Treasure Mountain, CO - Lost Frenchmens Gold

mdog

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Mar 22, 2011
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Hello mdog

This might be of interest? There is a record in the Saone-et-Loire, France Births, 1546-1905

Name: Louis Villemont
Birth Date: 27 avr. 1741 (27 Apr 1741)
Birth Parish: Cluny (notre Dame)
Gender: masculin (Male)
Father: André Villemont
Father Occupation: Maistre de danse
Mother: Claudine Voguet
1st Witness/Godfather: CHACHUAT Louis Greffier
2nd Witness/Godmother: ROLLET Marguerite Fille de Benoist blanchisseur

Also this might be of interest?

Louis Joseph De Villemont Born in LA, Orleans Parish, New Orleans on 22 Sep 1767 to Jean Pierre De Villemont and Françoise Dorothée Devillièrs. Death date unknown????

Born on 1742 to De Villemont and Mme De Villemont. Jean Pierre married Françoise Dorothée Devillièrs and had a child. He passed away on 1781.

Amy

Hello Amy,

Louis Joseph Villemont is the Villemont I've been looking for. Thanks to you, I now have a place of birth and a date of birth. I haven't been able to find a date of death either. However, in 1848 there was a case for a validation of a Spanish land grant by the Villemont family and one of the petitioners was a Louis de Villemont. I don't know if that was him or not, if it was, he was pretty old.

https://law.resource.org/pub/us/case/reporter/F.Cas/0007.f.cas/0007.f.cas.0560.6.pdf

His father, jean Pierre, was a dualist and I believe he died from wounds suffered in a duel.

Petit de Coulange Family Notes :: Colonial Arkansas Post Ancestry

Petit de Coulange Family Notes :: Colonial Arkansas Post Ancestry Page 3 is Pierre.

Thanks again, Amy.

Rick
 
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mdog

Bronze Member
Mar 22, 2011
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Any chance you might offer a GPS and the photo of the shaft? I may try to go have a look-see as soon as the snow is melted off in the next couple of months.

UncleMatt, I don't know the coordinates and the picture is not very good in the book. I tried to take a picture, but it's so dark you can't make anything out. The top of the shaft is on pretty flat ground and its lined with rock. It's about 10-12 feet across. I can't see any landmarks because it's in a lot of trees.

Rick
 

mdog

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Mar 22, 2011
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The Confederate National and Battle flags were red, white and blue also.

I know that the timing for the second French expedition - 1844-1848 - was wrong for a direct Reb connection, but those dates coincide with the Mexican-American War, which very much had implications for future plans of those in Texas and New Orleans who later did become the Confederacy. The French supported the Confederacy during the Civil War, at least on a money basis, and were about to side with them diplomatically until the North started winning on the battlefields.

Notwithstanding Villemont and Pike's documented but not-fully-explained snooping in the general San Luis Valley treasure legend arena (well worth pursuing), it's troubling that there is no solid bedrock establishing the activities or players in the French "recovery expedition" of LeBreau. As Amy discovered, the French names don't jibe at all. Also, I've found no mention of such an event in numerous reports from Taos Anglos of the period, or in the many surviving memoirs of the trappers who were active in virtually every canyon in the region for many years.

Current working model for me (always subject to change when facts emerge): the LeBreau 1844-1848 recovery story details were likely fabricated by Ward. Whether or not Ward had any knowledge of truly secret activities by any parties in Colorado is speculative, but possible. The so-called post-Civil War Confederate secret service (aka KGC, OAK, et al) may have cached valuables with a French connection (Maximilian's loot?) somewhere in the area.

I have to agree with you. I think an expedition of 50 men going in, with pack animals, would have been noticed, and commented on, by somebody. Documentation from the first expedition would prove helpful but, it seems the only account of the first expedition, was by a man, Lebreau, who doesn't exist.

Just for fun, if the Spanish had information that the first expedition originated in Halifax, Nova Scotia, that's less than 50 miles from Oak Island. :laughing7:
 
Aug 23, 2013
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I have to agree with you. I think an expedition of 50 men going in, with pack animals, would have been noticed, and commented on, by somebody. Documentation from the first expedition would prove helpful but, it seems the only account of the first expedition, was by a man, Lebreau, who doesn't exist.

