Cob ID needed

[pulltabsteve]

Hi gang! I found this over the weekend at a site I have found a few reales at in the past. Can anyone help with an approximate date? Thanks!

[divewrecks]

Mexico mint, looks to be a 1 reale from the late 1600's to early 1700's. Can you read the letter under the O (over) M mintmark? That would be the assayer's initial and could give a better idea of date range.

Stan

[pulltabsteve]

Thanks Stan. On which side would the O/M be? The cross side or the other?

[divewrecks]

Shield side, at about the 7 o'clock position in your picture with the dime. I can make out the O/M mintmark, but not the letter (assayer initial) beneath...

There may not even be enough there to guess at.

Stan

[realeswatcher]

You can tell it's Mexico mint immediately from the distinctive cross style... Shield design (not monogram), so it's larger than the 1/2 Real denomination... Properly proportioned detail on a dime-sized planchet, so it has to be 1 Real. The shield has the central triple fleur-de-lis Bourbon escutcheon, so we know it's Philip V (1R coins dated 1701 and up). Looking at some more specific diagnostic points on the shield, this piece can be narrowed with certainty to 1712-14. For those of you who are already versed on the shield design:

-- Granada pomegranate has been removed, but the sliver of the SE castle quadrant is still visible
-- the Low Countries' diagonal lines have been stretched to their outer border; no longer contained within a 2nd inner border
-- Austria bar still stretches from border to border... hasn't yet been shortened

Beyond that, a bit of the date area is faintly visible, and I believe that's actually "14" of a 1714 date there (the dates are located in the encircling legend WNW of the shield... most of which usually never made it onto the planchet)... Possible that could be an optical illusion (as that area is weak/crude), but the more I look at it, I'm somewhat confident that's what it is (the positioning backs this up).

The Mº mintmark, BTW, is to the immediate left of the shield. Just below the mintmark is the assayer initial, which based on the style as discussed above, has to be "J"... you can see a bit of the top line of the "J" on yours.

This appears to be a land find, yes? Coincidental, b/c it's an absolutely typical date for pieces from the 1715 Fleet, which is where a large portion of the extant pieces from this period have come from.

[pulltabsteve]

Thanks for the help Stan. I cant even see the O/M

[pulltabsteve]

Realeswatcher, thank you for all that information! Yes, it is a land find. I found 2, 1 Reales at this spot in the past.

[divewrecks]

Nice finds PTSteve! Keep up the good work...

Stan

[realeswatcher]

Realeswatcher, thank you for all that information! Yes, it is a land find. I found 2, 1 Reales at this spot in the past.

Steve (or Pulltab... 4th of July appropo :->)...

1. Those two "normal" 1R pieces - The one on the left (VII behind head, kind of bowl haircut) is a scarcer piece to find... A Peru "imaginary bust" piece, style only made from 1809-1811 and only at the Lima mint. Definitely better than a typical Mexico mint piece. Yours is "181_"... last digit either 0 or 1 (probably clear in hand).

The 1781 is either Mexico, Potosi (Bolivia), or Lima (Peru)... Can tell for sure seeing the other side, of course - I'm leaning Lima from the overall look?

2. Below is a photo of a specially prepared "Royal" presentation strike 1 Real dated 1715 (VERY rare!)... Don't look too closely at the specifics WITHIN the shield (several design features were notably altered even from a year or two earlier)... but it shows well what the overall design and legends would look like on a "perfect" strike of a 1R cob.