To heck with coins - whats the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls???

[Hill City Rebel]

To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

I've used 1265s and 1266s with 11" coil, Nautilus IIB with 15" coil, and various Tesoros, Whites, Garretts, and etc., etc., and have finally emptied my hunting spots here in Vicksburg of the "easy" shells and cannon balls. I know there are a few lurking out there still, though, just a bit deeper than my machines are willing to talk about. Has anyone a suggestion for a machine that will coax those last few to the surface?

 

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[bakergeol]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

Your next step for increased depth would be a high end PI with a large coil. I am certain my PI with a large coil would outclass anything you have used so far. There just is so far you can go with coil size with a VLF as they are effected by ground mineralization. However as PIs are not effected by mineralization as VLFs are it is a different story with coil size for PIs.

However, when you are talking high end PIs with monster coils you are talking major bucks. If I was in your shoes I would take a look at this machine.
http://www.magnawand.com/

It is a magnetometer which is reasonably priced. What makes this mag different from others is that it can tell the difference between flat steel and steel with depth. I have always wondered if it could ID cannonballs at depth.Of course I would take a model at the store and check it out in the parking lot with an actual cannonball before I bought one.

Hope this helps.
George

 

[Hill City Rebel]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

Hmmmm. George, that thing looks interesting. I didn't find a price - guess I'll have to call them tomorrow. Their depth specs were confusing. But a steel drum at 10 feet ain't bad... HCR

 

[bakergeol]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

Hmmmm. George, that thing looks interesting. I didn't find a price - guess I'll have to call them tomorrow. Their depth specs were confusing. But a steel drum at 10 feet ain't bad... HCR

HCR

I run a mag with my PI. What you will find is that iron items which have a good shape such as cannonballs are detected much deeper than flat items of the same size. They use PK nails as an example as they are detected length wise. Knowing the difference between flat trash and solid iron(with depth) is important when digging deep holes.

George

 

[Siegfried Schlagrule]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

One of my speculations is what could you do with the torpedo type utility detectors that fisher sells so cheaply. If they detect cast iron wouldn't they also detect cannon balls and iron pots? Perhaps they wouldn't go deep enough to suit you but someday I'll rent one and run it over my test patch and see what it can do. exanimo, siegfried schlagrule

 

[Hill City Rebel]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

I tried that Fisher PI rig that they use for locating underground pipes, etc., but never found a thing with it. One of the problems was that I could never get used to the reverse null of the thing - the signal goes from a steady high beat frequency to a lower beat frequency when it detects metal. Somehow or other, it just wouldn't work for me. It reminded me of one of the early cheap PI machines that sounded like a boat motor. Bout drove me crazy. HCR

 

[Sandman]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

Your next step for increased depth would be a high end PI with a large coil. I am certain my PI with a large coil would outclass anything you have used so far. There just is so far you can go with coil size with a VLF as they are effected by ground mineralization. However as PIs are not effected by mineralization as VLFs are it is a different story with coil size for PIs.

Even the Whites PI's and Garrett's are lots better at deep stuff than any VLF. They are even deeper than Minelabs. However a Minelab with a WOT coil is pretty deep and still gives you some discrimination. However Disc. cuts down on depth and you are looking for iron so I would go with the PI's.

Good Luck,
Sandman

 

[Hill City Rebel]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

Your next step for increased depth would be a high end PI with a large coil. I am certain my PI with a large coil would outclass anything you have used so far. There just is so far you can go with coil size with a VLF as they are effected by ground mineralization. However as PIs are not effected by mineralization as VLFs are it is a different story with coil size for PIs.

Even the Whites PI's and Garrett's are lots better at deep stuff than any VLF. They are even deeper than Minelabs. However a Minelab with a WOT coil is pretty deep and still gives you some discrimination. However Disc. cuts down on depth and you are looking for iron so I would go with the PI's.

Good Luck,
Sandman

Any suggestions as to brand/model? Thanks, HCR

 

[bakergeol]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

Your next step for increased depth would be a high end PI with a large coil. I am certain my PI with a large coil would outclass anything you have used so far. There just is so far you can go with coil size with a VLF as they are effected by ground mineralization. However as PIs are not effected by mineralization as VLFs are it is a different story with coil size for PIs.

