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  1. #21
    us
    Aug 2008
    453
    11 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    I think that this replica is so far off from the original that it is unnecessary.

    I always got around the need by having a bail physicly attached to the coin.

    As compared to Chinese fake US coins, I think cob faking is a pretty low priority.

    The only real incidents are the guys selling the fakes on ebay and the issue with a treasure hunting group selling fake gold escudo cobs about a decade ago.

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  3. #22
    Charter Member

    Oct 2004
    N. San Diego area (Pic of my two best 'finds')
    Minelab Explorer
    11,216
    1351 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Honorable Mentions (2)

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    "The manufacture in the United States, or the importation into the United States, for introduction into OR THE DISTRIBUTION IN COMMERCE (emphasis added) of any imitation numismatic item which is not plainly and permanently marked “copy”, is unlawful and is an unfair or deceptive act or practice in commerce under the Federal Trade Commission Act" [15 U.S.C. 41 et seq.].
    Holding a fake is not illegal, but attempting to sell one that is NOT in compliance with the Hobby Protection Act is illegal.

    Don.....

  4. #23
    us
    Sep 2010
    102
    8 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)


  5. #24
    us
    Sep 2010
    102
    8 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    Quote Originally Posted by cuzcosquirrel
    As compared to Chinese fake US coins, I think cob faking is a pretty low priority.

    The only real incidents are the guys selling the fakes on ebay and the issue with a treasure hunting group selling fake gold escudo cobs about a decade ago.
    Eh... don't be so sure about that. Among others, there is of course the commonly seen "wristwatch", which shows up with varying dates... Here is a 1667 version from this past week, sold from the Philippines:
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/120802990206

    Another specimen of the same fake is running right now from a seller in Hong Kong:
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/260886798819

    Note that the seller of that 2nd piece (in addition to offering a bunch of the other usual suspects - obvious pillar 8R rare dates/counterstamps, etc.) had this one up last week. I hadn't seen this one before (or maybe I have, and didn't catch it...):
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/260881160032


  6. #25
    us
    Aug 2008
    453
    11 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    That would be the guys selling the fakes on ebay.

  7. #26
    us
    Sep 2010
    102
    8 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    Quote Originally Posted by cuzcosquirrel
    That would be the guys selling the fakes on ebay.
    I meant it in regards to the first part of that, that as compared to the Chinese faking of U.S. coins, (Asian) production of fake cobs isn't a priority... If you want to stretch it out from solely cobs to a wider Spanish coinage field which includes pillar 8 Reales, it's DEFINITELY a priority. Basically EVERYTHING that China has some familiarity with from their history is now getting a noticeable amount of the Madame Tussaud's treatment - Pillar 8R (tons), also cobs, portrait 8R British trade dollars, French Indochina piastres, plus anything big, silver, and Chinese (ranging from your basic Fat Man and Junk dollars up into rarer types). You are also seeing lots of rather high-quality fake German States thalers, Swiss 5Fr and shooting thalers, etc - basically, any popular series they think they can forge well. I honestly think they may be hitting the non-U.S. stuff more now b/c more casual collectors (at least here in the U.S.) aren't quite as familiar with diagnosing it yet.

    Point being, there is LOADS of this stuff filtering out on eBay, and eBay really does form a significant portion of where people are getting their coins (including cobs)... in particular world coins, which people in many areas don't have local suppliers for.

    NOW.... about that "treasure hunting group selling fake gold escudo cobs about a decade ago"... DO tell. Any further info on that... and even better, any photos of examples of their work??

    In terms of other domestic faking operations (and I won't include the production of REALLY good-quality intended replicas which DON'T clearly display COPY in the manner "mackaydon" mentioned... it's not lost on the distributors of such things that these pieces sometimes get turned around as genuine to uninitiated end buyers)... You of course read cryptic stories here and there alluding to certain salvage outfits casting managed quantities of sea-salvaged pieces.. and NOT as replicas. Of course, that's all apocryphal... As had been discussed on here in the past, there was a reseller outfit in the 90's that was selling framed "shipwreck" pieces... Since that thread was last active, I got to examine, in hand, a supposed 1715 Fleet 8 Reales that turned out to be from this same outfit. It came with a facsimile of the Fisher-style Cobb Coin Co. cert that even included a tracing, printed number, and stamped seal... though if you look very closely, NOT Fisher's official seal, it was their company name! The coin itself? Highly suspect...


  8. #27
    us
    Aug 2008
    453
    11 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    There's a partially buffed out file line on the edge of that coin.

  9. #28
    us
    Sep 2010
    102
    8 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    Yuppers... AND an edge seam (visible in the first pic).