Just for fun, if the Spanish had information that the first expedition originated in Halifax, Nova Scotia, that's less than 50 miles from Oak Island. :laughing7:

Interesting assumption about this first French expedition. Halifax was in control by the British in 1790? In 1790, at Halifax, there are 4,000 inhabitants and 700 houses. France was still reeling from the French revolution with Waring parties guillotining each other. There would of been no love lost between the British and the French, to even allow an expedition of Frenchmen from Halifax, Especially straight after the war of independence where France sided with the United States.

Could the origins of this first expedition was part of the spurious land claim made by the Villemont family ( which one of their family was involved in ) from New Orleans which apparently failed as highlighted in the Document mdog found in the University of Arkansas that over time morph into back ground facts of the treasure mountain story?

Amy
 
Aug 23, 2013
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Another thing interesting as many of you here has previously mentioned is how parts of treasure stories Morph in another over time?

Many treasure stories are like a proverbial ball of snakes as they wind their way through connecting themselves in small ways to real events to give them some sort of authenticy? While the rest of it is winding and tangling itself with snakes of folklore and Fiction. Just when you think it is untangle the ball of snakes, bang the snakes bites you.

Kudos to all that have contributed excellent posts to a fascinating thread. Please do continue....Colorado is fascinating place for me regardless...

Amy
 

UncleMatt

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Another thing interesting as many of you here has previously mentioned is how parts of treasure stories Morph in another over time?

Many treasure stories are like a proverbial ball of snakes as they wind their way through connecting themselves in small ways to real events to give them some sort of authenticy? While the rest of it is winding and tangling itself with snakes of folklore and Fiction. Just when you think it is untangle the ball of snakes, bang the snakes bites you.

Kudos to all that have contributed excellent posts to a fascinating thread. Please do continue....Colorado is fascinating place for me regardless...

Amy

Amy, what databases are you employing exactly? I have spoken with you in the past about a list of Spanish/French names I was trying to track down, and wonder if you used those same databases to check for those?
 
Aug 23, 2013
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Amy, what databases are you employing exactly? I have spoken with you in the past about a list of Spanish/French names I was trying to track down, and wonder if you used those same databases to check for those?

Record in the Saone-et-Loire, France Births, 1546-1905.

As well as searching Border Crossings, Shipping records, Census records, State census records tax Records. Poll tax records. Newspapers, google search engine. Google books. free online historic newspapers and University data bases with indexes online. As you can imagine not all are in the same places you have to have and idea of the name and idea where might be found. There is littoral millions of documents to plow through not all are digitized either. And some data bases with have spelling variations on the same name.

Another thing having french or Spanish names does not mean automatically they were born in that country either. They could be son or daughter of an immigrant. Another thing that helps is a rough date to work with that name.

It late once again

Bonne nuit mon curieux . Il faut dormir .

Amy
 

UncleMatt

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Amy, I sent you a PM with more details. Let me know if you can assist. Thanks
 

mdog

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Mar 22, 2011
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Interesting assumption about this first French expedition. Halifax was in control by the British in 1790? In 1790, at Halifax, there are 4,000 inhabitants and 700 houses. France was still reeling from the French revolution with Waring parties guillotining each other. There would of been no love lost between the British and the French, to even allow an expedition of Frenchmen from Halifax, Especially straight after the war of independence where France sided with the United States.

Could the origins of this first expedition was part of the spurious land claim made by the Villemont family ( which one of their family was involved in ) from New Orleans which apparently failed as highlighted in the Document mdog found in the University of Arkansas that over time morph into back ground facts of the treasure mountain story?

