are school yards private property

[G.I.B.]

Public school property are for the public to use. Go after hours and week-ends.

Sure, park your RV in the staff parking lot and plug into the school.

 

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[Tom_in_CA]

Sure, park your RV in the staff parking lot and plug into the school.

Some activities (like shooting hoops, jogging the track, md'ing, etc...) are on the level of "innocuous". However, to camp out in their lot (hence "overnight camping"), and plugging into their electrical outlet (hence taking electricity) do not seem "innocuous".

I guess it all boils down to how you define md'ing. I happen to think md'ing is innocuous. Hence not applicable to your comparison

 

[G.I.B.]

But...but...but.....

It's PUBLIC PROPERTY and therefore open to public use.

So you are saying there are some rules? Oh how will we ever know what innocuous means then?

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... So you are saying there are some rules? Oh how will we ever know what innocuous means then?

Sure there's rules. And if one says "no md'ing", then by all mean don't detect.

As for your 2nd question, the solution to finding out if our action needs their say-so (whether or not it is innocuous) is simple: We simply go to the school board & ask them: "Hi, can I dig holes in the school yard for my own fun and profit ? " Afterall, you don't want to "mince words" eh ? Or be "less than forthcoming". They need to understand the full implications of the question. Lest you be getting permission under false pretenses.

Then if they say "yes", you put a "search and salvage contract" in front of them to sign. Afterall, you can't be "too safe", right ? And if an underling were to accost you, you'd need that signed permission to show them. The school, upon seeing the contract you give them, will be more than happy to put it past their legal department and sign. Problem solved, and then no need to be "looking over your shoulders".

 

[Swaveab]

Out of curiosity, if the only part of the school grounds is the fenced off ball field with no trespassing signs, does that include the rest of the grounds that is not fenced and no signs posted? I know, on the safe side of things is to ask permission.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... does that include the rest of the grounds that is not fenced and no signs posted? I know, on the safe side of things is to ask permission.

The only safe way to know, is to ask desk- bound pencil pushers (who perhaps would never have given the matter a moment's thought). Be sure to pepper the question with terms like "dig" and "holes" and "liability" and "indian bone" (lest they not understand the full implications of your question).

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

In the state of Florida like most states it is private property, school grounds are owned by the local school boards and permission is required to legally hunt.

January 20, 2017 A New Beginning!

 

[Honest Samuel]

In Connecticut, no permit nor permission is needed after hours and week-ends. Good hunting and good luck.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

In Connecticut, no permit nor permission is needed after hours and week-ends. Good hunting and good luck.

I bet that I could find some school official in Connecticut to say otherwise.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

I'm as ballsy as they come. Probably lacking any caution level and common sense when it comes to where I'll detect. And I am fascinated (to a bee-in-the-bonnet fault) by the psychology of the way md'rs think and approach md'ing legality issues. HOWEVER, I still can not go so far as to try to say that "no trespassing" is a subjective command. Ie.: "up for interpretation" . It seems pretty cut and dried. And .... I don't think your way to surmounting the semantics of it will fly.

That's not to say that some of us wouldn't consider a sign at a school lawn to be "nothing more than obligatory". And/or that the sign is there just to shoo away perverts or to protect from lawsuits when you slip on a banana peel. But that's different than saying that "no trespassing" doesn't mean "no trespassing". Sort of like 55mph MEANS 55mph. (That's why none of us ever went/go over 55 mph btw.)

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Yeah yeah, but this IS a family friendly forum.



I lost ya there bro.: In order for us to "detect" a spot, you have to physically be present there. Right ? And to be "present there" would ... by definition .... be trespassing. So in that case, how can detecting NOT be trespassing ?


So by this are you saying that upon the pronouncement of an edict upon the md'r ( that he is "trespassing"), is ONLY trespassing when griped at by authority ? Such that if you're not told "scram", well presto, you weren't trespassing ? Sort of like a tree falling in the woods didn't make a sound, because no one was there who heard it, eh ?

In which case, we're back to "family friendly" forum guidelines. Example: Like saying it's ok to go 56 in a 55 zone. So you can't bend the technical point. Don't get around it by saying "that's not really what it means". Then later, if someone realizes he'll likely never get a ticket when going 56 (when others around him are going 70), that's up to his conscience and realization. But at no time was the speed limit ever NOT 55 mph.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

On the same vain, I heard a story from an old time southern CA md'r. Told me that back in the 1970s, all the school yards down there were not fenced. Hence any/all school yards were sort of a defacto "park", where anyone could go jog the track, shoot hoops, fly a kite, or whatever.

But then in the late 1970s or very early 1980s, the following occurred: A young married couple had brought their toddler kid (still at diaper age, what age that still is) to the slides and swings at a school. They pushed their kid down the slide, and the kid fell off the side of the slide. Was grievously injured (paralyzed or whatever). The parents sued the school district AND WON ! I guess it's never the responsibility of parents to use a little common sense to know that a kid at diaper age is too young to be being pushed down slides, eh ? The school district lost, and had to pay out a big judgement award.

