This is my first post here. I’m excited to see what people think! I found this Livery button in Alberta Canada. Anyone have any info on it? Thanks!!

[LandenH]

 

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[Ed_DE]

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Nice find, Welcome from Delaware.

 

[Coinstar magnet]

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Welcome from Washington state! Look forward to seeing your recoveries.

 

[crashbandicoot]

Welcome landen!hat,s a cool button!

 

[Rhapsody]

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Welcome to the site, very fun in here! Thats a cool button reminds me of a cartoon called 'heckle and jeckle' with two argumentative crows I used to watch as a kid. Nice dig!

 

[jewelerguy]

nice button!

 

[Red-Coat]

Welcome to Tnet.

Very nice button, from a scarce maker: Alfred John Robbins. Not sure when the company was founded, but the first mention I could find was for the company being a “manufacturer of tailor’s trimmings” with the address listed as “14 Mill Street, Conduit Street, London” in 1891. The London Gazette has a notice for the business being dissolved in 1933, shortly before Alfred’s death in 1934.

They seem to have produced livery buttons and also some military buttons… probably for officers’ dress uniforms rather than general service issue.

Heraldically, it looks to be a stork or heron’s head “erased” (torn off, or with a ragged edge) on a torse (that twisted cloth band below). I believe it’s probably a stork, since there is no tuft of feathers at the back of the head. The torse indicates the emblem to be the blazon part of a full armorial which would be more readily attributed if it had been shown in full.

It has some similarity to the blazon for the Sampson family but that’s not the only possibility:

https://sites.google.com/site/liverybuttonsidentified/home/birds---herons-and-stocks

 

[Relicific]

Nice button

 

[Lanny in AB]

Sweet find Landen, that's a great button recovery/save!

Welcome to TNET, and welcome to the fun of finding cool items long lost.

There are lots of great people on TNET with tons of experience in ID'ing finds, and I'm sure others (you've been lucky to have had some great input and comments already) will jump in with some great advice on the provenance of your button.

All the best,

Lanny

 

[Lanny in AB]

Welcome to Tnet.

Very nice button, from a scarce maker: Alfred John Robbins. Not sure when the company was founded, but the first mention I could find was for the company being a “manufacturer of tailor’s trimmings” with the address listed as “14 Mill Street, Conduit Street, London” in 1891. The London Gazette has a notice for the business being dissolved in 1933, shortly before Alfred’s death in 1934.

They seem to have produced livery buttons and also some military buttons… probably for officers’ dress uniforms rather than general service issue.

Heraldically, it looks to be a stork or heron’s head “erased” (torn off, or with a ragged edge) on a torse (that twisted cloth band below). I believe it’s probably a stork, since there is no tuft of feathers at the back of the head. The torse indicates the emblem to be the blazon part of a full armorial which would be more readily attributed if it had been shown in full.

It has some similarity to the blazon for the Sampson family but that’s not the only possibility:
View attachment 2019414
https://sites.google.com/site/liverybuttonsidentified/home/birds---herons-and-stocks

Lots of good information from your research in your post, nicely done!

All the best,

Lanny

 

[Gare]

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Welcome to Treasurenet. I am looking forward to your finds. Thanks for showing !!!

 

[Lanny in AB]

LandenH, you might try posting images of your find on the "What is it" forum thread to see if you can get some help there as well.

All the best,

Lanny

 

[cudamark]

Being found in Canada, and maybe for the Canadian market, maybe a loon?

 

[Digger RJ]

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Cool Button!!! Welcome to Tnet!!!

 

[Hunk-a-lead]

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welcome aboard and that is one sweet button! nice save

 

[oldmxrat]

Cool find, congrats and welcome to Tnet!

 

[ironman123]

Welcome from Texas. Nice find. Show us more.

 

[CRUSADER]

Welcome to Tnet.

Very nice button, from a scarce maker: Alfred John Robbins. Not sure when the company was founded, but the first mention I could find was for the company being a “manufacturer of tailor’s trimmings” with the address listed as “14 Mill Street, Conduit Street, London” in 1891. The London Gazette has a notice for the business being dissolved in 1933, shortly before Alfred’s death in 1934.

They seem to have produced livery buttons and also some military buttons… probably for officers’ dress uniforms rather than general service issue.

Heraldically, it looks to be a stork or heron’s head “erased” (torn off, or with a ragged edge) on a torse (that twisted cloth band below). I believe it’s probably a stork, since there is no tuft of feathers at the back of the head. The torse indicates the emblem to be the blazon part of a full armorial which would be more readily attributed if it had been shown in full.

It has some similarity to the blazon for the Sampson family but that’s not the only possibility:
View attachment 2019414
https://sites.google.com/site/liverybuttonsidentified/home/birds---herons-and-stocks

Good stuff as always.
Very little to add, other than the OP's might be a Heron (tough to be sure).
These Livery were 'mostly' produced in the 1830s-1850s, so it might be a bit earlier. As you have good data, the range could be mid-late 19th C.

