First hunt with 9x5 HF coil: Excellent!

[brianc053]

Hi everyone. After reading all the great comments about the Deus HF coils I decided to invest in the 9x5 elliptical one. Now I've got the 11" X35 for general historic site use (farm fields, wide open historic home properties) and the HF elliptical for heavier iron areas and tighter spaces. (Plus the Equinox with stock 11" coil for the beach and parks). I feel fully kitted out.

The new HF coil came Wednesday but I couldn't get out for an initial hunt until after work yesterday. I only had 1-hour but it was a very productive hunt (More on that in a minute). I took the coil back to a house I've written about before:

http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/today-s-finds/653661-another-first-1857-flying-eagle-cent.html
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/e...h-detecting-deeper-targets-2.html#post6745587 (the video I posted was made at this house).
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/today-s-finds/654284-ford-model-t-axle-cap-i-think.html

Having used both the Equinox and the Deus 11" x35 at this location I feel like I can offer some good initial impressions of the HF elliptical, and they're all very positive:
1. The HF 9x5 elliptical is quiet. And what I mean by that is:
> it doesn't seem to have the ground noise that the 11" x35 had. I run the discrimination all the way down at -6.4 by default, but that was causing noise with the x35. Not so much with the HF
> the HF elliptical was producing more "crisp" target signals, more precise. With the 11" x35 I think I was hearing a lot of chatter in dense iron areas because there are more targets under the coil at one time. The 9x5 HF has less under the coil so it's totally logical that the target indications will be more crisp. I like that, because many of my sites are machine-gun iron sites.

2. The HF 9x5 wasn't suffering from EMI. I'll include a picture of the house below; in it above the red barn you'll see an electrical wire running from the street pole to the house. Both the Equinox and the 11" x35 couldn't handle that electrical wire's EMI very well (despite frequency shifts), but he 9x5 HF had no problems at all. (see Target D below)

3. the HF 9x5 helped with pinpointing, and avoiding larger iron (mostly). With the 11" x35 I was digging A LOT of iron that had a halo that sounded good, and i think it was because I struggle to pinpoint with the X35 in dense target areas (multiple targets near each other). The 9x5 HF helped a lot with this. (see target E below).

4. I don't think I lost depth (compared to x35 11") I already have developed the opinion that the Deus (with either coil) goes deeper than the Equinox. As one target I discuss below demonstrates I can pull deep targets with the 9x5 HF just like the 11" x35.

I know it was only a 1-hour hunt, but I'm already very impressed and think this coil will be excellent. Thanks to all of you for your commentary on the various coils.
Now for the finds:

A. The crotal bell was actually the last find of the day, and frankly I think any of my detectors would have found it since it was 3" down. I must have just missed it in past visits. It's a nice late 1700's / early 1800's intact bell with no maker's mark. Love it!

B. The first target I dug was the horseshoe. You know how it is: new coil, dig the first thing that beeps. Nothing special there (but a nice shoe).

C. The iron buckles and rings were picked out from other "undesirable" iron like nails, so I was happy about those.

D. This is where it gets interesting: these two targets (aluminum gold-colored heart and a wheat penny) were pulled from below the power line, where the EMI would have kept away other detectors. (see point #2 above)

E. These two targets - a piece of lead that looks like a butterfly, and a .22 casing are interesting because
- the lead was deep, like 8" deep. Pretty good. Gave a nice soft 90's signal that was easily pinpointed.
- the .22 casing was with 2 iron nails, yet I still heard it.
Both these targets prove point #3 above.

F. This thing was just cool. It's an "AUTOMATIC" Eagle Pencil Company pencil knife, for sharpening pencils. This style was from the 1883 patent and pre-dates 1910 (when the design changed). If you're interested: The Blade Blog: Eagle Pencil Co. USA - Gold Plated AUTOMATIC Pencil Gravity Knife

I included the nickel because it shows I missed a coin in past hunts, and I included the giant chunk of anthracite coal just because it's a huge hunk of coal (found with the detector - gave a soft 90's signal).

So, I hope someone benefits from this write up. I absolutely cannot wait to keep using the new HF coil!
- Brian





The house:

 

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[erfranks]

Nice Saves!!

 

[HuntinDog]

Very nice write-up Brian
That's the one coil I haven't picked up yet... Guess I better get on it...

