Running a scam, "this junk about obeying the code of ethics". Please tell me you are not from West Central Illinois. I don't want you around anywhere I hunt. I have a good reputation and sure the heck don't need you messing it up for me.junkmetal said:Tokomo,
I would think twice about make a big deal out of this, the last thing you want is a renegade cop (out to get you) on your hands!
Next time run the scam I told you about, it really does out great on cops. Infact, its saved my but from going to jail more than onceand this junk about obeying the code of ethics, well the code of ethics should be bent a little just like that cop should have bent the law.
Think about it!
$100 Citation and almost 10 cents!
- Thread starter Tokomo
- Start date
Monty
Gold Member
- Jan 26, 2005
- 10,746
- 166
- Detector(s) used
- ACE 250, Garrett
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
I'm a retired cop and I can see both sides of the coin. I also know a lot about criminal law and courts. If you decide to fight it, go back and take some pictures of places where squirrels are digging holes and not covering them up. Address the intent of the law. If the intent of the law is to protect the turf, then it is not working as the squirrels do much more damage than someone MDing. Ditto folks who don't remove their dog poop. You might not win the case but you might open some eyes as to what an idiotic law it is. If you think you were wronged by the ordinance then be willing to challenge it . If not, just pay your fine and mark it up to experience and go somewhere else to hunt. I'm no different than anyone else I don't like stupid laws and I sure didn't relish enforcing them. Through our police lodge we had a legislative committee and they/we did a lot to get dumb or worthless laws taken off the books as well as getting those passed that did make a difference. Monty
Tokomo
Jr. Member
- Thread starter
- #43
Very good advice from most of you. Thank you very much! I hope to show them that MDers have a place, and a voice in this city too.
Some of you seem to think I posted this to cry about getting slapped on the wrist. You have obviously missed the point entirely. Standing up for yourself and what you believe in is hardly a task for crybabies. Standing boldly in the face of the vast, and mighty army of preposterous government law enforcers is something reserved only for the strong. If a ridiculous law goes unchallenged by the masses of lemmings that just "Pay the fine and move on, stop whining" (SWR) then nothing will be changed. I have plenty of respect for the hard working officers that punish criminals for committing crimes.
If you sit back and watch the world go by from your arm chair and never question authority then you may loose complete control over the few rights you do have.
Some of you seem to think I posted this to cry about getting slapped on the wrist. You have obviously missed the point entirely. Standing up for yourself and what you believe in is hardly a task for crybabies. Standing boldly in the face of the vast, and mighty army of preposterous government law enforcers is something reserved only for the strong. If a ridiculous law goes unchallenged by the masses of lemmings that just "Pay the fine and move on, stop whining" (SWR) then nothing will be changed. I have plenty of respect for the hard working officers that punish criminals for committing crimes.
If you sit back and watch the world go by from your arm chair and never question authority then you may loose complete control over the few rights you do have.
I agree with what Monty said, if you decide to contest the charges I would like to suggest the following: in addition take photos of the spots where you dug. If you still have the trash from this spot, use it to it's advantage in your presentation.
As far as digging goes, (depending on the wording of the ord #) look for damaged property that has been obviously neglected (it is not a defense that the parks dept fails to fix things, but it will assist your presentation). Also take a copy of the Code of Ethics MD'ers follow. Photo's of squirrels in the process of digging and their little mess would be a 100% in your favor.
The grass might turn brown on the cut edges (find a reputable and respected lawn care business have them write a general report on this to confirm for your locale), but it will recover as long as you cut a horseshoe and not a plug. I have cut the sod on well kept lawns and went back 1 month later, there was no evidence I had been there (I MD my own lawn regularly - the wife has not called the cops...yet. She deeply values the lawn, that is why I let her mow it. 
but thats an different topic altogether.)
There are laws out there that cops enforce and laws that cops don't. They know the stupid ones. I guess a butt chewing would have been better than what you received (sounds like someone complained and this cop had to keep someone happy. in my opinion.)
Keep us updated plz.
As far as digging goes, (depending on the wording of the ord #) look for damaged property that has been obviously neglected (it is not a defense that the parks dept fails to fix things, but it will assist your presentation). Also take a copy of the Code of Ethics MD'ers follow. Photo's of squirrels in the process of digging and their little mess would be a 100% in your favor.