So guess what happened next ? YOU GUESSED IT : All the schools, all over southern CA, started getting fences and signs. So ask yourself: What is the purpose of the fences and signs ? Does anyone think they ever cared about those flying a kite, jogging the track, or md'ing ? OF COURSE NOT. The reason was: So that if some numbskull slips on a banana peel, they can't sue the school. The school can merely point to the sign and say "you shouldn't have been there".

 

[Tom_in_CA]

I firmly stand behind my semantics that prohibitions on alter & deface haven't occurred , if the md'r leaves no trace (hence not alterED or defacED). However, I can't buy the odd line of reasoning you're trying to advance here, when it comes to distinctions of "do not enter" vs "no trespassing" vs whether or not md'ing is bound by those commands. It will just never fly, and makes no sense.

 

[stephen583]

Although metal detecting may be fun and all.. I have a simple suggestion here. When it's raining, or snowing, people drop plenty of coins and paper money in parking lots reaching for their car keys. No body likes crawling under a car when its' wet to grab a dropped bill, nor have I ever seen anyone dig in the snow for dropped coins. Instead of metal detecting and digging in dirt.. just wait for it to stop raining, or snowing and go out and pick up the dropped money.

I used to sweep store parking lots at night with a truck, and I always made sure after a hard rain, or snow storm to check the curb and grass line on the downwind side of the parking lot. I only did five stores a night, and my best night during Christmas week was around eighty bucks FREE money.

The storm drain grates in front of bar rooms are another great place to look for LOST money ! If you are worried about being harassed by the cops, or business owners, just put on a yellow safety vest and a white construction helmet (which you'll find pretty inexpensive in a second hand store).. It's a lot cheaper than a metal detector anyway.

Hope these tips will increase the profitability of your detecting. Good Luck.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

....I used to sweep store parking lots at night with a truck....

Hey there Stephen, welcome to T'net. I own a street sweeper company. And for many years, we had shopping center routes with the truck-mounted vacuum sweepers. We now strictly do construction, paving, and municipal type sweeping. But back in the days when we did shopping centers (1980s and '90s), I used to routinely find coins and bills on the lots. When 100 cars pull out of a crowded parking lot, .... yes .... there's no telling what's left behind. And yes, we learned the trick of figuring out the cycle fences where light weight papers blew up to, to check for currency.

The eagle eyes developed in the hobby helped to train my eyes to find the stuff, and it would drive my co-workers crazy that I'd find a gold ring or a $10 bill or whatever, and .... try as they may .... they didn't find stuff

However, it would only be worth someone's time if that's there job all night, to be waltzing about these places. And also: it's a far cry from the hobby of md'ing, as you'll never find old coins that way

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Now you're entering into an entirely different arena of justifying our hobby there. It's not the arena of "is it trespassing or not?". But rather: It's the arena of "does anyone really care or not?".

Because in your example, the person shooting hoops is technically "trespassing". Sure, maybe no one cares. Sure maybe no one tells him to leave. Sure, he could never get a "ticket" for such a silly thing. Sure. But that lack-of-enforcement doesn't mean it's not still trespassing. I too go by the "does anyone really care?" test of things (just like the person shooting hoops subconsciously used). But you can't say that on a family friendly forum. Thus, .... I'll deny I just said that

 

[SeabeeRon]

, I think you and Tom are more on the same page than you may realize! Tom enjoys taking the "Devil's Point of View" or "Devil's Advocate" to promote discussion and debate.

 

[RVRoamer73]

i officially un-read this thread......

 

[cudamark]

Although metal detecting may be fun and all.. I have a simple suggestion here. When it's raining, or snowing, people drop plenty of coins and paper money in parking lots reaching for their car keys. No body likes crawling under a car when its' wet to grab a dropped bill, nor have I ever seen anyone dig in the snow for dropped coins. Instead of metal detecting and digging in dirt.. just wait for it to stop raining, or snowing and go out and pick up the dropped money.

I used to sweep store parking lots at night with a truck, and I always made sure after a hard rain, or snow storm to check the curb and grass line on the downwind side of the parking lot. I only did five stores a night, and my best night during Christmas week was around eighty bucks FREE money.

The storm drain grates in front of bar rooms are another great place to look for LOST money ! If you are worried about being harassed by the cops, or business owners, just put on a yellow safety vest and a white construction helmet (which you'll find pretty inexpensive in a second hand store).. It's a lot cheaper than a metal detector anyway.

Hope these tips will increase the profitability of your detecting. Good Luck.

I guess if you're after modern coins and currency, that might not be a bad plan. Personally, I don't get jazzed about looking/detecting for modern money. If that was what I was wanting to do, I'd come out of retirement and get a job.

 

[Honest Samuel]

Unless there are signs anywhere, I go detecting.