Revolutionary War Plate of Some Kind

Lost Signal

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Okay, I'm not sure what this is. It was caked with clay/dirt. I could see a little bit of silver along one edge, so I put it in some lemon juice and water and brushed it with a soft brush. I couldn't believe it when I saw the lion. There was some Revolutionary War action in the region and I assumed it had to be British military, but there is no regiment number and no text, so now I'm doubting it. Although, Insignia of Independence does show some cartridge bag badges that do not have any numbers or letters.
The site had a few tombac buttons but also early 19th century stuff.
The piece is copper alloy with a thick silver plate. It's slightly convex and probably had at least four prongs on the back that seem to have been worked off. The measurements are
3 1/2" X 2 5/8"
Any ideas?
 

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RedLeaf

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That is a crazy good find! the flag looks like a Gryphon on it.... maybe empire of Tartary, but then Whales flag has something like that :icon_scratch: What kind of signal did that ring, that's a large piece of metal
 
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Lost Signal

Lost Signal

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Thanks for the input, everyone. I think the suggested geography could be right (Scotland, Whales) but maybe it has nothing to do with military. Maybe it's like a maker's mark for a company that made tableware, or something like that, and it would be shipped from Europe in a trunk/crate with this "plate" attached.
Don't get me wrong, I'd love for it to be military, but I don't see anything like it in my books or online.
 

Red-Coat

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From a heraldic point of view, I see no particular reason to associate this with Scotland or Wales. The emblems also have wide association throughout the rest of Britain.

The demi-lion waving a banner has seen usage in a number of English counties.

If the animal on the banner had been intended as Welsh 'dragon', it would typically have something issuing from its mouth to represent fire-breathing... most usually an arrow-like tongue. It's a griffin, which has much wider usage throughout Britain.

The lion surmounts what is known as a "mural crown"... a non-royal emblem which again has wide usage.

Although you can see these emblems individually, or as two of the three on the insignia for a number of British regiments, I'm not aware of any insignia which has all three of them. Nor any county or city arms which includes all three.

I'm inclined to think this is not a military item (or at least not a British one), but more probably some kind of heraldic crest used as an adornment on something.
 

Silver Tree Chaser

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Okay, I'm not sure what this is. It was caked with clay/dirt. I could see a little bit of silver along one edge, so I put it in some lemon juice and water and brushed it with a soft brush. I couldn't believe it when I saw the lion. There was some Revolutionary War action in the region and I assumed it had to be British military, but there is no regiment number and no text, so now I'm doubting it. Although, Insignia of Independence does show some cartridge bag badges that do not have any numbers or letters.
The site had a few tombac buttons but also early 19th century stuff.
The piece is copper alloy with a thick silver plate. It's slightly convex and probably had at least four prongs on the back that seem to have been worked off. The measurements are
3 1/2" X 2 5/8"
Any ideas?
I'm looking forward to hearing more about the ID on this wonderful find. I have no expertise on this subject matter, but it would seem that the orientation of the design would be used for some type of cross belt. The use of the piece as some decorative plate for a trunk would run the design side-to-side. Whatever you've found, I think it's totally cool!
 

CRUSADER

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I agree with Red-Coat that it's unlikely to be Military related.
It's Livery elements makes me think it dates to the early 1800's & an important family (not a Regal one though). If I had to guess it went on a horse, rather than person, although I'm not seeing the usual attachment points...
The design doesn't appear on the above site, but you could email them & ask for an ID (of the Family name associated to it, he is unlikely to know it's function), I know he has lots of experience/resources.
 
OP
Lost Signal

Lost Signal

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I agree with Red-Coat that it's unlikely to be Military related.
It's Livery elements makes me think it dates to the early 1800's & an important family (not a Regal one though). If I had to guess it went on a horse, rather than person, although I'm not seeing the usual attachment points...
The design doesn't appear on the above site, but you could email them & ask for an ID (of the Family name associated to it, he is unlikely to know it's function), I know he has lots of experience/resources.
Thanks, Cru and everyone. I knew some Tnet crowd sourcing would zero-in on the answer. "Early 1800's" fits the site and it very well could have decorated a carriage or some leather tack element.
The attachment points don't show up in the photo, but they are there. They seem to have been filed down at some point.
I will definitely reach out to the website that you shared.
 

Digger RJ

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Okay, I'm not sure what this is. It was caked with clay/dirt. I could see a little bit of silver along one edge, so I put it in some lemon juice and water and brushed it with a soft brush. I couldn't believe it when I saw the lion. There was some Revolutionary War action in the region and I assumed it had to be British military, but there is no regiment number and no text, so now I'm doubting it. Although, Insignia of Independence does show some cartridge bag badges that do not have any numbers or letters.
The site had a few tombac buttons but also early 19th century stuff.
The piece is copper alloy with a thick silver plate. It's slightly convex and probably had at least four prongs on the back that seem to have been worked off. The measurements are
3 1/2" X 2 5/8"
Any ideas?
Very Cool!!! Congrats!!!
 

NolanTheExplorer

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Okay, I'm not sure what this is. It was caked with clay/dirt. I could see a little bit of silver along one edge, so I put it in some lemon juice and water and brushed it with a soft brush. I couldn't believe it when I saw the lion. There was some Revolutionary War action in the region and I assumed it had to be British military, but there is no regiment number and no text, so now I'm doubting it. Although, Insignia of Independence does show some cartridge bag badges that do not have any numbers or letters.
The site had a few tombac buttons but also early 19th century stuff.
The piece is copper alloy with a thick silver plate. It's slightly convex and probably had at least four prongs on the back that seem to have been worked off. The measurements are
3 1/2" X 2 5/8"
Any ideas?
Check it out, I found a decorative plate just like that! Same size and shape...just a different design/crest (but I have lion on mine also). Definitively colonial. I was thinkin rev war plate as well...but just dont know.

check thread here: https://www.treasurenet.com/threads/decorative-plate.411278/#post-3967188
 

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screwynewy

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Thanks, Cru and everyone. I knew some Tnet crowd sourcing would zero-in on the answer. "Early 1800's" fits the site and it very well could have decorated a carriage or some leather tack element.
The attachment points don't show up in the photo, but they are there. They seem to have been filed down at some point.
I will definitely reach out to the website that you shared.
Awesome early handmade relic - congrats! I also respect you for not allowing yourself to believe that it might be something that it is not. Too often see people post finds that they are convinced it is something when there is no compelling evidence to prove their claim. Then they get all butt hurt when people try to tell them the truth.
 

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