Even the Whites PI's and Garrett's are lots better at deep stuff than any VLF. They are even deeper than Minelabs. However a Minelab with a WOT coil is pretty deep and still gives you some discrimination. However Disc. cuts down on depth and you are looking for iron so I would go with the PI's.

Good Luck,
Sandman

Any suggestions as to brand/model? Thanks, HCR

You know a thought just occurred to me. You are near Tennesse. Dixie detectors sells the Nexus which is the deepest non PI out there. http://www.dixie-metal-detectors.com/nexus.htm
Perhaps they would have some information(I would look how it handles ground mineralization) for you. http://www.nexusdetectors.com/Testspagecontinue.html


First off you should be aware that a few discriminating PIs are going to be released this year. I am waiting for the Pulse Devil to be released. This detector($2000) will probably make all current PIs obsolete with regards to discrimination.(Probably all high end VLFs too). The question is just when?- late summer?- Fall? Probably before the PD is released, Whites will introduce a new discriminating PI this year..

There are a lot of good PIs currently out there and one has a tendency to have a bit of a bias of what one thinks is best. As I have used Minelab PIs I have a bias in this regard. There may be a deeper PI for your purpose(better for large deep iron only and not small metal) out there and hopefully someone else will chime in. (My current PI is a GS5 which has better iron discrimination which I desperately need, however you don't need discrimination and it is quite expensive).

I will let Sandman discuss White's PI as I have no experience with this model or with Garrett's Infinium. These are quite a bit cheaper than Minelab's selection of PIs(Infinium - $1000) and perhaps they could do the job.

If I have any questions about the above models it is with the availability of very large deep coils. I know that the Infinium doesn't have a good coil selection(I believe max is a 14").

I would look at a used Minelab SD or GP model. Gold prospectors use the deepest PIs with ground balancing and Minelab is the king for the prospecting community. Used SD models can be had for less than $1500. They have the advantage of very large coils(Coiltex or nuggetfinder)- such as the UFO 12" x 24". Checking out the nugget forums (nuggetshooter nuggethunting forums) there are always a good selection of used PIs and used coils. Always e-bay has a good selection of used Minelab equipment. A lot of relic hunters are quietly using Minelab PIs even with the lack of discrimination for bad ground or deep relics beyond the range of VLFs. Again my bias toward Minelab.

My 2 cents
George

 

[Hill City Rebel]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

George, you've really given me some things to ponder. It's been years since I've used a PI detector, but I'm definitely considering one of the ones you've mentioned. The Nexus is certainly an impressive machine - expensive, too. I'll do some research on the other brands, including the Minelabs, but may wait for the Devil to show himself. What have you heard about that detector that has you anticipating it so? Anything else you might suggest will be welcomed. Thanks much! HCR

 

[99thpercentile]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

I'll be back in Vicksburg in August and we should get together. I would love to look for some cannonballs. I have real geophysical metal detectors at work that would do just fine. I am hoping to do some geophysics at the military park for fun in the next year.

Ryan

 

[bakergeol]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

George, you've really given me some things to ponder. It's been years since I've used a PI detector, but I'm definitely considering one of the ones you've mentioned. The Nexus is certainly an impressive machine - expensive, too. I'll do some research on the other brands, including the Minelabs, but may wait for the Devil to show himself. What have you heard about that detector that has you anticipating it so? Anything else you might suggest will be welcomed. Thanks much! HCR

Hi HCR
Here is a link for the PD- This forum prospectinginoz is the forum where Dave Emery posts information about the PD.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ProspectinginOz/message/2881
Do a Pulse Devil search and go back to previous posts for additional information.
He even has a short list of metal detector dealers who will be selling the PD( I am on one dealers list).
The PD is currently being tested in Europe however when Dave will release it for production is at present unknown.
Here is my thinking. We are about at the end of the road for what we can do with VLF technology.
The great limiting factor for VLFs is that they all are affected by ground mineralization. Ground mineralization limits the depth of a VLF and it's ability to ID an object with depth. You will quickly find the "iffy" zone with a VLF for metal ID for deep items. This exists because the deeper one goes the more ground mineralization your VLF reads and conversely good targets read toward the iron end.

