Long Unanswered Deus Settings Questions

Iron Buzz

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I've been a Deus user for going on 5 years now, and I'm completely comfortable with using it. But as they say, there is no such thing as a stupid question, and I have a number of questions about the Deus that have puzzled me for all these years. Maybe somebody here can answer them to my satisfaction .


1) Iron Volume: The manual doesn't say a thing about the -1 or 0 settings. What is the difference between those two? (also, am I correct that it is essentially the same as the Iron Bias setting on the Minelab Equinox?)

2) Why did they bother with decimal precision on discrimination settings? Does anybody really set their discrimination to something other than a round number?

3) I forget which version added the 2.5 reactivity setting, but I have always wondered why they simply hard-coded 2.5 instead of giving the user half-steps throughout.

4) What the heck does Audio Overload really do? I have tried it many times and have seen no difference regardless of what I set it to.

5) Why the $@&$^# did they not tie frequency changes to discrimination & tone breakpoints? (that is a side question to the general ID Norm puzzlements, which I don't think any of us really want to rehash)

6) Where is that Go Terrain app that was promised years ago, and is still being promised in the V5 manual? (rhetorical question, does not really need an answer)
 

pepperj

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Have you ever played with #3?
Valid on all points.
Need a tech brain, that can explain to my non-tech brain.
 
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Iron Buzz

Iron Buzz

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> Have you ever played with #3?

Not sure what you mean. Have I ever used Reactivity of 2.5? Of course I have. Have I ever used Reactivity 3.5? Nope. Can't.
 
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Iron Buzz

Iron Buzz

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I found an answer to #4, thanks to vferrari (no surprise there!)

http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/deus/602486-deus-audio-overload-adjustment.html

Audio Overload is an expert setting under "Audio Response". Audio Overload can be adjusted from 0 to 2 and as mentioned above the default is 1 for all modes. The audio overload really just determines the signal strength at which the audio overload indicator in the center of the horseshoe display (see more below) lights up. It does not audibly change or boost the signal and I have found that it does not do a heck of a lot other than in an air test, incrementally change the height at which the overload indicator will light up (i.e., changes how close you need to be to a large, shallow object for the overload indicator to light up). I would just leave it at 1, and as Andy Sabisch says in his book, "set it and forget it". Since the default is "1", just leave it alone. It will make no difference whatsoever in your ability to recover targets.
 
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Steve in PA

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Yeah I noticed that. But after reading it, I bumped my iron volume down from 3 to 2. I guess you might just have to experiment a bit.
 

vferrari

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That did not mention -1 at all, though. Just 0 and above.

You are probably confusing iron volume with silencer which has the -1 setting which turns off the silencer filter completely versus 0 which is the minimum silencer filter setting. Two completely different things. The silencer filter breaks up mixed ferrous signals, whereas iron volume just enables you to set the level of the discriminated iron tones when in pitch or multitones. Iron volume does not have any function in full tones. Silencer is an expert setting linked to the reactivity setting. HTH
 

signal_line

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The Overload tone I have only heard in the Basic Program I think it was. I can't describe it, but you will know when you hear it.
 

Jeff H

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5) Why the $@&$^# did they not tie frequency changes to discrimination & tone breakpoints? (that is a side question to the general ID Norm puzzlements, which I don't think any of us really want to rehash)

I admit that would be pretty slick if they coupled frequency changes to tonal breakpoints. Not that it is a big deal to set up adjacent programs for different frequencies and tonal breaks but it would save some time.
 
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Iron Buzz

Iron Buzz

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You are probably confusing iron volume with silencer which has the -1 setting which turns off the silencer filter completely versus 0 which is the minimum silencer filter setting. Two completely different things. The silencer filter breaks up mixed ferrous signals, whereas iron volume just enables you to set the level of the discriminated iron tones when in pitch or multitones. Iron volume does not have any function in full tones. Silencer is an expert setting linked to the reactivity setting. HTH

You are absolutely correct... I was referring to silencer. I do understand that it is analogous to iron bias (in the Nox) but didn't understand the difference between -1 and 0. That certainly seems like an odd way of turning it off. To most, 0 would mean "no silencer".
 
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Iron Buzz

Iron Buzz

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5) Why the $@&$^# did they not tie frequency changes to discrimination & tone breakpoints? (that is a side question to the general ID Norm puzzlements, which I don't think any of us really want to rehash)

I admit that would be pretty slick if they coupled frequency changes to tonal breakpoints. Not that it is a big deal to set up adjacent programs for different frequencies and tonal breaks but it would save some time.

