you can get
Terry Armstrong's (Signum Ops) DigTrakR software, it will do this as well. DigTrakR is the best option IMO, and Terry deserves a lot of credit for developing this piece of software for the treasure salvage business. Heis the one who got me started looking at the data instead of the pretty pictures.
You can map that mag information right into DigTrakR or Google Earth
It's pretty cool stuff...but it DOES require a good bit of study to do it right. I am still studying.
Hope this might help someone.
Last edited:
Salvor6
Silver Member
- Feb 5, 2005
- 3,755
- 2,169
- Detector(s) used
- Aquapulse, J.W. Fisher Proton 3, Pulse Star II, Detector Pro Headhunter, AK-47
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You're right. The software was $500 two years ago. They doubled the price!
robocurran
Greenie
- Aug 8, 2018
- 19
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- Thread starter
- #7
very much appreciated......
i am following up now......
namaste
john
i am following up now......
namaste
john
signumops
Hero Member
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The Proton 4 is very similar to the AquaScan Proton magnetometer. I have an AquaScan mag and I wrote software to capture its output with a GPS interface, using $GPGGA sentences. I had a Garmin 12XL GPS at the time and I first had to find somebody who actually produced an interface cable for the Garmin unit which featured a peculiar plug. After finding that (produced by an enterprising Australian who was facing the same problem), I had to have my AquaScan modified to accept the GPS input, and to dump the output as ASCII text, rather than driving a printer (which is very OLD technology, and something that you should not even think about fooling around with). Bill Seliger Sr. made those mods for me. RIP.
I downloaded the Proton 4 manual, and I have to say that the hardware diagramming in reference to the serial interface leaves much to the imagination. The first thing you have to do is see if there are interface ports on your control box because the manual implies that these are OPTIONAL... does you model even support NMEA interface hardware?
It's misleading by implying you use a 5 pin DIN connector, while seeming to show the typical outline of a 9 pin connector in the same diagram? Without seeing photos of the actual control box itself, I can only imagine what the instructions mean. I believe what I am looking at on page 35 is a 5 pin DIN connector that plugs into the control box, while the other end of the cable is wired into a 9 pin RS232 female connector, meaning that this is strictly a serial interface from the control box to your computer, where you will receive the NMEA data. Point being that you will need to use a computer that has a typical 9 pin serial plug interface... NOT a USB interface. While laptop computers are no longer manufactured with serial ports (they all seem to have USB ports instead), you can find an older system that does have serial port(s), or, as I did myself, order a computer that is supplied with a 9 pin serial port. I have tried to use USBtoSerial converters with zero luck, and simply recommend that you use a computer with a serial interface built in. There's enough smoke in these projects already, so eliminate the questionable elements at the start.
On page 26 you get a better idea of what exactly 5 pin DIN connector is being used (there are a number of different types). This section illustrates the input for the GPS unit which is using pins 1, 2, and 3 from the GPS (once again you will probably have to do some construction of a cable) to the 5 pin array of the DIN connector that goes into the control box. This all depends on what GPS receiver you are using and what type of NMEA out port it has. However, from what I can tell, it looks like you need to set your GPS unit's NMEA out port to 4800 baud, no parity, 8 data bits, and 1 stop bit, which you might see as a selection of 4800 N 8 1 on a potential setup menu.
The typical NMEA sentence output in ASCII text for a Proton 4 equipped with a GPS input (GPGGA or GPGLL) should look like this per the sample seen on page 35:
"@46308 4149.5645,N,07102.7125,W<OD><OA>46322 27.336455081.234455" CRLF
This is NOT a fully delimited sentence, meaning that you will have to pick it apart on the computer screen using your eyeballs and a great quantity of visine along with several gallons of coffee, OR, let your computer do that for you, ergo the big bucks for the custom software designed to do exactly that!
They were not specific, but I THINK the sentence is decompiled as follows:
"@46308 " might be the ambient gamma background signal (it does change periodically, depending on where you are)
"4149.5645" is actually 41 degrees & 49.5645 minutes north (as the locale tune point Latitude)
Then a comma delimiter
"N" indicates North, or Latitude
Then a comma delimiter
"07102.7125" is actually 71 degrees & 2.7125 minutes west (as the locale tune point Longitude)
Then a comma delimiter
"W" indicates West or Longitude
"<OD>" I do not know what that is
"<OA>" I do not know what that is
"46322" would be the gamma reading for example (note the difference of PLUS 16 gammas when you subtract the ambient 46308)
Then a space delimiter
"27.336455" would be the GPS Latitude
"081.234455" would be the GPS Longitude (the leading zero indicates a western longitude... west of Prime Meridian)
And lastly, there is a CRLF which would cause the printer to start a new line, or in the case of ASCII text, move down to the next line and start a fresh sentence.