 

[Red-Coat]

Good stuff as always.
Very little to add, other than the OP's might be a Heron (tough to be sure).
These Livery were 'mostly' produced in the 1830s-1850s, so it might be a bit earlier. As you have good data, the range could be mid-late 19th C.

Thanks Cru'

As is often the case, the records are incomplete (sometimes lost in the destruction by German bombing during WWII). I have also lost interest in signing up and paying for data, since so many of the information sources that exist have been stitched up by commercial agreements to digitise the records and provide search engines for them.

Nevertheless, from free sources, A.J. Robbins (Alfred John) died on 9th January 1934 so even if he had lived to be 100 and started his business when he was 20, it couldn’t have been in operation before the mid-1850s at the very earliest. First mention of the business as “A.J. Robbins” (that I could find) was 1891 and it couldn’t have been inherited from his father under that name since his father was Edward Victor Robbins. The military buttons with his backmark which can be reliably dated seem to be from around 1900 plus or minus a bit.

Alfred seems to have had two related businesses. He was listed as a “Manchester Warehouseman” (ie a wholesaler for “Manchester cloth”, the term used for a particular kind of cotton fabric produced in Manchester) and a manufacturer of “tailor’s trimmings” (which would include things like buttons). The cloth business may have originally been in his name but I can only find a record for it in partnership with Arthur Herbert Dawson Hayles at a different address (4 Boyle Street, Savile Row, London) and under a different name (A.J. Robbins & Hayles) with that partnership being dissolved on 31st December 1933, just before Alfred’s death. The tailor’s trimmings business was in Alfred’s name only as “A.J. Robbins” at 14 Mill Street.

It could be either heron or stork, but I lean towards stork because heraldic herons are usually depicted with a ‘head crest’ in the plumage at the top/back of their heads like this (Hearne family), although it’s not a 100% reliable distinction:


[picture copyright as per watermark]

 

[LandenH]

Welcome to Tnet.

Very nice button, from a scarce maker: Alfred John Robbins. Not sure when the company was founded, but the first mention I could find was for the company being a “manufacturer of tailor’s trimmings” with the address listed as “14 Mill Street, Conduit Street, London” in 1891. The London Gazette has a notice for the business being dissolved in 1933, shortly before Alfred’s death in 1934.

They seem to have produced livery buttons and also some military buttons… probably for officers’ dress uniforms rather than general service issue.

Heraldically, it looks to be a stork or heron’s head “erased” (torn off, or with a ragged edge) on a torse (that twisted cloth band below). I believe it’s probably a stork, since there is no tuft of feathers at the back of the head. The torse indicates the emblem to be the blazon part of a full armorial which would be more readily attributed if it had been shown in full.

It has some similarity to the blazon for the Sampson family but that’s not the only possibility:
View attachment 2019414
https://sites.google.com/site/liverybuttonsidentified/home/birds---herons-and-stocks

Thanks Cru'

As is often the case, the records are incomplete (sometimes lost in the destruction by German bombing during WWII). I have also lost interest in signing up and paying for data, since so many of the information sources that exist have been stitched up by commercial agreements to digitise the records and provide search engines for them.

Nevertheless, from free sources, A.J. Robbins (Alfred John) died on 9th January 1934 so even if he had lived to be 100 and started his business when he was 20, it couldn’t have been in operation before the mid-1850s at the very earliest. First mention of the business as “A.J. Robbins” (that I could find) was 1891 and it couldn’t have been inherited from his father under that name since his father was Edward Victor Robbins. The military buttons with his backmark which can be reliably dated seem to be from around 1900 plus or minus a bit.

Alfred seems to have had two related businesses. He was listed as a “Manchester Warehouseman” (ie a wholesaler for “Manchester cloth”, the term used for a particular kind of cotton fabric produced in Manchester) and a manufacturer of “tailor’s trimmings” (which would include things like buttons). The cloth business may have originally been in his name but I can only find a record for it in partnership with Arthur Herbert Dawson Hayles at a different address (4 Boyle Street, Savile Row, London) and under a different name (A.J. Robbins & Hayles) with that partnership being dissolved on 31st December 1933, just before Alfred’s death. The tailor’s trimmings business was in Alfred’s name only as “A.J. Robbins” at 14 Mill Street.

It could be either heron or stork, but I lean towards stork because heraldic herons are usually depicted with a ‘head crest’ in the plumage at the top/back of their heads like this (Hearne family), although it’s not a 100% reliable distinction:

View attachment 2019856
[picture copyright as per watermark]

This is fascinating! Thank you so much for looking in to this for me! It’s very much appreciated