Bullets and cartridges from a WW1 battle site in Israel
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Thread: Bullets and cartridges from a WW1 battle site in Israel

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  1. #1

    Sep 2021
    1
    2 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting

    Question Bullets and cartridges from a WW1 battle site in Israel

    Hey guys,
    Some time ago I found some bullets and cartridges on a beach cliff in central Israel, would be glad for any help in identifying their origins and stories and any information about them that could be interesting.
    A bit of context: From what I know there was a battle in the area in WW1 where the British attacked Turkish positions. Later in 1945 the beach was used for illegal disembarking of Jewish immigrants, and in one case the nearby settlement of Shefayim was under a British blockade for a day which included some exchange of fire. Of course, the origin of the rounds could be from all kinds of random events.


    First cartridge:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	cartridge_height.jpeg 
Views:	29 
Size:	1.62 MB 
ID:	1947300Click image for larger version. 

Name:	cartridge_base_diameter.jpeg 
Views:	26 
Size:	950.4 KB 
ID:	1947301Click image for larger version. 

Name:	cartridge_neck_diameter.jpeg 
Views:	21 
Size:	993.7 KB 
ID:	1947304Click image for larger version. 

Name:	cartridge_inside_diameter.jpeg 
Views:	25 
Size:	1.22 MB 
ID:	1947305



    Random metal fragment or a deformed bullet?

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	metal_piece.jpeg 
Views:	29 
Size:	1.03 MB 
ID:	1947309



    Israeli cartridge, "380 auto":

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	israeli_cartridge_base_diameter.jpeg 
Views:	29 
Size:	1.12 MB 
ID:	1947313Click image for larger version. 

Name:	israeli_cartridge_inside_diameter.jpeg 
Views:	24 
Size:	1.18 MB 
ID:	1947315



    9mm bullet:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	bullet_height.jpeg 
Views:	22 
Size:	1.61 MB 
ID:	1947316



    For context, 2 other bullets I found, assumed these were British and Turkish from WW1:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	brit_otto_bullets.jpeg 
Views:	30 
Size:	1.68 MB 
ID:	1947317



    Would be happy to hear your thoughts!

    Louie D and invent4hir like this.

  2. #2
    us
    Spec-Ops: We Own The Night

    Feb 2009
    Panama City Florida
    1,939
    3275 times
    Military History, Militaria, and Military Surplus Weapons & Anything Military Related
    IMI as you know is Israel Military Industries, they were establish as Israels first armament factory in 1933, so your 380 round wouldn't date from any earlier than then.

    The U marked one is a rim fire shell for a 22 long, made by Union Metallic Cartridge Company under Remington Arms from 1885 to present.

    The left projectile on the bottom confuses me, you might need to use the micrometer to get a more precise measurement.

    8.22 mm is 8mm Mauser
    7.8 mm is 30-06 US 30 cal
    7.25 mm is 7mm Mauser
    7.92 mm is 303 British
    7.85 mm is 7.62x54R Russian
    7.84 mm is 7.5x54mm French
    7.57 mm is 7.35x51mm Carcano
    7.82 mm is 7.62x51 NATO and 308

    These are the most prevalent cartridges being used in Europe at the time, that come to my mind right now. Until you get to the newer or later weapons. I know I'm forgetting some of the early cartridges, but my mind is drawing a blank.

    As for the 9mm projectile there are so many cartridges out there that are 9mm or fall within the 9mm size parameters that I couldn't phantom a guess with any certainty.
    Last edited by ffuries; Sep 15, 2021 at 01:00 PM.
    Mike
    TSgt, USAF Retired
    Jan 86 - Sept 08
    Aircrew Life Support
    "Your Life Is Our Business"
    (122X0, 1T1X1, 1P0X1)



  3. #3
    us
    Spec-Ops: We Own The Night

    Feb 2009
    Panama City Florida
    1,939
    3275 times
    Military History, Militaria, and Military Surplus Weapons & Anything Military Related
    I know some of our other members should be able to fill in the blanks on these and narrow down some of the basic information I've given.
    crashbandicoot, Fat and chak like this.
    Mike
    TSgt, USAF Retired
    Jan 86 - Sept 08
    Aircrew Life Support
    "Your Life Is Our Business"
    (122X0, 1T1X1, 1P0X1)



  4. #4
    us
    Spec-Ops: We Own The Night

    Feb 2009
    Panama City Florida
    1,939
    3275 times
    Military History, Militaria, and Military Surplus Weapons & Anything Military Related
    Here's a list/poster showing some of the WWI used rifles.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	d9onttk-012b4c86-af13-4aa5-a764-c80644770eb8.jpg 
Views:	20 
Size:	1.07 MB 
ID:	1947377
    Fat, chak and invent4hir like this.
    Mike
    TSgt, USAF Retired
    Jan 86 - Sept 08
    Aircrew Life Support
    "Your Life Is Our Business"
    (122X0, 1T1X1, 1P0X1)



  5. #5

    Dec 2012
    148
    175 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    The long, pointed projectile appears to be the hardened steel core of an armor-piercing bullet. The piece beside it could be a jacket from an FMJ round.
    Fat and chak like this.

 

 

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