 

[vferrari]

Brian - first of all...nice saves. My only crotal bell find had a cracked case and lost the bell ringer. Still looking for my first flying eagle - one of many things on the list. The first target I dug one day was a horseshoe. I put it in my finds pouch with the ends pointing up for good luck and then proceeded to recover over 80 minie balls that day. Lol.

The mini-HF coil is a great coil. Smokey the Cat has had phenomenal success with it. Despite its small footprint, it has decent depth, the small footprint limits ground noise, and the higher frequency settings are great for relic hunting and to limit EMI as you observed and yes it tends to be EMI immune even at the lowest operating frequency of 13 khz. It also allows you to squeeze into tight spots, heavy vegetation, and playground equipment. The Equinox and Deus make a formidable combo that can handle just about any vlf detecting situation.

You say you run disc at -6.4 by default. Thought I would provide some thoughts on this for consideration...

The only time I run with no disc or negative disc is when I am using full tones because the iron volume feature does not function while using full tones. I like to use full tones in parks and ball fields where there is a lot of can slaw and other aluminum junk because the full tone audio nuances tend to bring out audio distortions consistent with the physically distorted nature of can slaw, bent tabs, etc.

Otherwise, I typically run with disc set at 7 to 10 and rely on iron volume to alert me to the presence of iron. Why bother running with disc, you might then ask. The reason is because beside filtering out iron, the disc filter also subtly improves Deus target ID performance because it helps to keep iron from down averaging non-ferrous target IDs. The other benefit of using disc is that it helps the horseshoe display which differentiates between ferrous and non-ferrous targets as well as providing a depth indication to work in a stable and accurate manner.

When relic hunting in iron, I like to use disc at 10 (or at least at the Deus Fast default of 6.1) using iron volume at 2 or 3 and pitch audio. I like to set reactivity at 2, 2.5 or sometimes at 3, hunt with frequency at 28 khz and I then basically have a "two" tone setup with either an iron grunt (iron audio), or non-ferrous pitch tone that various in pitch and intensity based on target strength. I then make a final dig decision based on the target ID display.

Just something for you to try out if you are interested. HTH HH

 

[brianc053]

Brian - first of all...nice saves. My only crotal bell find had a cracked case and lost the bell ringer. Still looking for my first flying eagle - one of many things on the list. The first target I dug one day was a horseshoe. I put it in my finds pouch with the ends pointing up for good luck and then proceeded to recover over 80 minie balls that day. Lol.

The mini-HF coil is a great coil. Smokey the Cat has had phenomenal success with it. Despite its small footprint, it has decent depth, the small footprint limits ground noise, and the higher frequency settings are great for relic hunting and to limit EMI as you observed and yes it tends to be EMI immune even at the lowest operating frequency of 13 khz. It also allows you to squeeze into tight spots, heavy vegetation, and playground equipment. The Equinox and Deus make a formidable combo that can handle just about any vlf detecting situation.

You say you run disc at -6.4 by default. Thought I would provide some thoughts on this for consideration...

The only time I run with no disc or negative disc is when I am using full tones because the iron volume feature does not function while using full tones. I like to use full tones in parks and ball fields where there is a lot of can slaw and other aluminum junk because the full tone audio nuances tend to bring out audio distortions consistent with the physically distorted nature of can slaw, bent tabs, etc.

Otherwise, I typically run with disc set at 7 to 10 and rely on iron volume to alert me to the presence of iron. Why bother running with disc, you might then ask. The reason is because beside filtering out iron, the disc filter also subtly improves Deus target ID performance because it helps to keep iron from down averaging non-ferrous target IDs. The other benefit of using disc is that it helps the horseshoe display which differentiates between ferrous and non-ferrous targets as well as providing a depth indication to work in a stable and accurate manner.

When relic hunting in iron, I like to use disc at 10 (or at least at the Deus Fast default of 6.1) using iron volume at 2 or 3 and pitch audio. I like to set reactivity at 2, 2.5 or sometimes at 3, hunt with frequency at 28 khz and I then basically have a "two" tone setup with either an iron grunt (iron audio), or non-ferrous pitch tone that various in pitch and intensity based on target strength. I then make a final dig decision based on the target ID display.

Just something for you to try out if you are interested. HTH HH

vferrari thanks so much for the contribution to the thread! I need to think about all that you've said, and possibly create a "vferrari" program to experiment with.

