Binoculars from Custers Last Stand?

[MAN "O" WAR]

First post. I've been searching online trying to find out how to authenticate some binoculars that my Dad inherited years ago. One of our ancestors

used to travel different to parts of the country on horseback going to Indian trading posts and the like looking for things of value to trade and or

purchase. He acquired a pair of binoculars from an Indian that was at The Battle of the Little Big Horn. It still has the leather case and is in really

good shape. I looked on the outside of the binoculars and didn't see any serial numbers unfortunately.


I live in the Kansas City area and would love to find a way/someone to help me prove it came from the battlefield somehow. Anybody know who to

contact in the area? I am aware that someone dug up a pair of binoculars from the Battlefield/monument and got in some trouble for it. This is not

the same situation as that. The binoculars were taken from the battlefield by a participant in the battle LONG before it was a national monument.


Any help would be appreciated

Thanks

 

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[Red James Cash]

It might just be a story the seller told your dad.Custer wasnt smart enough to listen to his scouts,bring along artillery or the gatling guns,went above the call making the classic military mistake of not only dividing his forces against an unknown enemy force,but divided it into 3 different forces,didnt wait for reinforcements.Custer wasnt smart enough to bring binoculars.Custer most likely had a telescope if anything.

 

[MAN "O" WAR]

It might just be a story the seller told your dad.Custer wasnt smart enough to listen to his scouts,bring along artillery or the gatling guns,went above the call making the classic military mistake of not only dividing his forces against an unknown enemy force,but divided it into 3 different forces,didnt wait for reinforcements.Custer wasnt smart enough to bring binoculars.Custer most likely had a telescope if anything.

Thanks for the response but there was no "seller" per say. This has been handed down in the family since shortly after the battle took place. Nothing

was sold to my Dad at all. An Indian that participated in THE battle sold or traded it to our ancestor. To beat the next poster to the punch,

they are perfectly working binoculars. So we can eliminate these particular binoculars off the list of potential reasons they lost the battle that day.

Thanks

 

[cazisme]

Heepum big wampum, may have been one of my relatives shorteyes.

 

[allen_idaho]

Are the binoculars made of brass?

 

[flinthunter]

Anytime something this rare gets posted without pictures it throws up all kinds of red flags. Please post some clear pictures from different angles. If the pictures show that the binoculars are period army issue, then we can better determine what you have.

 

[Red James Cash]

they are perfectly working binoculars. So we can eliminate these particular binoculars off the list of potential reasons they lost the battle that day.

Stupidity and over confidence lost the battle that day,not to mention being out gunnedThe main problem youre going to have about your binoculars is there just no proof other than word of mouth.I'm not putting your item and story down by any means,just saying it as it is.

 

[MAN "O" WAR]

Thanks for the serious posts I really do appreciate any serious help I can get. I can post pics and let you guys check them out. I just gotta get my Dad to dig them out

and allow me to take some pics. Since this battle is so famous and a lot of research has went into it I was really hoping to

find records of what equipment was issued to which soldier etc. I'm hoping there is something inside of it showing a serial number that might place it with a certain soldier

in the battle etc. Hoping someone would know an expert to contact in that field and I could take them to personally.

 

[MAN "O" WAR]

DBL post sorry

 

[MAN "O" WAR]

Found these saved on my computer taken by me a few years ago.

 

[MAN "O" WAR]

These pics were taken at the same time so i thought I would share. Civil War sword worn by one of my ancestors.

 

[Sheldon J]

what is needed is to first research the maker and find a date they were made, and that would at least establish if they were even available at that time in history..

It's a nice story and al but as to Provenance, a family story is insufficient with out some form of paperwork that actually establishes the who where and when...

I mean for example it could have been a uncle that gave it to your dad as a kid with the story, simply because he knew your dad liked the history of the little Big Horn.... Like no uncle ever did that to a nephew before...