  10. #29
    us
    Dec 2004
    South Florida
    70's Whites TM Amphibian, HH Pulse, Ace 250
    23,601
    751 times
    Beach and Shallow Water Hunting

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    There are an alarming amount of fakes showing up. In this case however its kinda obvious. I am still wondering if this replica is silver?

  11. #30
    us
    Tuberale

    May 2010
    Portland, Oregon
    White's Coinmaster Pro
    2,982
    20 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    There is, I suppose, always the chance that this is one of Mel Fischer's re-creations from the Atocha, based on the silver bar he recovered from the Nuestra de Atocha to make replicas of. But those were supposed to have had Certificates of Authenticity attached to them. This one, of course, does not have that certificate. But it could, I suppose, be an unattributed replica. Has anyone here actually purchased one of the replica silver Piece of Eight produced from one of the Atocha silver bars?

    I'll try to go on-line and see if anyone has actually posted a photograph of those replicas.

  12. #31
    us
    Tuberale

    May 2010
    Portland, Oregon
    White's Coinmaster Pro
    2,982
    20 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    Just checked. None of the replica coins looks similar to mine.

  13. #32
    us
    Aug 2008
    453
    11 times

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    I remember looking at a silver old shield 1500's Lima 4 reals a few years ago at a jewelry store. They said it was real, or they didn't know, but I figured it was a Fisher replica made from the Atocha silver.

    I think there is something cool about just owning jewelry made from the silver. I recently tried to buy some worn out cob reals with no markings just to get the silver to make some stuff I had in mind.

    I don't think your fake cob is one of their replicas. I think yours is a recast of a well known novelty piece.


    I remember when the framed coins came around because my friend owns a furniture store and these were offered to him to retail. He asked me about it because he knew my interest in the cob coins. Our assessment at the time was that they were fake and that it was not a good idea to sell them to others.

  14. #33
    us
    ARRG

    Feb 2005
    Sarasota, FL
    Whites Surfmaster PI Pro and Whites Surfmaster PI, Minelab Excal NY blue sword.
    1,949
    75 times
    Shipwrecks

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    Tuberale, as they have said this is a very obvious fake. It is so obvious that there is no doubt it is just a fantasy fake coin. The Mel Fisher fakes were made from casts of the coins that were found in the mother load pile. They(found cobs) were cleaned with hardened steel needle bearings, which ruined all of them. They tumbled them with the bearings. Which really beat the coins up. They should have used muratic acid, which is how they have been cleaned for years, but they didnt, they are morons. They ruined all those coins so bad they are very obvious to tell what they are just from the beating they took. First time I saw some, I said These are really beaten bad, how did you clean them, and they told me, and I said you shouldnt have done that. The next many I looked at were also beaten bad. But they cast them and made a bunch of fakes, which looked worse, if that was possible, than the real coins. Yours is crisp and sharp, so it is easy to see that it is not real. And definetly not a Mel Fisher fake. He did do and sell some other fakes/castings too, but not Atocha cobs, some different dates, and wrecks.

  15. #34
    us
    Dec 2004
    South Florida
    70's Whites TM Amphibian, HH Pulse, Ace 250
    23,601
    751 times
    Beach and Shallow Water Hunting

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    As was stated, this is a known pot metal tourist souvenir not a Fisher coin. I was curious if yours was cast silver because it would be a first for me but you didnt say or I missed it. I have never seen a silver cast of this design. They were all pot metal Im pretty sure.

  16. #35
    gb
    Feb 2012
    Newcastle
    12
    Shipwrecks

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    Quote Originally Posted by realeswatcher

    Another specimen of the same fake is running right now from a seller in Hong Kong:
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/260886798819
    Do you guys report these items when you find them on eBay? I would gladly spend 10 minutes a night going through them, reporting each fake or incorrectly advertised replica, if I knew what I was looking for of course.

  17. #36
    us
    Mar 2012
    1
    info on coins

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    Wow glad I found this site. My friend showed me a coin and the first I said is that it was fake. It just took me this long to find this site to prove it thanks so much. Heck I even have the little heart shaped hollow spot like the first one. I will add photos for others as well. Thanks again. Rich
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  18. #37
    us
    Dec 2004
    South Florida
    70's Whites TM Amphibian, HH Pulse, Ace 250
    23,601
    751 times
    Beach and Shallow Water Hunting

    Re: 1618 8 real copy (Was Information please. Cobs.)

    Quote Originally Posted by bandanarich
    Wow glad I found this site. My friend showed me a coin and the first I said is that it was fake. It just took me this long to find this site to prove it thanks so much. Heck I even have the little heart shaped hollow spot like the first one. I will add photos for others as well. Thanks again. Rich
    Same exact fake.

  19. #38
    us
    Apr 2012
    N FL
    CTX 3030 / MXT Pro
    98
    34 times
    Metal Detecting
    I found the identical fake reale today.

    Big ol FAKE!


 

 
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