Treasure hunters and Lawyers..........

[GMD52]

Came across this quote by Pritt Vesilind, in a NatGeo publication on Treasure:
"Treasure Hunting has always attracted dreamers, rogues,and men of irrational optimism. Have lawyers robbed modern Treasure Hunters of their swashbuckler?

Where do you stand on this statement?

 

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[lostcauses]

"Where do you stand on this statement?"

A Judge would say "ignorance of the law is no excuse"

The laws involving treasure go a long long way back. The childish idea of finders keepers, losers weepers does not work.

Know the law.
If you are going to chance it, in breaking it: be ready to do the time, and costs of such actions.

 

[Gold Maven]

tight lipped keepers,
are never weepers.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Came across this quote by Pritt Vesilind, in a NatGeo publication on Treasure:
"Treasure Hunting has always attracted dreamers, rogues,and men of irrational optimism. Have lawyers robbed modern Treasure Hunters of their swashbuckler?

Where do you stand on this statement?

gmd-52, you don't end your quotation marks, so I'm not sure where the quotation ends. But I'm assuming at the end of that paragraph after "swashbuckler" ?

No, lawyers haven't robbed men of their desire to seek treasure. They just learn to shut up, be a ... uh ... little discreet, and still treasure hunt. Unless of course you're one of those who on various forum when posts-come-up about supposed legalites, laws, rules, etc... who thinks the best thing to do, in those cases, is go ask lawyers and bureucrats "can I?". To THOSE people, yes, lawyers have "robbed" them.

 

[GMD52]

Tom,
No I am not one who runs to lawyers, Theynmay prove necessary in regards to property closings and estates, but would rather not deal with them.
My main question was whether they are interjecting themselves into the treasure world, as they do the personal injury world.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

reply

My main question was whether they are interjecting themselves into the treasure world, as they do the personal injury world.

Well, they're no different than any person in any business: Of COURSE we all want our chosen profession to prosper, and have a steady stream of business flow. I mean, duh, why else does one work, or choose a profession. To sit on his laurels and hope no work comes in? Of course they want work. I don't fault them for rushing to the aid of the state-of-Florida, or to any other claimant's aid. And ... sure ... there's some that may not have much "scruples", but so too is there people w/o scruples in any line or profession.

The woes we md'rs face isn't because of lawyers, if that's what your question is aiming to know. IMHO.

 

[cudamark]

It's hard to tell if lawyers have caused our problems or just contributed to them. It's kinda like the chicken and egg debate. Did a lawsuit cause new laws to be passed or was the law enacted first and lawyers then exploited them? The problems is, most of our politicians are lawyers so getting sensible and concise laws passed is not likely. They have too much vested interest in keeping them vague and confusing. Who among us would not like to find a real treasure cache? I doubt there are many of us who would want to go through the the legal hassles that Mel Fisher went through to get one though.

 

[Bum Luck]

Came across this quote by Pritt Vesilind, in a NatGeo publication on Treasure:
"Treasure Hunting has always attracted dreamers, rogues,and men of irrational optimism.

Well, which one are you?

 

[Jason in Enid]

The problem has nothing to do with laws. The problem is one of greed. When you find something of great value there are many hands who feel they are owed some or all of it. They get lwayers to take it from you, you get lawyers to try to keep it. The lawyers postone, and drag heels so cases go on for years, until THEY have all the treasure all you have is an empty bag and lots more grey hair.

 

[doc-d]

Lawyers are a problem today, but they are a symptom of a rot that extends completely through every level of government............the judicial system is demonic.........and to the extent MD has changed in the years, it is a reflection of larger changes in society.......

 

[cudamark]

The problem has nothing to do with laws. The problem is one of greed. When you find something of great value there are many hands who feel they are owed some or all of it. They get lwayers to take it from you, you get lawyers to try to keep it. The lawyers postone, and drag heels so cases go on for years, until THEY have all the treasure all you have is an empty bag and lots more grey hair.

The laws ARE the problem if they allow lawyers and judges to interpret them to their own benefit. If the law was concise and clear cut, and the loser had to pay all court costs, there would be a lot less suing going on.

 

[Bum Luck]

Lawyers are a problem today, but they are a symptom of a rot that extends completely through every level of government............the judicial system is demonic.........and to the extent MD has changed in the years, it is a reflection of larger changes in society.......

It's not just the judicial system; it's the other levels of government too. We have 2 choices before us to take back the government peaceably or violently. I really believe that peaceably is the only way - the other will lead to the end of Freedom, forever.

First, we have to be smart enough to figure out who our friends and enemies are, and I don't see a lot of that enlightenment. There's a long way to go, and not much time to get smart.

 

[cudamark]

We can start by educating our children in the home about these things....goodness knows the government run schools won't.

 

[GMD52]

Bum Luck,

Sorry it's taken a couple days to answer, but I would consider myself a roque, and irrational optimist. But it can go with the wind. If you don't think that you will be successful at some point in time, I wonder how long you would stick to any activity. I have a low threshold for success, and view my activity much differently than others. As long as I am satisfied, and not encumbered in any way, I am happy.

 

[pennyfarmer]

"Where do you stand on this statement?"

A Judge would say "ignorance of the law is no excuse"

The laws involving treasure go a long long way back. The childish idea of finders keepers, losers weepers does not work.

Know the law.
If you are going to chance it, in breaking it: be ready to do the time, and costs of such actions.

Its why I usually hunt with partners. If I am going to jail I want to know someone there. LOL

 

[augoldminer]

I operate under the 1872 mining law and anything no covered under it i don't talk about.

 

[Edward1976]

Personally I've never had a problem with a lawyer standing in my way of metal detecting, so I'm not sure what you're talking about. If you're talking about laws, generally they're there for a good reason, as in don't go digging up Gettysburg next weekend. What gets me pissed is when the powers that be say you can't detect on private property even if you have permission. It's not a left or right thing, people have been going after detectorists since the days of Kip Wagner. Unfortunately America is a country where riding a bicycle as an adult or growing your own vegetables is seen as a somewhat socially rebellious thing to do, detecting being socially different, not your typical hobby, and we also have the "old guy in black socks and sandals" image to deal with, which makes us easy targets. On the flip side, there are a lot of other hobbies that are under fire to some degree, RC planes, poker, homemade hot air balloons (my other vice), photography, sport shooting, so don't feel bad, you're not alone.

 

[coinbug]

Lawyers are a treasure hunter's friend.

Mel Fisher would've lost the Atocha treasure absent the hard work of his.

Don't conflate "lawyers" with the governments that would cheerfully use the law steal your finds.

 

[UnrepentantSinner]

I think without dreamers, rogues,and men of irrational optimism we would never have had the USA....and lawyers aren't only robbing us, they are ruining this country along with the judges that go along with their particular line of BS.

 

[leviathanrick]

I believe that lawyers are the result of the problem not the cause. The Atocha sat on the bottom of the ocean for hundreds of years and nobody cared until Mel Fisher found it. All of a sudden everyone wants a piece of the action. Everyone forgot that Mel spent 17 years searching and lost family members in the process. One dreamer finally has success and everyone feels entitled to a cut. Florida tried to shake him down and if it were not for lawyers they would have been successful. No laws should be passed that deny any treasure finds in the ocean from the finders. They should belong to those who do the work and make the discovery. I am not against sensible laws that would protect treasure hunters from destroying the environment when they remove their finds. Md'ers should be able to search any public park provided they say off of manicured sports fields and leave they area as they found it. If we remain responsible to our hobby we will meet less resistance.