Welcome guest, is this your first visit?
Member
Discoveries
 
Page 2 of 75 FirstFirst 12341252 ... LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 1117
Like Tree2403Likes

Thread: Jesse James Treasures: Do They Likely Still Exist?

« Prev Thread | Next Thread »
  1. #16
    Charter Member
    us
    Mar 2011
    Earth
    A couple Sovereign's, Excalibur II, Eureka Gold, Falcon MD20, TM808, Sierra Madre, 5900 DIProsl, Garrett ADS III with Bloodhound, Fisher 1280x
    195
    197 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    I like to think there is still some out there, it's what keeps me going. I personally wouldn't be chasing any Northfield leads though, I think they only made out with somewhere between $0 and $12.50 silver. One also has to decide whether or not he believes that it was in fact Jesse whom Ford shot. If not it could have been Jesse himself who benefited from some of the old stashes at a later date. Stranger things have happened.

  2. #17

    Jan 2008
    49
    9 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Crosse De Sign View Post
    treasuresalvor: Thanks for adding your thoughts, something I've considered a lot also: Since it was well documented, by several citizens, eyewitnesses who knew and accompanied Frank, living and searching there in the Wichita Mountains area after statehood, that Frank recovered so many of the deposits. Supposedly, there may have been some caches that only Jesse knew the exact location of. If so, and Jesse really faked his death, and could have recovered some of them only known by him exclusively, why didn't Frank ask him about those he couldn't find there in the Wichitas, that were found by later treasure hunters? Franks mother was known to have made a trip to visit him and his wife, at his 160 acre farm between the Wichita Mountains and the Keechi Hills, in Feb. 1911. Frank then remained on his farm until he left in 1914, about 3 years after his mothers visit, and after approximately 7 years of living there, supposedly searching and recovering what he could find... Thanks, ~: CDS :~
    Ok Guys....I have some things to add to this discussion that I think are worth pondering. I have read, and read, and reread everything I could find on Jesse James, Frank James, their "Gang" and the stories that are associated with them and the Wichita Mountains, and the surrounding area.
    Here are my thoughts.....Please let me know what your personal opinions are on what I'm posting, as well as any input you'd love to give, or share.
    I'm assuming you all have read the story regarding the 2-Million Dollars that Jesse, Frank, and some of the other outlaws who traveled with them, their "Gang" if you will. Supposedly in the winter of 1867...I think....some how, they ended up down on the Texas/Mexican border area. Hiding out. Also, remember that the border between Texas and Oklahoma, as well as between Texas and Mexico was a lot closer/differently divided/claimed than it is today. May be not so much the Texas/Mexico part, but with out question the Texas/Oklahoma was a lot closer to the Red River, which is just due south of Quarts Mountain and just across the creek from the Devils Canyon site which is several miles West of the Wichita Wildlife Refuge.
    Anyway, as the "Story" goes, the James Gang robbed Mexican Miners of their pack mule train of about 18-burros, each carrying a fairly good quantity of gold. Not sure if the gold was "Raw Gold", if had been turned into "Gold Bullion", or what, but it was a pack mule train nonetheless.

    The gang ran into a bad and bitterly cold snow storm as they entered the Wichita Mountains, and were able to apparently cross "Cashe Creek" (not sure which one....there's a west, and I think an east, or one just generically called "Cashe Creek". They apparently crossed Cashe Creed, and decided they couldn't go any further, and took the gold off the burros, and kicked it down a ravine and covered it with snow and rocks. They then supposedly shot one of the lame burro, to eat I assume, and burned the pack saddled that had stored the gold on the burros, in a bonfire to stay warm.
    From there, where the gold ends up.....Is somewhat of a grey area.
    According to most stories, Jesse James, and probably Frank returned to the are shortly afterwards, and reburied it into the "Bounty Banks" you spoke of. Then Jesse made a couple maps, one he actually carved into either the tongue, bottom, or somewhere on the boot, of which he is said to have given to his mother Zerelda.

    Now here's where it turns funky.......Shortly after burring the bounty banks, they ended up in the Minnesota Robbery gone dreadfully south ordeal, the gang was dispersed, and shortly after that Jesse James was murdered.


