Australian shipwreck - re write history?

[BVI Hunter]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ved-stones-prove-Australia-settled-Spain.html

 

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[ARC]

Well well well.... if it isn't ole "gold in-between the rocks" BVI Hunter.



Long time.

 

[Albertaclipper]

Hey AARC.....wouldn't the Spanish have logs/records of their sailings back in the day? Or is that not accepted by the academics?

Cheers!

 

[bay pirate]

Knocking the dust off I see. Hope all is well. Great article

 

[ARC]

Hey AARC.....wouldn't the Spanish have logs/records of their sailings back in the day? Or is that not accepted by the academics?

Cheers!

Sorry missed your post... Since this whole Covid thing... sheesh I sorta am outta the loop on here.

and the answer is yes. 95% I would say are documented... but... Here is the deal... many times the locations etc are what is missing.

One day storms comes... it sank... that's it... Last wearabouts or sighting are many times all there is.

Record keeping was commonplace but not a complete science... some records are very vague or misplaced / lost...

OF some of the records... as of a few year ago... 91.2% were sunk by weather... tropical storms / hurricanes...

4.3% navigational problems... 1.4% engagements with British, Dutch or US ships. and only 0.8% were sunk by pirates.

NOW this "study" conducted awhile back ... which I reference here... new findings and stats have not been updated to my knowledge... of course I have not looked.

I have no interest in "other" places than Florida so... And they don't uncover any info anymore new to me / interests.

What is known... has been known... not to say they might not find a scrap of paper with some info one day.

Anyway... a lot of the records were to give a "reason" for the "loss"... most herein... the reason being... "ship last seen off Florida coast" which was the most entered "record" of a ships last location.

 

[Javadroid]

I don't know whether the Spanish got their first or not, but what I love is the story of all the research and searching for clues and the prize -- he's doing treasure hunting with the adventure it ought to be done with.

 

[freeman]

The trouble it's gone the way most of these 'it must be true' stories go: the suspiciously similar sounding excuses given each time to explain why a vital piece of evidence the whole story is hinged upon cannot now be shown begin to pile up.

"Yeah, it was found but no one took photos or GPS and we can't find it again..."

"Yeah, someone said they saw it but we looked and can't find it again....."

"Yeah, it's under a building/airstrip/highway/reservoir now so we can't dig....."

 

[Army of 1]

There are a few stories about wrecked Spanish Galleons off of the Cape , Murray Jardine son of Frank a pioneer on the Cape had Pearling luggers and in 1902 some divers working near Murray Island discovered a what was left of a chest full of Spanish Silver ( not sure of dates on coins ) and another employee working close to shore found a conglomerate of Spanish coins on the reef that weighed 67 Kg this also contained Gold coins , There is also a story of a 1702 Spanish wreck somewhere on Boot reef loaded with Bullion but don't know if this can be proven or there is any relationship with the settlement wrecked Galleons

 

[freeman]

For those who don't know about Australian history and who arrived first, the Portuguese then Spanish: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hartog_Plate



Also look up 'Gilded Dragon, West Australia' to learn of the shipwreck and how familiar the Spanish were with the place also.

 

[ARC]

Take for example.... the loss of the San Jose... It sailed from Mexico to provision Portola in 1770 and it never arrived.

So all the records simply say "lost at sea".

This is all that is known for a massive amount of ships.

 

[Army of 1]

One of many Dutch VOC ships that were wrecked on the Western coast of Australia , the most famous being Batavia lost in 1629 and Zuytdorp early 1,700's

 

[enrada]

Another Ben Crapp story. The real story should be about Alan Robinson who found the Gilt Dragon in WA whom I personally met. He got railroaded by the Australian Government and ended up committing suicide in jail. I wear a Pof8 that he gave me every day.

 

[Army of 1]

Good luck keeping any shipwreck Treasure you find in Australian waters , the Government will claim it confiscate it and send you to jail if it has been recovered illegally .

 

[ARC]

Here is just a glimpse of RECORDED INFO... heh... THIS IS the only information to be found... OR known about this little group.

Now as far as the "manifests".... they may still lurk in Seville on some shelf somewhere in the back room... on the top shelf... in the moldy box... in pieces.

