Vacant lots

[rey914v8]

There are some vacant lots in my area. What I would like to know is how would you attack this opportunity.
The area is about 300 feet front by 200 feet deep. I know that one of the houses that was there had a pool filled in when demoed. These lots are for sale by some realestate co.Would I just go and dig, or is the a method to this madness?

 

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[mlayers]

You need to try and find the owners and contact them.....Matt

 

[rey914v8]

thanks for the reply. There are no keep out signs

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Hey rey914v8, you are asking this question on a forum, where some folks will say you need permission to hunt public sandboxes, so what did you expect? Sure, vacant lots are "owned" by someone, no matter how abandoned, no matter how many short-cut trails criss-cross them, etc... Sure, it might be the city (eminent domain, etc...) or it might be a mega-corp. in some other state who's going to develope it someday into a strip-mall, or it may be a property owner more local, who lets it sit abandoned because the area is so blighted it doesn't pay to develope it in this economy, etc...

Personally, I do not hesitate to check any un-posted vacant lot. But as I say, do you want the technical answer or the realistic one?

As for vacant lots in general for md'ing, they'd only be good if located in old parts of town, and usually only good when first demo'd/scraped. If they've sat for years and become weed-choked, and trashed with vagrant camps and such, then they quickly become intolerably junky.

 

[bazinga]

As for vacant lots in general for md'ing, they'd only be good if located in old parts of town, and usually only good when first demo'd/scraped. If they've sat for years and become weed-choked, and trashed with vagrant camps and such, then they quickly become intolerably junky.

THIS.

I love to hunt the fresh tear downs. Soft dirt and it's easy digging and I can dig most all signals. But once they have been covered up for years and years with weeds, it's just not worth it to me. So, I dig a mercury dime, an indian head, and a few wheats, while having to deal with years of people throwing trash into the lot. Since the old targets can be 6" deep or on the surface, you have to dig it all if you want the good stuff, and it has just never been worth it to me. There are so many little pieces of metal from a house being torn down that sound identical to silver, wheats, indians, etc. I can go to the park and find more in less time usually.

Plus, when they are freshly torn down you can find cool stuff like Marbles, old plastic or rubber toys like Auburn, etc. Or you could be like my buddy and find a stainless class ring laying on top.

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

Personally, I do not hesitate to check any un-posted vacant lot.

That's how someone can get fined, lose their detectors and/or - make metal detectorists look bad.

I don't advocate "getting permission to detect a sandbox" - but I do advocate knowing where you are - at all times - because, if it was MY lot that was for sale, or I just bought - and I found you on it without asking, I just might call the cops. (probably not, but a lot of people would).

The facts of the matter are this: in some places - like here in South Dakota - you have to have it posted if you want to keep people out. If there is no keep out sign, you can go on the land.

I don't think it is ever a mistake to respect OTHER people's private property.

Beth

 

[rey914v8]

well like i said before the demo was done about a year and a half no thur traffic no weeds,just demo and leveled.being sold by a realestate company no fence up no keep out signs. The area ,village is on the national registration of history . but i doubt that anyone would care. Ill let you know If I get thrown off or arrested.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

rey914v8, a few more things to keep in mind:

a) there might have been fill-dirt added on top, after the demo 1.5 yrs. ago.

b) the demo contractor might have taken the "short cut" that some do, and .... instead of skimming off the top few inches, simply spin "donuts" with their tractor, when it gets down the final rubble, making everything appear to be a dirt surface, rather than taking the time to properly pick up the final chunks and junk. If you start getting entire rebar concrete chunks, tin siding shards, etc.... then you'll know they didn't scrape enough.

c) The San Jose area has an active club, with several member who are very "wise" to demolition. If it's in a good historic area (as you say), I doubt very highly someone there hasn't already pulverzied it. Have you been to the San Jose club meetings? 2nd Thurs. of each month.

Beth, can you cite any examples of anyone getting fined or having their detector confiscated, for detecting an un-posted vacant lot?

 

[rey914v8]

Thanks again

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

You might want to read about some of the experiences of folks right here on Tnet.



http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,406205.msg2890592.html#msg2890592

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,300787.0.html

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,315947.0.html

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,153894.0.html

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,78168.0.html

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,87160.0/viewResults.html

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,77795.0.html



This is just off the top of the lists. There are dozens and dozens of instances on this forum, where folks got into trouble, both on private land, and on city/town/park properties.

CYA - and cover ours. (meaning the whole metal detecting community).