    So....as you both know Frank James returned to the area in like 1911 and settled on a small gentlemen's farm about two miles north of Fletcher, Ok. There is an account of a local doctor observing Frank James for several days riding up to the top of a small hill in the area and just sitting in his saddle staring off South into the horizon. Dr. asked Frank James what he was staring off into the horizon. It is not known what was said, or what they ended of talking about, but as the story goes, a few weeks the Dr. returned to the area, apparently to an area a ways south of the hill Frank James was standing on, and the Dr. and his Associates proceed to dig into the side of a canyon. I guess the found a few small clues, but apparently found nothing else.
    Buzzards Roost, which is about 2-miles west of Cement, Ok. is a prominent feature on one of the oldest looking "Supposed" treasure book in Steve Wilsons bood. My understanding is that Buzzards Roost was a major land mark for them, as well as one of the supposed way points on what looks like the older of the maps.
    Now....here's the deal. With all that said. I have some theories regarding this treasure:
    1.)I think that it is very possible that Frank James purpose for moving to the area, was that he obviously knew the area...which lends a little veracity to the story. It is claimed that Frank James wore out many many horses riding that area looking for clues as to where the gold was buried. It is also claimed that Frank James actually found anywhere from 2-14 cashe's depending on what you read.

    If the James Gang Treasure Stories are actually true, then these can really be the only scenarios that are possible:

    1.) The Gold was recovered by Jesse/Frank and/or some of the gang, and reburied into smaller cashe's (Bounty Banks) if you will.

    2. After the reburial of the 2-Million in Gold, some-or-all of it was recovered at a later date by either Frank James, or, Cole Younger (who was just happened to be in the same area at some point that Frank was living there)

    3. The gold was recovered by other members of the James Gang other than Frank.
    4. Part-or-all of the gold was recovered by Frank James when he moved to Fletcher after being pardoned by he Gov. of Mo.

    5.) HERE'S ONE THAT I'VE GIVEN VERY SERIOUS THOUGHT TO: If Frank James recovered some or all of the treasure/gold that he and Jesse and their gang supposedly buried in the Wichita Mountain's general area......then what did he do with it? He only lived in Fletcher from like 1911-1913 or 14. (Ish) then after his mother died while on her way back from visiting him, he ended leaving Oklahoma, moving back to the James Family Farm outside of Kearney, Mo. by Kansas City, Mo. I personally feel that if Frank James found any of the treasure or the gold, that, unless it really wasn't very much money to began with, (which I doubt is the case)(I think there were at least some treasure/gold buried there of greater value), , anyway, I think it would be a logical train of thought to suggest that Frank James took what he found back to the James Family Farm. Where it is probably STILL BURIED TODAY.


    That's not to say that the Wichita Mountains doesn't still hold some buried treasure, I seriously think it still might. Mainly because there is a lot of land there that is "Federal Property" and you can't metal detect, or even go on some of it.


    Any thoughts

  3. #18

    Jan 2008
    49
    9 times
    Another question I've wanted to look further into is this: Of the known "Original" and "Copied" "Supposed" Jesse James treasure maps, are any of them real?

    Do any of them "Really" date from the 1860's-1880's? And if so, has anyone made any attempt to try and verify if the he maps are actually written in Jesse or Frank's known handwriting? From a scientific approach, this would be something that would merit investigation. If one is claimed to be original, and the handwriting doesn't match Jesse or Franks hand writing, then it would have to be a copy, and if it were a copy, it automatically falls under suspicion.

    I remember that there is a story connected to a map regarding the Wichita Mt.'s that Jesse supposedly carved on or in one of his boots, of which he eventually gave a copy to his mother.

    I'd also like to see a good picture of the Brass Bucket that Joe Hunter supposedly found on Tarbone Mountain. The Treasure Pack carved into the bucket. I'd also like to see the iron cook pan that Joe Hunter dug up, that supposedly had a map carved into it.

    There are suppose to be a lot of supposed "OutLaw" signs/carvings/etc. that can be found in the Wichita Mt's.

    Weather this was something that Joe Hunter fabricated, I don't know. I don't know how old the stories of the James Gang and the Wichita Mt's are. I'm hoping Joe Hunter wasn't be fraudulent in the findings he claimed to make.

