Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday - UPDATE: Blacksmith Token
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  1. #1
    us
    Sep 2008
    Albany, NY
    White's Vision/White's Matrix M6/Minleab Excalibur
    27

    Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday - UPDATE: Blacksmith Token

    Hello everyone. I've been viewing this forum for quite some time, but this is my first post. Hopefully, I'll have lots more stuff to post in the future!

    Anyway, I found this coin yesterday in upstate NY:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Any ideas what it is? I looked through my red book, and asked a couple of friends, but nobody seems to know what it is. The bust is facing left, and the reverse appears to have a right-facing person with a shield or wheel in the lower left with one straight hand extended to the right, and the other hand bent up to the left at a right angle. My guess is that it's a British coin, but I haven't found anything that comes close to resembling it yet.

    Thanks for looking!

    -Peter

  2. #2

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    Dude, that's a blacksmith token!

    There's several that are very close in my book most being maybe $50 coins. I'll try and match it up.

    http://www.coins.nd.edu/ColCoin/ColC...cksmith.1.html

  3. #3
    PBK
    PBK is offline

    May 2005
    6,380
    235 times

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    Drat! Too late again. Quick and cunning, these Canadians!



  4. #4
    us
    Sep 2008
    Albany, NY
    White's Vision/White's Matrix M6/Minleab Excalibur
    27

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    I've never heard of a backsmith token, and this coin is unlike anything that I've found yet. Very exciting! Do you know of any good sources of info regrading blacksmith tokens, such as age, varieties, values, etc...? I just did a brief search on Google, but didn't find anything useful right off the bat.

    Thanks again,

    Peter

  5. #5
    PBK
    PBK is offline

    May 2005
    6,380
    235 times

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    Quote Originally Posted by pteal
    Do you know of any good sources of info regrading blacksmith tokens, such as age, varieties, values, etc...? I
    Canadian Colonial Tokens - The Charlton Standard Catalogue by W. K. Cross.

    Not sure, but I think the 6th is the most recent edition.


  6. #6
    us
    Sep 2008
    Albany, NY
    White's Vision/White's Matrix M6/Minleab Excalibur
    27

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    Thanks PBK and Iron Patch! I'll check with the members of my club and find out if anyone has that token book. It sells for quite a bit online! The Bank of Canada Currency Museum's website does have several close or perfect matches for my coin. I think the best match is at http://www.currencymuseum.ca/eng/col...0160.02526.000

    Thanks again!

  7. #7

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    Here are some excerpts from "Forgotten Coins of the North American Colonies" by Bruce Kesse and William Anton.

    Blacksmith coppers were mostly produced in the first half of the 19th century, consisting of KGII and KGIII both Brittania and Irish. The were made to look like a copper with a well worn appearance in order to imply previous circulation and facilitate future acceptance. They are of Halfpenny size but are extremely thin and obviously light weight.

    IronPatch, are these found in any numbers in Canada? I know I have read and seen many photos of them, but not being found by detectorists and posted on the forums? (Unless a lot of the blanks found up north are Blacksmiths )

    Don
    "The mantra has always been don't clean a (copper) coin or it will lose value.
    For undug coins this is true. For dug coins this is untrue.
    The value will increase with judicious cleaning."

  8. #8

    Feb 2006
    Minelab Explorer ll
    1,371
    33 times

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    That is a cool find. At first glance I thought it was a King George ll copper 1/2 penny until I compared pictures. That is a great find!
    Holding history in our hands is a treasure in itself.
                             ~Minelab EXll~

  9. #9
    us
    Feb 2005
    Three Rivers
    Minelab Etrac ,Xp Deus, Ctx 3030, Vanquish 440, Equinox 600
    5,628
    2445 times
    Banner Finds (2)
    Honorable Mentions (1)

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday - UPDATE: Blacksmith Token

    Nice old coin with great patina.

    I get back to that area and hunt some more.

    Hh Jer

  10. #10
    us
    Sep 2008
    Albany, NY
    White's Vision/White's Matrix M6/Minleab Excalibur
    27

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday - UPDATE: Blacksmith Token

    Thanks! I found this coin in someone's yard, about 5' from the front steps. The house was on a map that I have from the 1860's, but I doubt that the house is much older than that. I detected the yard with a friend, and aside from about 2 dozen Lincoln cents, all that we found was this coin and a couple of Mercury dimes. This coin was only a couple of inches deep, while some of the more modern coins were found at 6 inches or so. I guess you never know what you'll find!