Beth

 

[tarus64]

I had a guy pm me from another forum 2yrs.past introducing himself and asking if I wanted to hunt sure I said.Met up with him east of town at a abandonded house sight we hunted I found a standing liberty and some Wheaties after about 3 hours,before parting way I mentioned wanting to return if it was fine by him he said fair game the city owned the property.I was about a 100 hours into the lot digging all signals to get to some more goodies when approached by law-enforcment ,the land wasn't fair game and the guy I first hunted with hasn't returned any calls.All that happened was a trespass warning. away I did still like to know who owns the place it was giving up some coins(Back of the property had been a bait store)

 

[LM]

It's like anything else 'gray area'.

You can do it 100 times without trouble, until the 1 time you get caught.
It might only be a warning, it might be a ticket or fine, it might be a trespass charge...

If the reward in question were a lode of spanish gold, then the risk/reward metrics are there... but realistically, your reward is some pennies and nickles and lots of garbage. It isn't so much the fine, as it is the risk that you eventually do catch a charge, even an insignificant one.

In the internet era, every single thing you do is a matter of public record- god forbid a bored crime beat newspaper reporter decides to do a little write-up on a 'quirky' crime involving a guy with a metal detector and it winds up on Google... But really, for those with professional careers or in competitive-hire fields, do you really want to be applying for a job and have to explain a trespassing charge to the human resources zombie? In this case, the "loss" is having your resume constantly bottom-barreled due to a criminal record and can be measure in tens, or even hundreds, of thousands of dollars in income/opportunity lost- all over a stupid criminal charge that stemmed from wanting to find a wheat penny you could buy on ebay for .10 cents.

 

[DanRiverMan]

If It is NOT POSTED, they can ask you to leave, THATS IT..PERIOD...NO TICKETS , confiscation, bla bla bla....I have been asked to leave several places over the years..Leave and dont go back, end of discussion...On the other side I have detected HUNDREDS of Vacant places without any problem at all...This applies to a place being VACANT..If it is occupied , or manicured then its different..If the owner has a high reguard for an EMPTY lot then he/she will either post it or fence it etc.. All this fear mongering is crazy funny...Common sense usually prevails..For each story of somebody getting the boot there are 10's of thousands of vacant lots being searched...At the end of the day everyboy needs to live by what ever they feel comfortable with..I sleep very well at night...

 

[LM]

If It is NOT POSTED, they can ask you to leave, THATS IT..PERIOD...NO TICKETS , confiscation, bla bla bla....I have been asked to leave several places over the years..Leave and dont go back, end of discussion...On the other side I have detected HUNDREDS of Vacant places without any problem at all...This applies to a place being VACANT..If it is occupied , or manicured then its different..If the owner has a high reguard for an EMPTY lot then he/she will either post it or fence it etc.. All this fear mongering is crazy funny...Common sense usually prevails..For each story of somebody getting the boot there are 10's of thousands of vacant lots being searched...At the end of the day everyboy needs to live by what ever they feel comfortable with..I sleep very well at night...

I do believe that on this one, laws vary from state to state.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Dan-riverman, you say:

"If It is NOT POSTED, they can ask you to leave, THATS IT..PERIOD...NO TICKETS , confiscation, bla bla bla...."

What? What do you mean? Haven't you read Beth's links?

Ok Beth, I looked at each one of your links, and only one came close to addressing the question I posed to you. In each, case (besides the one which I will address), it was just as Dan says: a "scram" at worst! In each case, the link was about someone asking what others think about hitting a vacant lot or something. No confiscations, no arrests, etc... So how do those answer my question? And the 2nd one, although it had a ticket, yet it was for indian arrowheads on state land. So the subject there is not "trespassing" to begin with. It is entirely about the TYPE of item found, and perhaps even an issue to which we can all agree anyhow (ie.: no detecting in state parks). So even that doesn't apply.

About the closest to apply was the 5th link of yours. If you will read down in that thread, way down the way, I myself chimed in on that thread. Read what I wrote. The issue with that fellow (who was in an uposted public park or turf of some sort) was "digging" (ie.: damage to the ground), NOT the act of metal detecting itself. Now if, to make this link apply to my question of "tickets and confiscations for detecting on unposted lots", if the question had been one of causing property damage (open holes), then yes, it would apply. But heck, SO TOO would that apply to ANY metal detecting (even where expressly allowed), so again, has nothing to do with my question of seeking examples of "arrests" and "fines" for someone detecting on vacant un-posted lot (where he's not "destroying" it, so that that becomes a side-issue).