    I've wondered about that too.

  4. #19

    Jun 2007
    18,107
    9297 times
    "FED-Land" tells me they know it's there; NO "public" hunt-a-bout for TH'ers/MD'ers...
    cuzimloony and franklin like this.

  5. #20

    Jun 2007
    18,107
    9297 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Crosse De Sign View Post
    I will always wonder about whether Jesse may have moved and or buried some of the caches elsewhere, faked his death, and then returned to locations of the hidden caches in other places, besides the Wichita Mountains surrounding areas, that are known to have had some of the James' treasure caches. There were undoubtedly, numerous caves and remote areas they knew of back then, in several surrounding states, where they supposedly pulled robberies, hid out, and lived in, such as Missouri, Kentucky, Tennessee, West Virginia, Nebraska, Kansas, Arkansas, Oklahoma, Texas, etc., that Jesse could have possibly returned to, without it ever being known... I also wonder if Frank ever shared any of the caches he was seen and known to have recovered, there in the Wichita Mountains areas, with any of the other former gang members. Anyone have any thoughts about these?... Thanks, ~: CDS :~
    Check with BELLE STARR...
    franklin likes this.

  6. #21
    ca
    Feb 2014
    Sault St. Marie , Ontario Canada
    AT PRO International, Blisstool V3
    77
    43 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    I'm no expert on the JJ gang but I'm pretty sure they didn't score as much money as everyone thinks they did. If they had, they wouldn't have had to keep on robbing. For example........2 million in gold from miners? Then they pull off another caper right after that? Sounds pretty bogus to me. Not to mention, living as outlaws or criminals usually means whatever money they did have would be squandered on booze and women most likely. lol. The saloons and hookers are the ones who ended up with most of the money.
    PirateLabs likes this.

  7. #22

    Jan 2008
    49
    9 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Bottlecapbill View Post
    I'm no expert on the JJ gang but I'm pretty sure they didn't score as much money as everyone thinks they did. If they had, they wouldn't have had to keep on robbing. For example........2 million in gold from miners? Then they pull off another caper right after that? Sounds pretty bogus to me. Not to mention, living as outlaws or criminals usually means whatever money they did have would be squandered on booze and women most likely. lol. The saloons and hookers are the ones who ended up with most of the money.
    That's something I've thought about as well. Ok...I was "Winging It" when I was typing last night, and I got one of the dates wrong. The 2-million Dollars in gold was taken in 1875. I have a book on Jesse James that lists the robberies that are suppose to be associated with him and his group/gang.
    Liberty, Mo. Jan. 20, 1866..............................$72,000.00
    Richmond, Mo. 1867...................................... $4000.00
    Russellville, Ky. March 20, 1868.......................$14,000.00
    Gallatin, Mo. December 7, 1869............................$700.00
    Corydon, Iowa. June, 3, 1871............................$4000.00
    Columbia, KY. April, 29, 1872............................$600.00
    Kansas City Fair, Sept. 26, 1872........................$978.00
    Ste. Genevieve, Mo. May 27, 1873.....................$3500.00
    Iowa Train Robbery, July 21, 1873......................$2500.00
    Hot Springs Stage, Jan. 15, 1874........................$2000.00
    Gads Hill, Mo. Jan. 31, 1874.............................$5000.00
    Corinth, Miss. ...............................................$10 ,000.00
    Muncie, KS................................................ .....$30,000.00
    Huntington, W. VA. Sept. 1875...........................$10,000.00
    Baxter Springs, KS. April 18, 1876.......................$3000.00
    Otterville, MO. July 7, 1876................................$15,000.00
    Northfield, MN. Sept. 7, 1876..............................$..........
    Big Springs, WY. Sept. 18, 1877..........................$60,000.00
    Glendale, MO. Oct. 8, 1879.................................$6000.00
    Winston, MO. July, 15, 1881................................$4000.00
    Blue Cut, Sept. 7, 1881........................................$16,00 0.00

    TOTAL............................................. ................$263,278.00

  8. #23

    Jun 2007
    18,107
    9297 times
    $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ went to the "Robber Barons"!
    franklin likes this.