The grass might turn brown on the cut edges (find a reputable and respected lawn care business have them write a general report on this to confirm for your locale), but it will recover as long as you cut a horseshoe and not a plug. I have cut the sod on well kept lawns and went back 1 month later, there was no evidence I had been there (I MD my own lawn regularly - the wife has not called the cops...yet
. She deeply values the lawn, that is why I let her mow it. but thats an different topic altogether.)There are laws out there that cops enforce and laws that cops don't. They know the stupid ones. I guess a butt chewing would have been better than what you received (sounds like someone complained and this cop had to keep someone happy. in my opinion.)
Keep us updated plz.
MD Dog
Bronze Member
Scots Gaelic said:My favorite answere the question "wat'cha do'in?" is - I am locating explosives, could you just step back a little to the left?
Sorry this had me laughing so hard my eyes were too watery to read alot of the following posts. But I'd agree with fighting this as hard as possible, you have really nothing to lose and everything to gain !Tokomo
Jr. Member
- Thread starter
- #46
We are making some good progress!
Today we actually got permission to Metal Detect on any Park District property from the Director of the Naperville Park District. He also let us know that there is an ordinance against removing anything from the property, but we all know about this one. Anyhow he said they have allowed MDing in the past and sent me an email stating that we could.
I have the court date coming up about the fine so I will keep you informed on how we do in front of the Judge!
Today we actually got permission to Metal Detect on any Park District property from the Director of the Naperville Park District. He also let us know that there is an ordinance against removing anything from the property, but we all know about this one. Anyhow he said they have allowed MDing in the past and sent me an email stating that we could.
I have the court date coming up about the fine so I will keep you informed on how we do in front of the Judge!
S
Scots Gaelic
Guest
Just a suggestion, but you may want to print that email in case any more law enforcement officers come around 
Tokomo said:
Around here the first trip to courthouse is to make a plea, guilty or not guilty. They don't want to hear anything else. If one pleas not guilty, a trial is set and then the citing officer will appear.
At this point they just might just your case out (I think you have good chance), and not here anything you have to say. Sucks, but that’s how it works. Some courts offer other options like telephone or mail court.
HH
nc-joe
Hero Member
Do what I am doing, go to the Local Governing body and attempt to get the wording in the regulation changed to allow metal detecting. The worst that can happen is the law does not change. Do go in there blasting with both barrels either. Prepare a presentation, be informative, many have no idea how little of an impact MDing, when done correctly, has on the ground.
What you will also find is that MDing was NOT the intent of the law. And many members either are, or where at one time, fascinated by MDing and treasure hunting and will tell you some great stories, and may lead you to some great sites!
If you challenge your ticket in court, just present the facts and question the intent of the law, but try to go the proper channels to get things changed.
I know your area somewhat. Even though I live in NC now, I was born in Lombard and grew up in Crystal Lake. I still have may distant family members all over the greater metro area. There is a lot of history there.
Good luck in your venture, and PLEASE, EVERYONE, CHECK YOUR LOCAL LAWS BEFORE YOU DIG. If there is an issue, address it properly, you are representing the entire hobby, and how you conduct yourself effects all of us.
What you will also find is that MDing was NOT the intent of the law. And many members either are, or where at one time, fascinated by MDing and treasure hunting and will tell you some great stories, and may lead you to some great sites!
If you challenge your ticket in court, just present the facts and question the intent of the law, but try to go the proper channels to get things changed.
I know your area somewhat. Even though I live in NC now, I was born in Lombard and grew up in Crystal Lake. I still have may distant family members all over the greater metro area. There is a lot of history there.
Good luck in your venture, and PLEASE, EVERYONE, CHECK YOUR LOCAL LAWS BEFORE YOU DIG. If there is an issue, address it properly, you are representing the entire hobby, and how you conduct yourself effects all of us.
txkickergirl
Silver Member
- Jan 4, 2007
- 2,782
- 25
- Detector(s) used
- SOV, EXCAL, CZ20, & more
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
I would go in person to pay my fine and pay it all in loose change. If they say anything tell them that you know they were just doing there job, but they don't want to know how many hours it took you to go out and find that much change to pay the fine in legal places to hunt...
Just Kidding!
Sorry about the fine and you should of checked the laws.
Just Kidding!
Sorry about the fine and you should of checked the laws.