 

[NOLA_Ken]

That Tiffany Wristbreaker is pretty nice! Unfortunately with the binoculars even if they do turn out to be the right age, I doubt there would ever be any way to prove they came from the battle. It would be really cool if they were, I just can't imagine any way to conclusively say so.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Without serial numbers on binoculars and corresponding serial number on historical documents to prove they were assigned to 7th calvary it will just be a story.

You could have an arrow removed from Custer's body but with out providence to prove it you would just have an old arrow..

I have old inkwell recovered from an old Indian camp off of the little big horn on private property right outside of Custer National Momunent.

Problem is there is no providence to go with it so it's value is to me only, doesn't bother me though, as I have no intention of selling it...

 

[MAN "O" WAR]

Thanks guys. I'll see if my Dad will take it apart and look for some markings or something like that. My Dad actually inherited a ton of stuff

from his Great Uncle Charlie when he was in his teens. This is the one item with the best story behind it. Uncle Charlie had tags on

everything that he had collected with the when and where etc written on them. Unfortunately Uncle Charlies wifes side of the family wasn't

happy that a teenage boy got the collection I'd assume and ripped all of the tags off everything before my Dad/Grandpa could get everything

out of Uncle Charlies house. So my Dad and Grandpa only had their memories of the stories to go by. But we still have his collection including

his saddle and cowboy hat though I wish I had a time machine to go back and meet and talk to him.

 

[allen_idaho]

The binoculars are correct for that era. Field Glasses from that manufacturer were widely used in the United States from the Civil War to World War 1.
If you follow this link, you will see another pair recovered from the Little Bighorn battlefield that look very similar:
http://www.friendslittlebighorn.com/images/reviews/Benteen's-Property.jpg

That Field Glass belonged to Frederick Benteen, commander of companies D,H and K of the 7th Cavalry during the Battle of Little Bighorn.

However, these were usually privately purchased. As such, there is likely to be no record of ownership and nothing to tie your field glasses to the Battle of Little Bighorn.

 

[huntsman53]

You might check with the Cody Firearms Museum and/or the Buffalo Bill Museum to see if they can help. The have a lot of experts and have authenticated many firearms and other items not only from the Battle of the Little Big Horn but also from the Civil War and Indian Wars. Even if they cannot authenticate the binoculars as being from the Battle of the Litte Big Horn, they may be able to provide you with additional resources and contacts.


Frank

 

[gunsil]

The binoculars are correct for that era. Field Glasses from that manufacturer were widely used in the United States from the Civil War to World War 1.
If you follow this link, you will see another pair recovered from the Little Bighorn battlefield that look very similar:
http://www.friendslittlebighorn.com/images/reviews/Benteen's-Property.jpg

That Field Glass belonged to Frederick Benteen, commander of companies D,H and K of the 7th Cavalry during the Battle of Little Bighorn.



However, these were usually privately purchased. As such, there is likely to be no record of ownership and nothing to tie your field glasses to the Battle of Little Bighorn.

Well there is a problem associating the things in that photo with Benteen since that pocket knife shown there was made between 1893-1920. This would make me seriously doubt the provenance of all items in the photo. Also the items perhaps could have belonged to him, but acquired well after his army service. The pocket knife is very worn so even if he bought it in 1893, the first year of it's manufacture, I doubt if he would have worn it out that much before he died in 1898. Thus it is likely that the knife in fact did not belong to him which casts a serious shadow on the other items in that little collection. There are tons of spurious items out there attributed to Custer and the Little Big Horn with little way of actually proving they were, other than the artifacts recently found at the battlefield by archies with metal detectors. By the way, the knife was made by Press Button Knife Co. of Walden, N.Y. and is a very distinguishable early (for American made) switchblade.

 

[allen_idaho]

The image is just a collection of Benteen's personal possessions. Those field glasses in the image were given to Lt. Frank Gibson during the battle and returned to Benteen afterward. That is verified.

 

[MAN "O" WAR]

Thanks for the great advice Allen and huntsman. I will definitely be contacting the museum to try to get info, it sounds like a great place to start.