  9. #24
    ca
    Feb 2014
    Sault St. Marie , Ontario Canada
    AT PRO International, Blisstool V3
    77
    43 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by Crosse De Sign View Post
    Bottlecapbill: Thanks for your input... Who will ever know how much they really ever took, buried, spent, saved? I think you've got to be right about them spending money out on the road... I wonder, though, if they probably got a fair amount of paper money that was lighter and much easier to carry. Could the fact that there was buried loot witnessed to be recovered by Frank, his several inquiries in various locations, some successful, then later, after Frank left, the use of a Rock Map And A Paper Map, by people who had obtained MAPS/INFO, and used them together in conjunction, to successfully recover CACHES in the same area that Frank had inquired of the original local landowners: Could that be proof that they did bury some of what they got, and therefore that's why so many people showed up there through the years? So if they Buried Gold There, surely they could have easily buried some elsewhere also, whatever their motive, maybe even for the cause that they had just been in the bloody Civil War over, still fighting in that way, getting money put up? Also, it's possible they enjoyed stealing. Klepto-maniacs, are known to get off on the adrenalin rush of the risk, and success makes them want to do it again and again, so if they took more than they needed to live on (which I suspect they could have done easily), then surely it would make sense that they would be caching at least some of the heavy Gold and Silver loot for later, maybe even most of it, possibly even partly, for the hopes of their known cause, they seriously hoped to make happen in the future?... Thanks, ~: CDS :~
    I'll agree that some of the heavier stuff could have been left behind for a later date BUT.....is there any proof(not stories) that anyone ever did recover any stashes directly related to the James gang, and not just loot that could have been hidden by anyone in the days before secure banking? Why would Frank need a map if he was one of the guys who buried the loot? Perhaps a specific marker to know the exact spot but with nothing but time on his hands you would think he would have lived his remaining years a wealthy man, had there been much left. I would also think any pardon he received would have had a "loot" stipulation attached to it. That's just standard procedure, especially in those days. If you look at the amounts of money the gang supposedly robbed, and divide that into the number of guys in the gang, it doesn't really add up to a lot of money to be living on the lamb with. Each man would have had his share, it wouldn't have been kept in one pile. These guys were theives! Factor in that newspapers of the time were notorious for outright lying to sell papers........the lack of decent long distance communications, crooked bankers, etc etc. It all just seems far too romantic and not very logical to me.

    The amount of time by horseback travelling from location to location when compared to the dates.........is just crazy. Split that amount of money among a gang of men who have to live totally on the money they rob and in most cases it doesn't seem to me they'd have been able to leave much behind. In fact they seem to return to the states they made their biggest scores repeatedly which would suggest to me that if they did bury any money, they had to keep going back for it to stay alive during the meager pickings they usually took.

    I know their total haul was a lot of money in those days but if you were to go on the road today to trace their path over the course of 20 years living on your bank account I think you'd quickly see they needed to keep robbing to stay alive because living on the road is very very costly. Just my uneducated 2 cents.
    Last edited by Bottlecapbill; Feb 19, 2014 at 03:05 PM.
    Rebel - KGC likes this.

  10. #25
    us
    Oct 2012
    Tx
    397
    201 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Thats a lot of money even now days I was told there was some even buried here in Bell County Texas on Belton Lake . This is where he spent his later days what I was told. In fact my wifes uncle and his brother inherited the land he lived on. Her uncle sold his half to his brother and he wont let anyone on it . I would luv to do some mding out there.
    Rebel - KGC likes this.

  11. #26

    Jun 2007
    18,107
    9297 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Crosse De Sign View Post
    Mornin' Rebel - KGC: Would you care to elaborate on "the Robber Barons" a little, who all they likely were, their objectives? Would like to hear more on your thoughts...
    "Robber Barons"; WHITE wealthy guys who owned Railroads going WEST, etc. Ppl that "Outlaws" "raided"... BANKERS. Many names you WOULD know. OBJECTIVES...? MORE $$$$$$$$$$$$! LAND in the WEST! The FILTHY RICH!
    franklin likes this.