The program(s) I'm using are based on Deus Fast but with full tones, so that's part of why I use no discrimination (set to -6.4). As I've been learning the Deus I've been OK with hearing everything and trying to learn what the detector is telling me. More recently (today even - I went back to the same house. Nothing remarkable found) I've been moving discrimination up to like -4.0 to remove the ground noise, but I miss hearing the negatives along with the highs that indicate an old rusty iron target with a halo.

But maybe I need to experiment with "pitch audio" (I like the way you describe it but honestly haven't used it).
I did create the "Sonar" program from Gary Blackwell - it uses basically two tones ("dig" high and "don't dig" low), as I remember it. I used it for a while but ultimately preferred a full tones program even in farm fields.

I really appreciate your input, vferrari, and will try some of the things you suggest in one of my next hunts.

- Brian

 

[vferrari]

I am a big fan of Gary's videos and he has some great tips. Gary, for whatever reason, likes to primarily run with no disc regardless of his tone setup. I do also like to hear it all, but with iron volume you can and take advantage of what disc brings to the table. So I am not sure why he chooses to shy away from disc. I know some are concerned about depth loss with disc applied but I have tested disc as high as 15 to 20 with no impact on depth. Anyway, try some different tone setups to see what works for you. Enjoy.

 

[pepperj]

Brian - first of all...nice saves. My only crotal bell find had a cracked case and lost the bell ringer. Still looking for my first flying eagle - one of many things on the list. The first target I dug one day was a horseshoe. I put it in my finds pouch with the ends pointing up for good luck and then proceeded to recover over 80 minie balls that day. Lol.

The mini-HF coil is a great coil. Smokey the Cat has had phenomenal success with it. Despite its small footprint, it has decent depth, the small footprint limits ground noise, and the higher frequency settings are great for relic hunting and to limit EMI as you observed and yes it tends to be EMI immune even at the lowest operating frequency of 13 khz. It also allows you to squeeze into tight spots, heavy vegetation, and playground equipment. The Equinox and Deus make a formidable combo that can handle just about any vlf detecting situation.

You say you run disc at -6.4 by default. Thought I would provide some thoughts on this for consideration...

The only time I run with no disc or negative disc is when I am using full tones because the iron volume feature does not function while using full tones. I like to use full tones in parks and ball fields where there is a lot of can slaw and other aluminum junk because the full tone audio nuances tend to bring out audio distortions consistent with the physically distorted nature of can slaw, bent tabs, etc.

Otherwise, I typically run with disc set at 7 to 10 and rely on iron volume to alert me to the presence of iron. Why bother running with disc, you might then ask. The reason is because beside filtering out iron, the disc filter also subtly improves Deus target ID performance because it helps to keep iron from down averaging non-ferrous target IDs. The other benefit of using disc is that it helps the horseshoe display which differentiates between ferrous and non-ferrous targets as well as providing a depth indication to work in a stable and accurate manner.

When relic hunting in iron, I like to use disc at 10 (or at least at the Deus Fast default of 6.1) using iron volume at 2 or 3 and pitch audio. I like to set reactivity at 2, 2.5 or sometimes at 3, hunt with frequency at 28 khz and I then basically have a "two" tone setup with either an iron grunt (iron audio), or non-ferrous pitch tone that various in pitch and intensity based on target strength. I then make a final dig decision based on the target ID display.

Just something for you to try out if you are interested. HTH HH

Well done Brian on the first outing with the HF coil, liking the bell. I haven't dug one this season yet, kind of miss getting one.

I went to a site yesterday that most likely had a barn on it as the lack of any coins and more tack related items.

I used the pitch tones for the first time and the thing was it was high pitching on lots of iron that was on the surface, or just under.
I went all the way up to Disc.10
74 khz
vol.6
IV 2-4 different tries
reactivity 2.5-3 different tries
XY screen (Even though the indication was iron I still dug to confirm-it was bang on for a ID) Never got use to using the horseshoe screen.

It pitched off too many times to where I was having to look at the screen.
The non-ferrous really pitched high-but so did certain other items.
First time out using the pitch.
I should of changed back to the full tones to see if it would pick up the small bits that I dug.
Not sure how it would do in one of the hard hit iron sites that I test out settings (planted or have cattle ranging now)
Interesting though using pitch-and will have to work on it a bit more.