Eurotek Pro modification to fix PinPoint mode
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Thread: Eurotek Pro modification to fix PinPoint mode

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  1. #1

    Jun 2005
    Tecknetics Eurotek Pro
    44
    46 times
    Metal Detecting

    Eurotek Pro modification to fix PinPoint mode

    My Eurotek Pro works great when discriminating, but has a firmware bug in pinpoint mode. It constantly kicks out of pinpoint mode into discriminate mode on almost every target. Some have complained its a bad membrane switch, but I have proven that is not the case. The problem is lack of debounce firmware for the pinpoint button. One can deal with momentary key bounce in firmware or hardware. I added hardware fix and the problem was cured. The fix is to add a .47uf capacitor from the pinpoint switch to ground. This eliminates microsecond make and break contacts being seen by the computer chip causing it to jump out of pinpoint mode.

    Below is a pic shows two pins to connect .47uf capacitor indicated by voltmeter leads. The red lead is on the pinpoint signal on second pin. The black lead is on the ground signal on the fifth pin. Add capacitor underneath pushing capacitor leads up through holes from below, and soldering into place. If you use an electrolytic capacitor make sure its lead polarity is correct.

    Disassembly is easy by removing three screws and slowly removing back panel. Take care you do not pull on flat ribbon cable attaching the two halfs. Remove the battery and one screw is under that, while other two screws are on case back.

    Be aware this will void your warranty. I decided to try fixing this instead of sending it back as I am sure all units have this problem and factory could not repair an engineering design flaw. I've put four hours detecting use on machine since adding fix, and only seen pinpoint problem occur once (probably operator error not holding button down firmly). Its a huge improvement and worth it, IMO.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Next mission, correct the pinpoint fixed full volume firmware bug/feature.
    I shouldn't have to fix engineering problems on a brand new machine that's been in production for three years.
    I should have bought a Whites. Never had a single firmware bug/feature problem with half a dozen Whites models in 20 years.
    Last edited by CC_IN_CA; Apr 02, 2017 at 02:03 PM.
    RustyGold likes this.

  2. #2
    us
    Mar 2016
    SW Oklahoma
    MX Sport Land Ranger Pro ProPointerAT
    83
    120 times
    Metal Detecting
    I relocated the pinpoint button on my Land Ranger Pro which has a similar if not identical board as the Eurotek Pro. I have not had a single issue with my pinpoint button modification.

    LRP mods
    CC_IN_CA likes this.

  3. #3
    us
    Mar 2003
    Oregon & Texas
    Custom Designs and Prototypes
    1,609
    876 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Actually CC, it really is a keypad problem. We've delaminated the keypads and found corrosion problems, the keypad manufacturer has verified the defect. Adding the cap ironically solves this problem, at least if it hasn't gotten too bad.

  4. #4

    Jun 2005
    Tecknetics Eurotek Pro
    44
    46 times
    Metal Detecting
    Nice pinpoint button mod! I thought about adding a DPDT pinpoint switch similar to yours, and would use one throw to drop gain on speaker op-amp by half. I need to reverse engineer that op-amp though. That thing is so loud in pinpoint mode, and you can't turn it down. Speaker vibrates your hand! Second option would be to add a n-channel FET transistor on existing pinpoint switch to activate a resistor dropping speaker op-amp gain. Hopefully I get around to it before the speaker blows!

  5. #5

    Jun 2005
    Tecknetics Eurotek Pro
    44
    46 times
    Metal Detecting
    Quote Originally Posted by Carl-NC View Post
    Actually CC, it really is a keypad problem. We've delaminated the keypads and found corrosion problems, the keypad manufacturer has verified the defect. Adding the cap ironically solves this problem, at least if it hasn't gotten too bad.
    If the firmware handling debounce was robust, you would never see a problem. Problem is thumb rolls on pushbutton as you swing back and forth, and that changes the switch contact area and highly subject to microsecond make/break of switch. Without firmware change or capacitor, normal switch wear would likely cause problem to return. You don't see this problem on any other models out there. They had three years to fix this problem and my machine purchased in March of 2017 had this problem.