Be aware that the cycle rate on the Proton 4 is about 2 seconds, therefore there will be about 30 lines of text produced every minute or around 1800 lines per hour. Actually that's not very fast, and it means that if your boat is moving at six feet per second, you will have moved 12 feet before you get a reading. A 2 second cycle rate means you have to move very slowly to pick up small objects like cannons for instance. If you are looking for big stuff like hulls, automobiles, phone cables, ect. then 2 second cycles are OK.
I'd recommend getting hold of Fishers to get specifics about the details of their NMEA output sentences. It's critical that you can map the actual polarity of your gamma readings and you might get a better idea of what I'm talking about if you go to Signum Ops | Videos and scroll down to watch a video called "A Sample Dipole Mag Target" so you can get a feel of how important gamma mapping is.
I downloaded the Proton 4 manual, and I have to say that the hardware diagramming in reference to the serial interface leaves much to the imagination. The first thing you have to do is see if there are interface ports on your control box because the manual implies that these are OPTIONAL... does you model even support NMEA interface hardware?
It's misleading by implying you use a 5 pin DIN connector, while seeming to show the typical outline of a 9 pin connector in the same diagram? Without seeing photos of the actual control box itself, I can only imagine what the instructions mean. I believe what I am looking at on page 35 is a 5 pin DIN connector that plugs into the control box, while the other end of the cable is wired into a 9 pin RS232 female connector, meaning that this is strictly a serial interface from the control box to your computer, where you will receive the NMEA data. Point being that you will need to use a computer that has a typical 9 pin serial plug interface... NOT a USB interface. While laptop computers are no longer manufactured with serial ports (they all seem to have USB ports instead), you can find an older system that does have serial port(s), or, as I did myself, order a computer that is supplied with a 9 pin serial port. I have tried to use USBtoSerial converters with zero luck, and simply recommend that you use a computer with a serial interface built in. There's enough smoke in these projects already, so eliminate the questionable elements at the start.
On page 26 you get a better idea of what exactly 5 pin DIN connector is being used (there are a number of different types). This section illustrates the input for the GPS unit which is using pins 1, 2, and 3 from the GPS (once again you will probably have to do some construction of a cable) to the 5 pin array of the DIN connector that goes into the control box. This all depends on what GPS receiver you are using and what type of NMEA out port it has. However, from what I can tell, it looks like you need to set your GPS unit's NMEA out port to 4800 baud, no parity, 8 data bits, and 1 stop bit, which you might see as a selection of 4800 N 8 1 on a potential setup menu.
The typical NMEA sentence output in ASCII text for a Proton 4 equipped with a GPS input (GPGGA or GPGLL) should look like this per the sample seen on page 35:
"@46308 4149.5645,N,07102.7125,W<OD><OA>46322 27.336455081.234455" CRLF
This is NOT a fully delimited sentence, meaning that you will have to pick it apart on the computer screen using your eyeballs and a great quantity of visine along with several gallons of coffee, OR, let your computer do that for you, ergo the big bucks for the custom software designed to do exactly that!
They were not specific, but I THINK the sentence is decompiled as follows:
"@46308 " might be the ambient gamma background signal (it does change periodically, depending on where you are)
"4149.5645" is actually 41 degrees & 49.5645 minutes north (as the locale tune point Latitude)
Then a comma delimiter
"N" indicates North, or Latitude
Then a comma delimiter
"07102.7125" is actually 71 degrees & 2.7125 minutes west (as the locale tune point Longitude)
Then a comma delimiter
"W" indicates West or Longitude
"<OD>" I do not know what that is
"<OA>" I do not know what that is
"46322" would be the gamma reading for example (note the difference of PLUS 16 gammas when you subtract the ambient 46308)
Then a space delimiter
"27.336455" would be the GPS Latitude
"081.234455" would be the GPS Longitude (the leading zero indicates a western longitude... west of Prime Meridian)
And lastly, there is a CRLF which would cause the printer to start a new line, or in the case of ASCII text, move down to the next line and start a fresh sentence.
Be aware that the cycle rate on the Proton 4 is about 2 seconds, therefore there will be about 30 lines of text produced every minute or around 1800 lines per hour. Actually that's not very fast, and it means that if your boat is moving at six feet per second, you will have moved 12 feet before you get a reading. A 2 second cycle rate means you have to move very slowly to pick up small objects like cannons for instance. If you are looking for big stuff like hulls, automobiles, phone cables, ect. then 2 second cycles are OK.
I'd recommend getting hold of Fishers to get specifics about the details of their NMEA output sentences. It's critical that you can map the actual polarity of your gamma readings and you might get a better idea of what I'm talking about if you go to Signum Ops | Videos and scroll down to watch a video called "A Sample Dipole Mag Target" so you can get a feel of how important gamma mapping is.
ARC
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