BLACKFOOT
Full Member
MAKE A LIST STARTING WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT COMING DOWN TO YOUR LOCAL CITY POLICE AN SEE JUST HOW MANY AGENCYS THERE ARE TO MAKE YOU TOE THEIR LINE. there are so many you will not name them all on the first try!!!!SORRY YOU HAD TO LEARN THE HARD WAY.MOST PEOPLE BREAK SOME LAW EVERY DAY WITH OUT KNOWING IT.
borninok
Bronze Member
junkmetal said:
Better than this.......tell them that you lost YOUR wedding band while you were there with another woman, and that you have got to find it before your wife asks where your wedding band is. Unless the cop is heartless, it is always worth a try!
borninok said:junkmetal said:
Better than this.......tell them that you lost YOUR wedding band while you were there with another woman, and that you have got to find it before your wife asks where your wedding band is. Unless the cop is heartless, it is always worth a try!
Now that is a good one. Bad thing is most of the officers in the area know me, by the time I got home the Mrs would be on the front step with shotgun in hand.
Ocaliman
Full Member
- Apr 21, 2006
- 118
- 15
- Detector(s) used
- Minelab Excalibur 1000
- Primary Interest:
- Beach & Shallow Water Hunting
Re: Sorry to hear that...
The village of DeWitt, in DeWitt county, IL (Central Illinois) has a park in the center of town that has "No Digging" signs posted everywhere, or at least they did when I was a kid. I remember salivating over the thought of all the booty that was buried under the sod in that park when I was younger and just starting out in the hobby...
GL & HH
Jack(IN) said:
The village of DeWitt, in DeWitt county, IL (Central Illinois) has a park in the center of town that has "No Digging" signs posted everywhere, or at least they did when I was a kid. I remember salivating over the thought of all the booty that was buried under the sod in that park when I was younger and just starting out in the hobby...
GL & HH
Illinois Jeff
Full Member
- Feb 12, 2006
- 113
- 11
- Detector(s) used
- XLT
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
I wonder if that cop was around to issue "littering tickets" to those leaving the garbage on the ground in the first place!!!
I think you ran into a cop that was an A-hole. Most cops arent like that, my best friend is a cop. And the whole thing that they dont write the laws but have to enforce them is only partially correct. Cops pick and choose whether or not to cite you, its left up to the police discretion. It seems so trivial to ticket someone for that, probably didnt get his donut for the day.
Monty
Gold Member
- Jan 26, 2005
- 10,746
- 166
- Detector(s) used
- ACE 250, Garrett
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
Contrary to what I have been reading, it is not always up to the cop to write a citation or not. In most jurisdictions an officer has to turn in a log sheet or worksheet at the end of his/her shift accounting for your activities. If you make a contact (see a misdemeanor being committed) some jurisdictions require that a citation be issued and if not you get into a lot of hot water. If you fail to log it you are also in hot water if anything comes up later.
I have thought long and hard about even responding further to this subject, but you know me, can't keep my big mouth shut.
I just wonder what the heck is the matter with some of you guys? Who would want to live in a town where a police department got to decide which laws they wanted to enforce and just ignored the others? Ok, so why didn't he go and catch real crooks instead of issueing the citations? I hear that all the time and frankly it's a stupid remark. Anyone who would say that hasn't a clue about crime, the police or society in general. Do you have any idea how many serious felonies are solved from enforcing misdemeanor laws? I do. Probably many more time that than those from true assigned investigations! Who do you think makes all the really big drug busts? Traffic cops that's who. Check your newspapers. Every day some traffic stop nets thousands of grams of cocaine or heroin or whatever the drug of choice is at the time. What do you think is the greatest cause of violent deaths and loss of property? Traffic accidents! Even with strict enforcement about 55,000 souls, men women and children die each year on our highways, usually caused by excessive speed. Can you imagine what it would be if there was no citations issued or no enforcement at all? I do. It would be in the millions! More people are killed and/or mangled in one year on our highways than from the entire span of the war in VietNam, and we as a society couldn't live with the war in 'Nam! The property loss is in the multimillions, several times over what is lost in thefts. (But that was 20 years ago. It's probably in the billions of dollars now). Quotas? I never had a quota and I didn't ever talk to a cop from another city that did. True, there are some speed traps usually located in small towns where they depend on traffic fines for the city finances. I don't condone that at all. That is wrong. My state recently passed a law to curtail speed traps. Quotas in real police departments? Never. But if you were an officer and went 8 hours without seeing even one traffic violation you were either lieing or asleep, or both!! Who wants that kind of officer "protecting" you or your family? I know. Noone!
Donuts? Well, you got me there!
