Lost galleon of the desert and San felepe wash finds

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Hi My Buddy Crow,, An Indian, a Pima I believe, tol me that it is in the Pinacates in Mexico. That once when it was exposed to an extent, thy found Blue design, porcelin dishes, -- Manilla Trade? -- but it was too much work to excavate down into the hull. When they went back later, it was gone.

 

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[Crow]

Hello Don Jose. Possible however there could a number of scenarios of how the porcelain got there?

Crow

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

hi Crow, true but that simple statement -----? Ceramic dishes were relatively rare in that period, in fact dishes were, you simply ate out of the common cooking vessel.

 

[Oroblanco]

hi Crow, true but that simple statement -----? Ceramic dishes were relatively rare in that period, in fact dishes were, you simply ate out of the common cooking vessel.

Not to be a wet blanket to this particular theory, but the pearl ship was a built-in-Mexico ship, made for the specific task of pearl fishing, unlikely to have any kind of fancy dishes for captain de Iturbe and his crew; more likely it will turn out to be very plain, iron or pewter or clay pots. Remember this was a caravelle, not a Spanish Manila Galleon, much smaller and correct for the task of pearl fishing. I would have to doubt that find of china would be related to Juan de Iturbe and his cargo of rare pearls.

Please do continue, don't let a skeptic stall you!
Oroblanco

 

[Crow]

Not to be a wet blanket to this particular theory, but the pearl ship was a built-in-Mexico ship, made for the specific task of pearl fishing, unlikely to have any kind of fancy dishes for captain de Iturbe and his crew; more likely it will turn out to be very plain, iron or pewter or clay pots. Remember this was a caravelle, not a Spanish Manila Galleon, much smaller and correct for the task of pearl fishing. I would have to doubt that find of china would be related to Juan de Iturbe and his cargo of rare pearls.

Please do continue, don't let a skeptic stall you!
Oroblanco

Hello Oro no you are correct it is a highly probable comment.

I suspect that what ever the shipwreck it was not a Manilla Galleon. In fact very few disappeared over the centuries of the trade. However other small trade vessels involved in coastal trade and smuggling such as small caravel could have brought some trade goods traded from Acapulco up the coast and perhaps wanting to trade with the mission settlements of Baja by was driven North by a hurricane wrecking on the then beach line. Another thought is the ship of Don Jose story could be an entirely different shipwreck than the Pearl ship?

Crow

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Crow, the nearest Manilla Galleon is at Bandera,Bay, cost Rico, under yea many meters of mud.

 

[Crow]

Don Jose what a nice place to being a bit of diving and searching for shipwreck.

Crow

 

[Oroblanco]

Hello Oro no you are correct it is a highly probable comment.

I suspect that what ever the shipwreck it was not a Manilla Galleon. In fact very few disappeared over the centuries of the trade. However other small trade vessels involved in coastal trade and smuggling such as small caravel could have brought some trade goods traded from Acapulco up the coast and perhaps wanting to trade with the mission settlements of Baja by was driven North by a hurricane wrecking on the then beach line. Another thought is the ship of Don Jose story could be an entirely different shipwreck than the Pearl ship?

Crow

HMMMM - another lost ship, like perhaps the last voyage of the pirate ship CONTENT, mayhaps?

The Last Voyage Of The Content Ship Lost in the Desert - DesertUSA

<many other links online, look up Cavenish, the Hugh Gallant etc>

The Content was a pirate vessel of sixty tons burthen, and supposedly sailed up the gulf of California never to return. This particular ship had already had successes in attacking Spanish shipping too, so finding imported Chinese china, would definitely be a hot clue.

Please do continue,
Oroblanco

 

[Crow]

HMMMM - another lost ship, like perhaps the last voyage of the pirate ship CONTENT, mayhaps?

The Last Voyage Of The Content Ship Lost in the Desert - DesertUSA

<many other links online, look up Cavenish, the Hugh Gallant etc>

The Content was a pirate vessel of sixty tons burthen, and supposedly sailed up the gulf of California never to return. This particular ship had already had successes in attacking Spanish shipping too, so finding imported Chinese china, would definitely be a hot clue.

Please do continue,
Oroblanco

Indeed reading through Thomas Cavendish capture of the manila Galleon Santa Anna they cherrypicked the cargo. 100 pounds of gold was divided between the Content and Desire. The Desire made it back to England. The content of course vanished. It may of be possible the the captain of the Content thought lower california was an island and sailed North up thtough the sea cortez only run around on a desert beach later over time the ship bacme a shipwreck lost in the dunes. The value of gold alone is around 1 million dollars if found? Not counting the possible value of the crates of porcelin from China.

Crow

 

[Isayhello2u]

Crow I always wondered if the ship that was said to be in the sand hills near Arizona's Pinacate mountain was the content by all rumors it was larger than the pearl ship and had china dishes.



btw Pegleglooker did a nice radio broadcast recently about the lost ship on the Death Valley Jim Program

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Crow is busy changing diapers, so I'll post my two cents.

The Indians always told me it was in the sand near the Mexican Pinacates, Sonora. But I haven't figured how ?? unless the area has changed radically..

 

[boogeyman]

Oldergoate,

The "Lost Ship of the Desert" referred to in all the magazine articles and stories was found many years ago. It is no secret locally to many people in the Brawley/El Centro Area.

One man used most of the aft section of the Caravelle to build an addition onto his house in the 1950s. It is my understanding that a small portion of the front section is still there, but usually lies under 20-30 feet of blow sand. I was told the whole story by more than a couple of people. I haven't had the chance to go to the spot where the ship sits (no treasure so not that important in the grand scheme).

Look in other thread on this subject to see a satellite pic of the site.

Mike

Hey Mike, was that the guy that had the corral made from some of the planking out back of his place?