  6. #6
    us
    Just Some YouTube Dude

    Feb 2015
    Central California
    Anfibio Multi - T2 Classic - F75+ - G2+....and MANY more tested and reviewed.
    1,240
    1820 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by CC_IN_CA View Post
    Next mission, correct the pinpoint fixed full volume firmware bug/feature.
    I shouldn't have to fix engineering problems on a brand new machine that's been in production for three years.
    I should have bought a Whites. Never had a single firmware bug/feature problem with half a dozen Whites models in 20 years.
    As I posted in the other thread (for others reading this)...the volume on the ETP was made "on purpose" to NOT adjust with the volume. Just because a user does not like something - does not make it an engineering problem. I happen to LOVE the fact it does not decrease volume. See how that works?

    This is the Teknetics forum...not sure why you are talking about a Whites machine. Guess the MX Sport from Whites would have been a better choice for you. Cracked housings...firmware issues...total recall. Sounds like good fun with all the soldering and tinkering you could have done there!

    Quote Originally Posted by CC_IN_CA View Post
    You don't see this problem on any other models out there. They had three years to fix this problem and my machine purchased in March of 2017 had this problem.
    Less than .5% have had issues (.5 not 5.0)...obviously not deserving of a recall or a "fix" when 99.5% have no issues. It's literally not even deserving of a glance from a business standpoint. I have read maybe 20 posts total on 3 separate forums about a PP issue on the LRP or ETP. Sucks for the guys it happens to FOR SURE...but it is not some wide spread issue you are making it out to be because you are bitter. It just does not work that way.

    Rad mod all the same. Sad it could not have just focused on that instead of the agenda to bash Teknetics for what you perceive to be issues...that really aren't.
    Last edited by TheHunterGT; Apr 03, 2017 at 10:25 AM.

  7. #7
    us
    Mar 2016
    SW Oklahoma
    MX Sport Land Ranger Pro ProPointerAT
    83
    120 times
    Metal Detecting
    Let me get this straight... If you have the volume reduced to a comfortable level and hit PP the machine goes to full volume for pinpoint mode? That is just plain silly.
    CC_IN_CA likes this.

  8. #8
    us
    Mar 2003
    Oregon & Texas
    Custom Designs and Prototypes
    1,609
    876 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by CC_IN_CA View Post
    You don't see this problem on any other models out there.
    Yep, we've made a gazillion of various models that don't have this problem, but share the same keypad code. They all have debounce, just not enough to compensate for a defective switch. And while a little more debounce timeout might fix your machine, it might not be enough for another. We've seen keypads where the PP button won't work at all, and more debounce won't solve the problem.

    I'm hoping your freshly bought ETP is actually older stock, I'd sure appreciate it if you email me the serial number so I can check. Also, I can send you a new keypad, for the possibility that one day the cap ain't enough.

    carl@frsttx.com
    RustyGold and DiggerNut like this.

  9. #9
    us
    Just Some YouTube Dude

    Feb 2015
    Central California
    Anfibio Multi - T2 Classic - F75+ - G2+....and MANY more tested and reviewed.
    1,240
    1820 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    @N5XTR According to the smart dudes who made it...supposed to be that way.

    What is silly is making it sound like the ETP is a bad machine because of such a non issue. That and making a minus 1 return rate seem like a bad thing.

    If I sell 10k of something....and 50 to 60 come back. I am LOLing at talk about manufacturing and engineering issues.

    I'm no marketing or engineering guy though...maybe what seems like common sense to me is not. I'll leave it to Carl.
    Last edited by TheHunterGT; Apr 03, 2017 at 10:52 PM.

  10. #10

    Jun 2005
    Tecknetics Eurotek Pro
    44
    46 times
    Metal Detecting
    Quote Originally Posted by Carl-NC View Post
    Yep, we've made a gazillion of various models that don't have this problem, but share the same keypad code. They all have debounce, just not enough to compensate for a defective switch. And while a little more debounce timeout might fix your machine, it might not be enough for another. We've seen keypads where the PP button won't work at all, and more debounce won't solve the problem.