Amy

I want to make sure I understand your second paragraph. Maynard Adams introduced Captain Louis de Villemont in his Citadel Mountain books, which were published during and after 1993. It's possible that Adams knew of the history of the Villemonts and decided to incorporate Captain Louis de Villemont into the Treasure Mountain legend. Also, perhaps he did the same with the Spanish letter describing an expedition by the British from Halifax into New Mexico Territory. In other words, Adams knew of these events and made them part of the legend. That makes sense. There is something else he might have used in his books, Adams claimed that the French gave the name Citadel Mountain to the mountain that today is known as Treasure Mountain. In Halifax, Fort George is on a hill called Citadel Hill.
 

mdog

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Mar 22, 2011
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Bonne nuit mon curieux . Il faut dormir .

Good night my curious. You have to sleep.

My wife says that to me every night but not in French and without the charm. Her's is more like " If you think you're sleeping late in the morning, You're crazy." :laughing7:
 
Aug 23, 2013
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Amy, I sent you a PM with more details. Let me know if you can assist. Thanks

In regards to

Toribio Hernandez. no record found of man in 18th century? Many Toribio Hernandez Crossing Mexican Border around 1900????

Felecito Garcia No record in 18th century. 1 Record of Felecito Garcia crossing the Mexican Border into United States in 1916. See below

us border crossings garcia Felicita.jpg

Rene de l' Archeveque it appears has no known connection I can see to to Jean de l' Archeveque you can see below.

JEAN.jpg

77681e3c-d360-4cc5-9147-4e8f1c2940f9.jpg

2c08c278-ec9f-4560-8281-2192122e150f.jpg

1688.jpg

b894f68c-122c-47a1-8794-ab3fa6cbb8c3.jpg

Also this guy: Charles Jacques no one by that names was a mining engineer by own his own clock company in NY traveled the United States selling his clocks. There is no record ever of a miner engineer by that names crossing over the Border from Mexico. You can see his passport below.

united state passport application chales jaques.jpg

my apologies I will add the rest of the application for a passport.

Passport application Jaques picture.jpg

Passport application Jaques.jpg

He lived in new York but traveled around the country. There no records of any mining engineer of that name traveling across the united States / Mexico Border Crossing index

Amy
 
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sdcfia

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Hey, mdog, the thought just occurred to me that the Treasure Mountain story surfaced in 1921 in a newspaper serial written by Josiah Ward, a protege of George Hearst, a guy with gold mines in New Mexico in the late 1800s, and who is alleged by some to have made some sort of cache recovery in the 1840s.

Coincidentally, the so-called Beale Treasure came to light in 1885 in a pamphlet supposedly written by a guy named James Ward, in which some sort of New Mexico gold recovery took place in the 1840s. I'm not up to speed on the Beale story, but already I'm seeing coincidences - and you know what I think about those ...
 

mdog

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Mar 22, 2011
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Hey, mdog, the thought just occurred to me that the Treasure Mountain story surfaced in 1921 in a newspaper serial written by Josiah Ward, a protege of George Hearst, a guy with gold mines in New Mexico in the late 1800s, and who is alleged by some to have made some sort of cache recovery in the 1840s.

Coincidentally, the so-called Beale Treasure came to light in 1885 in a pamphlet supposedly written by a guy named James Ward, in which some sort of New Mexico gold recovery took place in the 1840s. I'm not up to speed on the Beale story, but already I'm seeing coincidences - and you know what I think about those ...

Yes, the evidence seems to lead to an Organization setup. I think you probably spotted this early in the thread. For those of you who don't study these types of things, there seems to have been a well organized effort to use treasure legends to draw attention to specific areas for, who knows what reason. You have to think way outside the box to understand this stuff, and most people blow it off as conspiracy theory or else they don't want to deal with anything so complicated. Steve Clark writes about this stuff in his book New Mexico Confidential. I started looking at these setups after I read his book and evidence of such sites is indisputable. But, the subject is a real conversation killer. The reason I bring it up is, it's a tool that can be used with the other research you do when studying a treasure legend. It's very likely that Treasure Mountain is the beginning of the trail and not the end of it.

That being said, I intend to research the expedition from Halifax, mentioned in Spanish letters from 1797 and 1801. If solid evidence can be found that such an expedition was mining in Colorado, it would give the Treasure Mountain legend legs to stand on. That would make the Organization link even more fascinating.
 