:P

Ship Name: Not Known #1447 Date of loss: 09/05/1622
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #1844 Date of loss: ??/??/1528
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #1857 Date of loss: ??/??/1559
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2342 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2859 Date of loss: ??/??/1562
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2865 Date of loss: ??/??/1578
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2866 Date of loss: ??/??/1579
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2867 Date of loss: ??/??/1580
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2869 Date of loss: ??/??/1585
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2870 Date of loss: ??/??/1590
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2872 Date of loss: ??/??/1594
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2873 Date of loss: ??/??/1606
Description: Wooden Hull- Almiranta
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2876 Date of loss: ??/??/1656
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2957 Date of loss: ??/??/1579
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2958 Date of loss: ??/??/1579
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2959 Date of loss: ??/??/1579
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2960 Date of loss: ??/??/1579
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2973 Date of loss: ??/??/1731
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #2976 Date of loss: ??/??/1660
Description: Wooden Hull
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #39 Date of loss: ??/??/1715
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Patache Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #72 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:026.59.00 Long: W:079.02.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #73 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:026.42.00 Long: W:079.24.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #74 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:026.38.00 Long: W:078.53.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #748 Date of loss: ??/??/1554
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #766 Date of loss: ??/??/1628
Description: Almiranta
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #78 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:026.29.00 Long: W:078.50.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #79 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:026.29.00 Long: W:079.02.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #80 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:026.29.00 Long: W:079.29.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #81 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:026.10.00 Long: W:079.30.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #82 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:025.50.00 Long: W:079.20.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #83 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:025.28.00 Long: W:079.20.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #86 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:025.00.00 Long: W:079.39.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #87 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:024.54.00 Long: W:080.00.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #874 Date of loss: ??/??/1525
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Caravel Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #876 Date of loss: ??/??/1554
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #878 Date of loss: ??/??/1556
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #88 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:024.39.00 Long: W:079.39.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #883 Date of loss: ??/??/1567
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #885 Date of loss: ??/??/1572
Description: Tender
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #886 Date of loss: ??/??/1576
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #887 Date of loss: ??/??/1572
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #889 Date of loss: ??/??/1579
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Frigate Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #89 Date of loss: ??/??/?
Description:
Lat: N:024.24.00 Long: W:080.00.00
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #890 Date of loss: ??/??/1587
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #892 Date of loss: 09/??/1589
Description: Almiranta
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #893 Date of loss: 09/??/1589
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #894 Date of loss: ??/??/1592
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Frigate Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #895 Date of loss: ??/??/1600
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #896 Date of loss: 03/??/1618
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Patache Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #897 Date of loss: ??/??/1618
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #899 Date of loss: ??/??/1621
Description: Advice Boat
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Patache Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #901 Date of loss: 09/06/1622
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Patache Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #904 Date of loss: 09/06/1622
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #905 Date of loss: ??/??/1623
Description: Capitana
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #906 Date of loss: 07/??/1624
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Frigate Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #907 Date of loss: ??/??/1626
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Frigate Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #908 Date of loss: ??/??/1627
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Frigate Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #909 Date of loss: ??/??/1630
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #910 Date of loss: 04/02/1623
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Frigate Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #912 Date of loss: 12/??/1634
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #913 Date of loss: 09/27/1641
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Galleon Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #916 Date of loss: ??/??/1688
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #921 Date of loss: 07/30/1715
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Patache Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #922 Date of loss: ??/??/1731
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #923 Date of loss: ??/??/1733
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Merchant Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #925 Date of loss: ??/??/1734
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #926 Date of loss: ??/??/1741
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Frigate Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #927 Date of loss: 02/05/1744
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #929 Date of loss: ??/??/1766
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #935 Date of loss: ??/??/1770
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #936 Date of loss: ??/??/1771
Description: Warship
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ship Name: Not Known #944 Date of loss: 01/??/1803
Description:
Lat: Long:
Last Known Location: Florida
Vessel Type: Ship Nationality: Spanish
Notes:

 

[chub]

You forgot the Ruby Princess oh , hang on...thats worthless...



chub

 

[xaos]

F

or those who don't know about Australian history and who arrived first, the Portuguese then Spanish

I would have to say the Chinese arrived first in OZ!

 

[terry g]

Hey AARC, Wow that's a list of some of the lost vessels... I'm impressed... I would think the Spanish are not to happy with to many gringos scratching through there records... I wonder how many of those vessels were lost in the Bahamas? For some of those captains it would have been the first trip in the gulf stream... I take my hat off to some of those captains. Many modern day navigators still screw up even with all the navigation aids we have.
Terry

 

[ARC]

Hey AARC, Wow that's a list of some of the lost vessels... I'm impressed... I would think the Spanish are not to happy with to many gringos scratching through there records... I wonder how many of those vessels were lost in the Bahamas? For some of those captains it would have been the first trip in the gulf stream... I take my hat off to some of those captains. Many modern day navigators still screw up even with all the navigation aids we have.
Terry

Actually records are public... Just like here.

That is only PART of a much larger list.

An estimate shows that more than three million shipwrecks lie on the ocean floor.