  12. #27

    Jan 2008
    49
    9 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Crosse De Sign View Post
    monkeymann: Thanks for that list, I still think they were very possibly, burying a substantial part of it also, and it seems doubtfull to me that they were blowing a lot of bucks living extravagantly all the time, just my thoughts, everyone's are welcome... Who knows what else they may have taken, as well as the purported 2 million they probably split up and moved after that freezing cold winter stormy blizzard night?... I do see points expressed about them supposedly getting the 2 mil.,then going up to NOrthfield and getting their hides shot up pretty bad... No one is perfect including the notoriously successful and when necessary deadly James-Younger gang, A Major Miscalculation? Luck Ran Out? Fateful Destiny? Jesse being supposedly dead, and everyone buying it, would be a good way to cut their losses, retire and live off of what they had stashed, sounds very possibly like a do-able plan of the former gangs mastermind to me... Thanks, ~: CDS :~
    I agree with you. I don't think the list I posted represents a "Total & Accurate" accounting of everything Jesse James and Co. were responsible for.

    I also agree with you about their "Saddle Time". They spent ALOT of time in those saddles....and covered ALOT of ground.

    The problem I have is, I've never read anything other than in Steve Wilsons book, that places the James Gang in the Wichita Mountains.....aside for Frank James moving there after Jesse's death. You'd think in all the book that have been written about them and their escapades, that them being in the Wichita Mt.s or in the Oklahoma area, would have been more widely accounted for.

    I just don't ever see anything ever mentioned in the books I've read about Oklahoma.

    Anyone else have this issue? Anyone else ever ran across any accounts of them being in Oklahoma or the Wichita Mt's....other than Steve Wilsons book, or the fact that Frank James moved there?

    Also...I'd like to know which of the maps represented in Steve Wilsons Book, is considered to be an original? Not a copy, but one of the original ones that were made by Jesse or Frank...... Which one of the maps in Wilsons book is actually the OLDEST?

    Anyone know?
    Rebel - KGC likes this.

  13. #28

    Jun 2007
    18,107
    9297 times
    Check with Belle Starr (Outlaw)...
    Last edited by Rebel - KGC; Feb 19, 2014 at 08:26 PM.
    franklin likes this.

  14. #29
    us
    Oct 2012
    Tx
    397
    201 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Quote Originally Posted by Crosse De Sign View Post
    Hey Sallysue: Yes I agree that would be a lot of money now, hope you get to look around the property someday, I'll always wish someone could prove Jesse lived in Texas, that would jive with burying money in Southern Oklahoma. Good luck, and happy hunting... Thanks for your response, ~: CDS :~
    I talked to his Great grand daughter and she wrote 3 books about him. While she also did a lot of study of his life. She said he lived in Bell Falls till he died up in his 90's under a different name. She proved he fake his death up north with a DNA
    doc-d, Rebel - KGC and franklin like this.

  15. #30

    Jun 2007
    18,107
    9297 times
    Quote Originally Posted by Sallysue View Post
    I talked to his Great grand daughter and she wrote 3 books about him. While she also did a lot of study of his life. She said he lived in Bell Falls till he died up in his 90's under a different name. She proved he fake his death up north with a DNA
    Betty Duke...?
    franklin likes this.

 

 
Page 2 of 75 FirstFirst 12341252 ... LastLast

Remove Ads

Home | Forum | Active Topics | What's New

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Jesse James
    By tlm5000 in forum Arkansas
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: Feb 01, 2015, 02:01 AM
  2. Jesse James Treasures Found!
    By nickmarch in forum Treasure Legends
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: Feb 27, 2014, 06:34 AM
  3. JESSE James
    By jeff of pa in forum Treasure Legends - Missouri
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: May 22, 2012, 11:53 PM
  4. Jesse James Hidden treasures
    By jeff of pa in forum TV Shows
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: Apr 22, 2012, 03:56 AM
  5. Jesse James
    By Blind.In.Texas in forum Treasure Marks/Signs
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: Apr 10, 2010, 09:59 AM

Search tags for this page

did jesse james do any carvings
,
jesse james buried treasure found
,
jesse james gold found
,
jesse james hidden treasure in missouri
,
jesse james travels through pennsylvania
,

jesse james treasure

,

jesse james treasure found

,
jesse james treasure found in kansas
,
jesse james treasure minnesota
,
what path did jesse james travel through the wichita mountains
Click on a term to search for related topics.

Tags for this Thread

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.3.0