Again I ask anyone here: Please provide a sample of someone being arrested, ticketed, and detectors confiscated, for detecting an un-posted un-fenced abandoned lot.

 

[rey914v8]

At the end of the day everyboy needs to live by what ever they feel comfortable with..I sleep very well at night... Amen! to that
Thanks for the replies

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

Do you realize that the very first one I posted is a case of someone taking away his detector? Vacant RR land (maybe) - but local cops got involved also.

But - it is true - whatever floats your boat. It is not up to me to give you examples of how you could get into trouble. If you don't have basic respect for private property, I certainly cannot give it to you.

Beth

 

[LM]

The issue with that fellow (who was in an uposted public park or turf of some sort) was "digging" (ie.: damage to the ground), NOT the act of metal detecting itself. Now if, to make this link apply to my question of "tickets and confiscations for detecting on unposted lots", if the question had been one of causing property damage (open holes), then yes, it would apply.

You're throwing around semantics.
Metal detecting presumes digging (unless you just like hearing beeps, then wondering what might be down there without bothering to find out)

The Naperville ordnance in question does not make exception for "digging, but filling your hole". The 'digging' itself is the crime and no matter how neatly you fill your hole, there will be disturbed dirt, killed flora, etc, which to some is considered 'destruction', ergo, the ordnance. This is why he got the ticket. Because he dug... and because he ran into an --deleted-- cop who apparently didn't have anything better to do (which is no shock in Naperville). Period, end of story.

We all agree that metal detecting a vacant lot is a pretty low risk thing, but I can tell you this... I own a few vacant land properties and if I saw someone trespassing on them with a MD and digging holes without my permission, I would call the police and swear out a complaint against them, which is a lot further than I'd go with a regular trespasser. Those things belong to me, not them, and its at my sole prerogative to dig them up or leave them buried.

The fact is, that land isn't yours, nor are the things that may be buried there.
Just because you bought a metal detector does not give you carte blanche to run it over any open space and dig up whatever's there. We all live by our own conscience and there are more or less offensive scenarios here, but at the end of the day, going on to another mans land and digging it up without permission isn't something that's a desirable practice. These are the people who blacken the eye of the whole hobby.

There's plenty out there to find in places where its permitted, without having to resort to going on someones property without permission. I'm actually much more sympathetic to the man who gets in trouble for detecting on public land- paid for with his tax dollars- because of some well-intentioned bureaucratic regulation than I am to the guy who trespasses on private land.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Beth, sorry, on your first link it came to the middle of a thread. Not the beginning of the thread. So I simply started reading where the link you gave went to and it didn't make sense. But now I've gone back, scrolled to the top of that thread, and caught the context.

Yes: someone, somewhere, somehow *can* get a ticket for being on unfenced unposted land. I suppose it was inevitable the someone could come up with an "incident". I had hoped my implication would be the extreme odds of it actually occuring. To the extent that ...... searching long enough and hard enough, an actual example might be forthcoming, I would say that so too are there stories of motorists getting roughed up by an over-zealous cop for nothing but a tail-light out. Yes, it "can" happen. Did you read the rest of that thread, nearly every single respondant thought it was utterly preposterous, and that the guy should fight it and will certainly prevail (if in fact it was truly unposted and un-fenced).

Beth and LS morgan: perhaps the discrepancy here is our image of "abandoned vacant lots". When I hear that term, I'm imagining: skid-row type vacant lots, that have for years had short-cut trails through them, perhaps abandoned shopping carts, etc..... Maybe when you think of the term, you're thinking of some freshly demo'd urban lot sandwhiched between two private residences ? Maybe our mental conceptions of "vacant lots" are just different?

 

[LM]

Tom: I agree that some places are more or less "risky" in terms of stepping on someones toes by detecting there.
I'm not even getting on a high horse here. Even though I don't land-detect with the same strategies as most people here, there are situations where I could envision myself detecting a vacant property without taking the time to get permission.

People should be clear in understanding that one mans "vacant lot" is another mans property and if that man's nearby, he may not be too happy to see you MD'ing on it.

My fiancees mother lives in a house and owns a few adjacent lots.
To her, its her garden, her yard, her space. To the kids in the neighborhood, it's "the field" and it took considerable levels of ornery confrontation to teach them that it isn't a place to play, litter, cut across, camp out, etc. Sadly, there are a lot of detectorists who have a mentality that isn't much different than those children.

Just think people should be considerate of private property. That's all.