    I'm hoping your freshly bought ETP is actually older stock, I'd sure appreciate it if you email me the serial number so I can check. Also, I can send you a new keypad, for the possibility that one day the cap ain't enough.

    carl@frsttx.com
    Serial number assumes they actually keep track accurately. A better way is pic of my PCB (click on pic 2-3 times to see in full size). Lower left shows version 9 of PCB designed in 2014 and date of 13 16 meaning 13th week of 2016 this PCB was made, then stuffed at a later date. The date code on Microchip 16F1939 is 1628 meaning 28th week of 2016. My Eurotek Pro bought in March 2017 couldn't be more than six months old.

    I'm surprised the microcontroller is a Microchip 16F1939 and has such a fast recovery speed. Its running off internal oscillator at 32mhz max and only 16,000 words of program space (I've written code for many 14F/16F Microchip projects at work). Thought for sure it would have a DSP of some kind.

    Thanks for offer of membrane keypad, but mine is brand new, and probably will sell it and get a Whites eventually.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by CC_IN_CA; Apr 05, 2017 at 11:51 PM.

  11. #11

    Jun 2005
    Tecknetics Eurotek Pro
    44
    46 times
    Metal Detecting
    For anyone interested in my pinpoint mode fix, here is pic of capacitor installed. I recommend a poly capacitor, but used an electrolytic capacitor as I had one laying around. Notice white stripe on capacitor faces right toward ground pin. If you use an electrolytic capacitor make sure white stripe goes to ground pin.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by CC_IN_CA; Apr 05, 2017 at 11:37 PM.
    N5XTR likes this.

  12. #12

    Jun 2005
    Tecknetics Eurotek Pro
    44
    46 times
    Metal Detecting
    Quote Originally Posted by TheHunterGT View Post
    @N5XTR According to the smart dudes who made it...supposed to be that way.

    What is silly is making it sound like the ETP is a bad machine because of such a non issue. That and making a minus 1 return rate seem like a bad thing.

    If I sell 10k of something....and 50 to 60 come back. I am LOLing at talk about manufacturing and engineering issues.

    I'm no marketing or engineering guy though...maybe what seems like common sense to me is not. I'll leave it to Carl.
    I'd like to see a poll on a forum with experienced users. A detector newbie wouldn't have a clue what was going on in pinpoint mode, and you won't hear complaints from those folks and they are most of your sales. An experienced enthusiast (most forum users) will quickly figure out what is going on. On another forum, you counted 30 forum members reporting this failure. Poll forum members and you have a MUCH better idea of the real failure rate. My failure rate was 100%.

    The ETP has the potential to be a great machine, but its firmware is not finished or debugged, IMO. It works great in discriminate mode. IMO, the four firmware issues are; 1) insufficient debounce on pinpoint button, 2) faulty depth reading, 3) failure to include pinpoint volume in volume control, 4) overload signal turns off pinpoint tone.
    Last edited by CC_IN_CA; Apr 06, 2017 at 12:14 AM.

  13. #13

    Jun 2018
    1
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting

    Eurotek Pro fix PinPoint mode

    Quote Originally Posted by Carl-NC View Post
    Yep, we've made a gazillion of various models that don't have this problem, but share the same keypad code. They all have debounce, just not enough to compensate for a defective switch. And while a little more debounce timeout might fix your machine, it might not be enough for another. We've seen keypads where the PP button won't work at all, and more debounce won't solve the problem.

    I'm hoping your freshly bought ETP is actually older stock, I'd sure appreciate it if you email me the serial number so I can check. Also, I can send you a new keypad, for the possibility that one day the cap ain't enough.

    carl@frsttx.com
    Hola Carl,
    Yo tengo el mismo problema con el PinPoint de mi ETP ,por favor me podría enviar un Keypad para sustituirlo,soy de España,gracias por sú atención,saludos.

  14. #14
    us
    Jan 2019
    media, pa
    7
    7 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    I know this is an older thread, but my somewhat older eurotek pro has the same problem, really annoying. I found myself mashing the pinpoint button to get it to work, with obviously no benefit. Sadly the pinpoint was really why i went with this detector vice one of the others out there. I had mine open, its an older board than the one pictured here (2012 i think, going from memory). Likewise i put in a capacitor and the issue appears to have resolved its self now, I can actually use pinpoint without issue. Of course its snow covered outside, so it wont get a real test for a while yet. Thanks much for the guide!
    Loco-Digger likes this.

 

 

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