    The owner offered to let me come back and detect the dirt basement sometime. I've never tried detecting a dirt basement before, so I don't know what to expect. I'll have my small coil ready though!

  11. #11

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    Quote Originally Posted by Don in SJ
    Here are some excerpts from "Forgotten Coins of the North American Colonies" by Bruce Kesse and William Anton.

    Blacksmith coppers were mostly produced in the first half of the 19th century, consisting of KGII and KGIII both Brittania and Irish. The were made to look like a copper with a well worn appearance in order to imply previous circulation and facilitate future acceptance. They are of Halfpenny size but are extremely thin and obviously light weight.

    IronPatch, are these found in any numbers in Canada? I know I have read and seen many photos of them, but not being found by detectorists and posted on the forums? (Unless a lot of the blanks found up north are Blacksmiths )

    Don

    I've only seen them found in Ontario but not in great numbers. Here on the east coast I would consider one a very rare find because neither of the three of us who hunt together have found one, nor have I heard of any one else. It's one of those things on my want list that I'm not sure will ever happen.

  12. #12

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Patch



    I've only seen them found in Ontario but not in great numbers. Here on the east coast I would consider one a very rare find because neither of the three of us who hunt together have found one, nor have I heard of any one else. It's one of those things on my want list that I'm not sure will ever happen.
    OK, I thought I have not seen them being found and posted. I checked some previous C4 auction catalogs and evidently the demand by collectors is not there, I saw perhaps 10 or so listed and prices were not too great, and Im sure most were not ground founds. ($20-$50 with one or two a bit more)

    Not being too familar with Blacksmiths, I was wondering if this one is more like an Evasion, since the shield is on the wrong side, but I thought I read that some Blacksmiths were considered Evasions.

    Don

    "The mantra has always been don't clean a (copper) coin or it will lose value.
    For undug coins this is true. For dug coins this is untrue.
    The value will increase with judicious cleaning."

  13. #13
    us
    Aug 2008
    White's DFX
    476
    56 times
    Honorable Mentions (1)

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday - UPDATE: Blacksmith Token

    what a great find!! congrats and welcome to this fun forum!! hope to see lots more good stuff posted by you!

  14. #14
    us
    Sep 2008
    Albany, NY
    White's Vision/White's Matrix M6/Minleab Excalibur
    27

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday - UPDATE: Blacksmith Token

    I really didn't expect to find anything like this in the yard that I detected, so even if it's not worth much, I'm very happy. This is my first year detecting where I've actually found good stuff. I found my first 1800's coin in April and I've found lots of different old coins since. A month ago I found my first 1700's coin - a 1798 large cent (in horrible shape), and I was hoping that I'd be able to read a 1700's date off this coin, but it sounds like there may never have been a date on it to begin with if they made them to look worn and circulated.

    The snow has been flying here in Albany, and I may not have another opportunity to get back out around here this year. I'll post pictures of my other finds, and maybe it will help make the winter go by faster!

    Next week I'm headed on a cruise to the Bahamas, and I'm bringing my detector, so hopefully I'll have more to show when I get back.

    Thanks again!

  15. #15

    Re: Old (British?) Coin Found Yesterday

    Quote Originally Posted by Don in SJ
    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Patch



    I've only seen them found in Ontario but not in great numbers. Here on the east coast I would consider one a very rare find because neither of the three of us who hunt together have found one, nor have I heard of any one else. It's one of those things on my want list that I'm not sure will ever happen.
    OK, I thought I have not seen them being found and posted. I checked some previous C4 auction catalogs and evidently the demand by collectors is not there, I saw perhaps 10 or so listed and prices were not too great, and Im sure most were not ground founds. ($20-$50 with one or two a bit more)

    Not being too familar with Blacksmiths, I was wondering if this one is more like an Evasion, since the shield is on the wrong side, but I thought I read that some Blacksmiths were considered Evasions.

    Don



    I would classify them as evasions but not sure where they fall in for the experts. It was probably all common ones you seen for sale, some are rare enough to go in the thousands. It's just like anything else, you don't see the big boys show up to play unless something substantial turns up.

 

 
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