I think it is a very big thing. First, how many different programs do you want to have to click through? Especially if you happen to also us a HF coil at times.

Second, figuring out the breakpoints (both for tonal breakpoints, and maybe for disc settings as well) for each frequency for each breakpoint that you want to use is a major pain.
 

vferrari

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I think it is a very big thing. First, how many different programs do you want to have to click through? Especially if you happen to also us a HF coil at times.

Second, figuring out the breakpoints (both for tonal breakpoints, and maybe for disc settings as well) for each frequency for each breakpoint that you want to use is a major pain.

I don't bother with all that tone breakpoint gak - I either use pitch or full tones, in which case you don't need to set tone breaks at all. If you want fixed tone breaks regardless of frequency then use ID norm - all target ID's will be normalized as if the coil is operating at 18 khz regardless of actual frequency. Unfortunately, this does not work for the HF coils as ID NORM is not an option. Ironically, the HF coils do operate in ID NORM on the ORX because the ORX is always fixed in ID NORM and has FIXED tone breaks for 3-Tone coin mode.
 

secondstar

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I don't bother with all that tone breakpoint gak - I either use pitch or full tones, in which case you don't need to set tone breaks at all. If you want fixed tone breaks regardless of frequency then use ID norm - all target ID's will be normalized as if the coil is operating at 18 khz regardless of actual frequency. Unfortunately, this does not work for the HF coils as ID NORM is not an option. Ironically, the HF coils do operate in ID NORM on the ORX because the ORX is always fixed in ID NORM and has FIXED tone breaks for 3-Tone coin mode.

Do you ever run full tones with disc? I switched back to multi tones last year because I found that using multi tones with a disc of 7 helped to produce more stable target ID's, especially when a non-ferrous target lies in close proximity to a ferrous target. I've experimented with using full tones with some disc, and found that this will also help to stabilize target ID's. I don't like that I can't also use iron volume with full tones; so for me, I use 4 tones.

I'm a fan of turning ID norm off on my Deus. I own the X35 coil, and love how the Deus "pushes" coins into the upper extremities of the TID scale when operating at 25 kHz with ID norm turned off. I've preferred an audio response of 3 since day one because for my ears, this setting seems to produce a "swooshing" sound as the coil passes over the clean edge of a coin. Also, audio response set at 3 seems to make coins sound slightly softer in comparison to trash; this helps me tremendously, especially given the fact that my settings result in many different types of targets getting producing a fairly high TID.

At the end of the day, the site influences the settings that one uses, and these settings seem to work well for my neck of the woods.
 

vferrari

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Do you ever run full tones with disc? I switched back to multi tones last year because I found that using multi tones with a disc of 7 helped to produce more stable target ID's, especially when a non-ferrous target lies in close proximity to a ferrous target. I've experimented with using full tones with some disc, and found that this will also help to stabilize target ID's. I don't like that I can't also use iron volume with full tones; so for me, I use 4 tones.

I'm a fan of turning ID norm off on my Deus. I own the X35 coil, and love how the Deus "pushes" coins into the upper extremities of the TID scale when operating at 25 kHz with ID norm turned off. I've preferred an audio response of 3 since day one because for my ears, this setting seems to produce a "swooshing" sound as the coil passes over the clean edge of a coin. Also, audio response set at 3 seems to make coins sound slightly softer in comparison to trash; this helps me tremendously, especially given the fact that my settings result in many different types of targets getting producing a fairly high TID.

At the end of the day, the site influences the settings that one uses, and these settings seem to work well for my neck of the woods.

I only use full tones in a specific detecting situation - when there is a LOT of aluminum trash present and little iron. Because of that I do not run with any discrimination whenever I am running full tones because I DO want to hear iron if it is present and using disc will eliminate the ability for me to do so.

I also typically am running an HF coil but regardless of whether I am running an HF coil or X35 coil, I am running with without ID Normalization.

When I relic hunt in low modern trash, which is my main detecting activity, I almost exclusively use pitch tones. I like the zip-zip of a pure non-ferrous target and it also gives me a sense of the target footprint which also further clues me into the nature of the target.

If I really want to run in a Tone ID setup, I basically put the Deus away, and pull out the Equinox.

HTH
 

secondstar

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Thanks for your input! We don't really have too many "pure" relic sites so I tend to not use pitch. Many of our colonial sites have become party spots, so I rely on a combination of audio and visual output in order to glean target information. Just yesterday I found a 1696 William III copper no more than 5 feet away from a beer can from the 70's! I would like to one day get out on a relic site so that I can try using pitch to sniff out the goodies hidden in the iron.
 

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