UncleMatt

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I don't think any kind of conspiracy is involved at all, other than the desire to sell newspapers with treasure stories.
 

mdog

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Mar 22, 2011
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I'm quite sure it does...it's also why I have faith there is treasure left...because it was likely stashed in more than one location. But I absolutely believe LeBreau's stash is connected to another well known Colorado treasure legend...the LUE.

Hey Randy, you might be right about a connection between the Lue Map and the Treasure Mountain Legend. I've never studied the Lue Map before, but with just some basic knowledge about treasure legends, and using google earth, you can connect eight treasure legends with the Lue Map. It could be the Lue Map leads to three areas associated with treasure legends, Oak Island, the Beale and Wildcat Bluff down in Arkansas, top, middle and bottom. The O over the eye (I), Oak Island, the bold faced point of the arrow forming a V, Villamont, Virginia, Beale legend, and the three triangles in the lower right corner forming a W, Wildcat Bluff, Arkansas, KGC treasure legend. If you go to google earth and run lines from these three places to Treasure Mountain, you pass over Marble Mountain, Blanca Peak and Culebra Peak, all associated with treasure legends.

Just speculation but maybe something somebody can use in their research.
 
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Aug 23, 2013
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Gentlemen you might find this story of interest in the Herald Democrat, April 27, 1892?

Herald Democrat, April 27, 1892.jpg

Herald Democrat, April 27, 1892 p2.jpg


Also this article may be of interest in the Weekly Ignacio Chieftain, September 24, 1915

Weekly Ignacio Chieftain, September 24, 1915.jpg

Amy
 
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mdog

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Mar 22, 2011
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Here's a picture of the Lue Map and my speculation about what it might mean.
lue map.jpg


The pyramid with the T is Treasure Mountain. The shadow is on the west side of Treasure Mountain, so the sun is in the east. The five steps are five peaks east of Treasure Mountain. These peaks are Marble Mountain, Blanca Peak, Culebra Peak, Spanish Peaks and Black Mountain, nine miles east of Medano Pass. Black Mountain is a coded place name that I've posted about in the past. These peaks are also represented by the five lines going from Treasure Mountain to the east and represented by an arrow. If you go to google earth and mark these five peaks and then connect them with a line, you will have a shape similar to a pentagon. This is a huge surface layout of the constellation AURIGA. I've written about this layout in my KGC thread. If you split the word AURIGA into an AU and an RIGA, you have an AU which is the elemental symbol for GOLD. If you translate RIGA from Italian to English, you get LINE. GOLD LINE or GOLD LINES. The vertical column is the Mississippi River. The arrow shows that there will be five lines going east from Treasure Mountain. Three of these are important, the top and bottom bold marked lines and the middle line that extends to the point of the arrowhead. The eye with the circle over it represents Oak Island, O and EYE, O and I, Oak Island. The bold line of the arrowhead forms a V, this stands for Villamont, Virginia which represents the Beale legend. The three triangles at the bottom right of the Lue Map form a W which represents Wildcat Bluff, Arkansas, site of a KGC treasure legend. On google earth, start a line at each of these three sites and run the lines to Treasure Mountain. The line from Oak Island goes over Marble Mountain, the line from Villamont goes over Blanca Peak and the line from Wildcat Bluff goes over Culebra Peak. Run two more lines from Treasure Mountain over Black Mountain and Spanish Peaks and extend them east. I can't see where they go to a place of importance. If you look at these five lines, you will see that the three important lines have an unimportant line between them, just like the arrow on the Lue Map. You will also notice that the bottom line of unimportance is shown crossing the line of the Mississippi and the other unimportant line isn't. That's because the top line of unimportance is the Black Mountain line and Black Mountain is a coded name and must remain invisible. Another clue that shows the importance of the top, middle and bottom lines is the curved line that follows the arrow. It touches the bottom line, the top line and seems to end at the point of the arrowhead, same as the middle line.

Anyway, those are my observations, right or wrong.
 

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