PIs are different because they are not affected by ground mineralization to the same degree as VLFs. That is why they are popular(with ground balancing) in mineralized nugget areas as they have great depth. The first time I used a ML SD2200 I was blow away by it's depth. It made my Ex2 and X-5 look like a Radio Shack toy in the depth department, however, it couldn't discriminate. So the "holy grail" has always been a PI that had true effective discrimination.

So the race is on to develop the first true discriminating PI or a PI with a discrimination circuit similar to a VLFs. It will be the next level above the VLF in technology. There is a French company coming coming out with the Adonis. Alan W. is working on the GoldSweeper. White's will introduce a discriminating PI this year.

The issue is more than just a leap in depth. It is more accurate metal ID with depth as PIs are not affected by ground mineralization as VLFs are. Dave's PD will have a TID function for coin shooting and relic hunting.

George

 

[Hill City Rebel]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

George, you've really given me some things to ponder. It's been years since I've used a PI detector, but I'm definitely considering one of the ones you've mentioned. The Nexus is certainly an impressive machine - expensive, too. I'll do some research on the other brands, including the Minelabs, but may wait for the Devil to show himself. What have you heard about that detector that has you anticipating it so? Anything else you might suggest will be welcomed. Thanks much! HCR

Hi HCR
Here is a link for the PD- This forum prospectinginoz is the forum where Dave Emery posts information about the PD.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ProspectinginOz/message/2881
Do a Pulse Devil search and go back to previous posts for additional information.
He even has a short list of metal detector dealers who will be selling the PD( I am on one dealers list).
The PD is currently being tested in Europe however when Dave will release it for production is at present unknown.
Here is my thinking. We are about at the end of the road for what we can do with VLF technology.
The great limiting factor for VLFs is that they all are affected by ground mineralization. Ground mineralization limits the depth of a VLF and it's ability to ID an object with depth. You will quickly find the "iffy" zone with a VLF for metal ID for deep items. This exists because the deeper one goes the more ground mineralization your VLF reads and conversely good targets read toward the iron end.

PIs are different because they are not affected by ground mineralization to the same degree as VLFs. That is why they are popular(with ground balancing) in mineralized nugget areas as they have great depth. The first time I used a ML SD2200 I was blow away by it's depth. It made my Ex2 and X-5 look like a Radio Shack toy in the depth department, however, it couldn't discriminate. So the "holy grail" has always been a PI that had true effective discrimination.

So the race is on to develop the first true discriminating PI or a PI with a discrimination circuit similar to a VLFs. It will be the next level above the VLF in technology. There is a French company coming coming out with the Adonis. Alan W. is working on the GoldSweeper. White's will introduce a discriminating PI this year.

The issue is more than just a leap in depth. It is more accurate metal ID with depth as PIs are not affected by ground mineralization as VLFs are. Dave's PD will have a TID function for coin shooting and relic hunting.

George

George, you are really up on all the PI info. Please keep my email address - allredma@bellsouth.net - and let me know of developments as they occur. When the PD comes out, the race will be on to be the first - and, of course, I want to be first in Vkbg. Or you can post a comment at my treasure hunting blog, www.treasurehunter.booklocker.com, and let others read of your research and conclusions. Thank you MUCH. HCR. PS I'm going to the PD website now.

 

[Hill City Rebel]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

I'll be back in Vicksburg in August and we should get together. I would love to look for some cannonballs. I have real geophysical metal detectors at work that would do just fine. I am hoping to do some geophysics at the military park for fun in the next year.

Ryan

Ryan, it's awful hot here in Vicksburg in August. Before or after deer gun season would be much better (season date hasn't been set yet). But if you can't make that, let me know when you arrive - maybe we can try out that new PD. HCR

 

[Monty]

Re: To heck with coins - what's the best machine for deeeeep cannon balls

My Garrett Sea Hunter II will go as deep as I would ever want to dig. It's a PI unit designed for underwater use, but shouldn't have a problem with somethng the size of a cannon ball down to a couple of feet. It's in the $700.00 price range and affordable compared to many of the other PI machines. Monty