I do/ did like donuts. Coffee too. That's probably why I have stents in my arteries now! Truth of the matter is that when I was a rookie cop if it hadn't been for "Mr. Donut" or some other such franchise I would have had to go without eating the entire shift as I got paid so poorly. $250.00 a month before deductions didn't go far even in '60s dollars. I lived on that and TV dinners for the best part of 3 years before we got even a token raise. My first raise put me into a higher income tax bracket and my net takehome pay was reduced by $3.00 a month! And that was touted by the politicians as the biggest pay raise in police history! We couldn't keep an officer long enough to make him a "good" officer. And yes, it was my choice. I could have made much more money in some other occupation all those years. But I felt a moral obligation to stay after seeing some of the things I saw, especially when children were involved. So I am not crying or asking for sympathy, rather asking for a little less harsh judgement from you the critics. And I ask not for me but for the guys and gals still in that line of work. Yes some of them are on a power trip, some of them are not sincere and worse of all some are down right crooked. But that happens in all professions and in police work you don't last long or wind up in prison for crossing the line.
Well, I've vented and sorry if I offended. Please don't take it personal, it wasn't meant to be hurtful and for that I apologize. And for the guys who got the citation for metal detecting, I'm sorry that happend and this is not directed at you personally. The end. M
nty
I have thought long and hard about even responding further to this subject, but you know me, can't keep my big mouth shut.
I just wonder what the heck is the matter with some of you guys? Who would want to live in a town where a police department got to decide which laws they wanted to enforce and just ignored the others? Ok, so why didn't he go and catch real crooks instead of issueing the citations? I hear that all the time and frankly it's a stupid remark. Anyone who would say that hasn't a clue about crime, the police or society in general. Do you have any idea how many serious felonies are solved from enforcing misdemeanor laws? I do. Probably many more time that than those from true assigned investigations! Who do you think makes all the really big drug busts? Traffic cops that's who. Check your newspapers. Every day some traffic stop nets thousands of grams of cocaine or heroin or whatever the drug of choice is at the time. What do you think is the greatest cause of violent deaths and loss of property? Traffic accidents! Even with strict enforcement about 55,000 souls, men women and children die each year on our highways, usually caused by excessive speed. Can you imagine what it would be if there was no citations issued or no enforcement at all? I do. It would be in the millions! More people are killed and/or mangled in one year on our highways than from the entire span of the war in VietNam, and we as a society couldn't live with the war in 'Nam! The property loss is in the multimillions, several times over what is lost in thefts. (But that was 20 years ago. It's probably in the billions of dollars now). Quotas? I never had a quota and I didn't ever talk to a cop from another city that did. True, there are some speed traps usually located in small towns where they depend on traffic fines for the city finances. I don't condone that at all. That is wrong. My state recently passed a law to curtail speed traps. Quotas in real police departments? Never. But if you were an officer and went 8 hours without seeing even one traffic violation you were either lieing or asleep, or both!! Who wants that kind of officer "protecting" you or your family? I know. Noone!
Donuts? Well, you got me there!
I do/ did like donuts. Coffee too. That's probably why I have stents in my arteries now! Truth of the matter is that when I was a rookie cop if it hadn't been for "Mr. Donut" or some other such franchise I would have had to go without eating the entire shift as I got paid so poorly. $250.00 a month before deductions didn't go far even in '60s dollars. I lived on that and TV dinners for the best part of 3 years before we got even a token raise. My first raise put me into a higher income tax bracket and my net takehome pay was reduced by $3.00 a month! And that was touted by the politicians as the biggest pay raise in police history! We couldn't keep an officer long enough to make him a "good" officer. And yes, it was my choice. I could have made much more money in some other occupation all those years. But I felt a moral obligation to stay after seeing some of the things I saw, especially when children were involved. So I am not crying or asking for sympathy, rather asking for a little less harsh judgement from you the critics. And I ask not for me but for the guys and gals still in that line of work. Yes some of them are on a power trip, some of them are not sincere and worse of all some are down right crooked. But that happens in all professions and in police work you don't last long or wind up in prison for crossing the line. Well, I've vented and sorry if I offended. Please don't take it personal, it wasn't meant to be hurtful and for that I apologize. And for the guys who got the citation for metal detecting, I'm sorry that happend and this is not directed at you personally. The end. M
nty
olegoat
Sr. Member
- Oct 18, 2007
- 374
- 4
- Detector(s) used
- fisher 1220x,gc-1023,tesoro tejon , fisher f-2, compass yukon 77b, tesoro bandito 11 umax
where's the rest of this story, it has been couple months since this happened, is it over and we are left to guess what went on at court or fine or whatever.
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