8 Reales cob - how old/which type please?

[SILVERSEEKER67]

Hi guys

I've an 8 reale silver cob [ I think that's what it is! ] and I was wondering if anybody in the know could tell me a little bit more about it ie rough idea of date/what king etc.
I know you can work it out from the various letters etc on them but this looks very worn to me so I'm not sure what info if any you can get from it.
Thank you for looking!

 

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[Mackaydon]

SS67,
Welcome to Treasure Net !!
If it weighs about 27 grams, it's an '8'; proportionally less for lower denominations: 4R, 2R, etc.
My eyes seem to see an "8" to the right of the shield.
It is not from Mexico.
Don...

 

[Diver_Down]

Welcome to TNet. You have a unique piece with a few clues that substantiate each other. The most distinguished clue is the partial date of xx40. Seeing the cross and Hapsburg shield, predates it before the Pillar and Waves style that was brought about after 1652. Hence the date of your piece is 1640 and minted during the reign of King Philip IV. It was minted in Potosi. The assayer is not entirely clear but with the corroborating clues, it narrows it down to an assayer mark of FR. The straight leg of the "R" is indicative of the unique mark. The assayer that is traditionally assigned to the mark is Pedro Trevino.

There is some debate as to what occurred during the above assayer term (1640-1644) as Pedro held the prior assayer duties(1636-1640) with a unique assayer mark with a curved leg of the "R". Why would he change his mark from a TR curved leg to FR straight leg? He also served as assayer from (1643-1647) with a return to the TR mark with a curved leg. Sedwick details the theories in his book The Practical Book of Cobs.

 

[realeswatcher]

The info is correct as Diver_down stated...the "4 0" of 1640 as clear as you will find it. Not very easy to find such a clearly/unquestionably dated Potosi shield 8R of these years. Not a well-struck piece, but certainly fortuitous in what detail it DID receive!

Silverseeker, you note that it looks very worn... There is certainly a lot of circulation wear on this piece, but note that the areas that are completely flat (blank) aren't like that because they were worn away... the detail was simply not imparted onto the planchet in those spots on this particular piece (due to an uneven hammer blow/uneven planchet thickness).

 

[NJnuggetpirate]

Very cool congrats

 

[SILVERSEEKER67]

Thanks very much - you guys really know your stuff!

I've another 4 coins which are similar except they're around half the weight of the big one so guessing they're 4 reale pieces - would it be ok to send you pics of these to try and get any info on them? - not sure if I should add them to this post or create a new one.

Thanks again!

 

[NJnuggetpirate]

Thanks very much - you guys really know your stuff!

I've another 4 coins which are similar except they're around half the weight of the big one so guessing they're 4 reale pieces - would it be ok to send you pics of these to try and get any info on them? - not sure if I should add them to this post or create a new one.

Thanks again!

Just use this post it's ok

 

[realeswatcher]

Was about to comment on what they were... 1 Mexico 1630s-40s, 2 Potosi 1620s, 1 Potosi ca. 1640 (TR or FR monogram).

And then, they vanished...

 

[SILVERSEEKER67]

Apologies realeswatcher - I deleted the 4 reales enquiry from this one and started a new post - thought it would keep it tidier rather than have 2 enquiries together - the pics on the new post i have called the coins a,b,c and d

 

[HCW]

Mackaydon
I found one myself I cant seem to ID.
When you say it's not from Mexico does that mean it's not Spanish.
Did others make cobs
I'll try to post my own.
Paul

 

[Trez]

Paul,
To use your quote "When you say it's not from Mexico does that mean it's not Spanish" and "Did others make cobs"
The latter question is the easiest to answer YES, there were many Mints that produced Cob coinage. Mexico, Lima, Potosi, were the most common as far as closest Mints to the Americas, but Panama, Bogota, and a few others produced Spanish Colonial Coin Information, Spanish Coin Identification Guide may help you.
The ones we find are "typically" From Mexico, Lima, Potosi.
Now as far as your first quote...As far as Spain is concerned, yes. There Mints were ordered by Spanish Royal decree to produce this Cob coinage for Spain as they controlled these territories. Spain murdered, raped, and plundered the wealth from the territories from the late 1500s to early 1800s, forced the natives into slavery to mine, produce then mint this coinage to be shipped back to Spain. Spain was brutal back in the early days.
Spain would be put in there place for many years after their financial collapse from greed and wars.
So they quietly made great Sangria for Centuries after.
Until....our Government (YES) our government decided to let them have influence us even in our Coastal waters and now... gives them everything they ask for...much of the "their plundered wealth" from centuries ago lay in our territorial waters...we are beginning to give it back to them. Shame on us...

Lazy Spain now waits for others to find these wrecks, and then trades a bottle of Sangria or a painting to our Government and then we give them back what is the found.

Hope that helps, LMAO

PS. Please post your find? I am sure Spain will not attempt to ask for it back now (but in the not so far future maybe then)
I do love Sangria.

Trez

 

[Mackaydon]

HCW,
Not from Mexico meant only that.
It is from either Spain or another area controlled by Spain.
Don........

 

[HCW]

Thanks guys.......
I did post it on a new thread.