The Offer

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Well, if you were to cash out now the landowner's land is worth $60,000 and your potential cache is worth . . . zero to you. Because it belongs to the landowner (if it is there at all). He's purchased it with the land and paid property taxes on it. 50/50 is pretty generous. He's losing half of what he already owns and is entitled to in the eyes of the law (unless it's a stolen bankroll or some such) and you're gaining something additional to what you now have.

If he's got cable and watches the latest crop of treasure hunting shows he's probably already out there trying to find it.

 

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[bigscoop]

The difference there is that the treasure is not buried in your motor home.

Good reply, Kache.

Frank, just cut through the chase and go see the guy with your partner. Give him something other then an e-mail. Heck, I get a dozen or more spam e-mails nearly every week telling me there is money waiting for me somewhere. People just don't trust that approach these days, and with good reason. Forget the talk of a split, first you got to gain his confidence and trust. E-mails from complete strangers are not going to do that in this day and age.

 

[Frankn]

Yea Kache, people don't always agree, that's why we have words like opinion and theory. Have a good evening.

 

[onfire]

Send him 2 tickets to Vegas all expenses paid for a week, then dig up the whole farm

 

[Frankn]

Charlie P, I really don't think he has been paying tax on that cache. He may technically own it, But he doesn't posess it until it comes to light.

Bigscoop, that will probably be my next move. Frank

 

[khpony]

Frankn
Ive been following this with great interest. My partner and I are in the early stages of cash hunting ourselves and I must say I agree with you completely. We do all the leg work to narrow it down and the necessary field work as well. It actually takes a considerable of time and resources to do this. We're currently working on 2 caches and there have been days where I've spent 6-8 hours at a time on the computer only to come up with nothing! Most people don't understand the amount of time we spend comming up emptyhanded. On one cache it's just my wife and I and we were able to negotiate a 60/40 split in our favor. I've yet to tell the owner that we are looking for something specific but they live on the farm and we'll be honest with them if and when we find something. The bottom line is if we do all the work pre and post then then a 3 way split per your offer is fair. In short the owners have NO idea how much work must transpire just to get to the search at the site.
Just my .02 worth. Hang in there and good luck.

 

[Frankn]

khpony: well it's easy to see that you have put in the effort to look for an actual cache. I get a lot of comments on this post from members who have appearantly never payed the dues to locate a true cache. They havent seen all the dead ends you have to fight on the way to locate a cache. On the cache I am working on now, I quit after a year of searching until I ran into my partner. He was working on the same cache. We compared notes and he went after tracing the people and I went after tracing the property. We nailed the place on paper, but couldn't locate it on the ground because so much had changed. We hired a pro land locator and he put the X on the ground. That has gotten us to THE OFFER stage which this post is about.
This stage is far more complexed than most realize. It's like mental warfare combined with that old,who blinks first game. The thing that surprises me most is how little value some hunters that replied put on there time. Well, good luck on you cache hunt. Since you are past the offer stage, the rest is fun.

 

[lastleg]

What is a "pro land locater"? You aren't talking about map dowsing I hope.

 

[highnam]

Who can I send a bill for the last hour I spent reading this post. Reading this thread was like walking around with my metal detector off. Why isn't there anything here?

 

[feidzd]

This is, of course, at least this result is not considered to be unacceptable, or what not.

 

[TheHarleyMan2]

Well it wasn't until I read 63BKPKER post that I was surprised no one else posted as I was going to post the same thing. I agree MEETING the land owner in person can do more wonders than a land owner reading an e-mail or letter.

Think of a salesman aspect of it. If a salesman sent you a letter or an e-mail to "TRY" and sell you something, how would you react?

Many here will just "IGNORE" the letter or e-mail; BUT,

How many of you here was not in the mood to buy anything, but went somewhere, like a motorcycle rally, car show, or just out tire kicking at a car dealership just to see what was there but had "NO INTENTIONS" of buying anything? BUT; Some of you bought something anyway even though you had no plans on spending any money at that moment.

I always wanted to find and search for lost cache and treasures, and still doing some research when I get a chance.

I used to sell motorcycle products at motorcycle rallies, I have sold products to people who were informative of "NOT SPENDING ANY MONEY", OR COULDN'T AFFORD to spend it or HAD NO MONEY! I didn't "hound" them. I explained about my products and "LOOKED THEM DEAD STRAIGHT IN THE EYE" with a smile on my face and (words of advice, TONE OF YOUR VOICE NAD BODY LANGUAGE HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH COMMUNICATION to someone face to face), smile while communicating.

I would stand in my booth and someone would be walking by, and I would tell them to come here and see what I have and many would just shake their heads no or reply with a no or not interested, but I would not move out of my space and would insist they come look. 98% of them came to me.

Face to face is way better presentaion and each person can get a better feel for each other. Fact is yes, you may have to travel to do so! So you need to see if it is worth you spending the time and fuel to go meet with him. The best time to meet him would certainly not be in the evening he may have had a bad day for some reason. Offer to meet him for lunch and pay the tab.

Over lunch can have a good communication with everyone, and you can explain just enough of what was done for the research, but don't sound desperate.

Personally I don't think you should have mentioned any dollar amount to him. You should have left it, "Well, I been searching for lost caches and old relics from such and such eara, and I came across one on or near your property, but I do not know the exact amount in dollars or what it is worth, it may not be there anymore, or the amount may only be a few dollars" "If by some chance that it is more than a few dollars, or the relic is valued at a high price, myself and my partner will split everything with you 1/3 for each of us."

If he asks you why do you search for things if it may not be worth much or don't find anything at all? Then you would tell him that you have found some things before that were worth a lot of money, sometimes I found things that are not worth much and sometimes found nothing at all, and also found some small cached coins before and it is a rarity that you find a lot of valued things everytime, but sometimes one gets lucky, but it is RARE, but you do it for the thrill of the research and to see if the find is real."

Don't sound desperate to him. If he still insists on a 50/50, then thank him for his time, kindly let him know that without your research and info, he will never even find it, know about it, and you have other caches, relics you are searching for that are more promissing, then kindly stand up, shake his hand, and walk out. (Word of advice, If he insists on 50/50 as I mentioned above), give him the presence of you "Really don't care what he wants and give the impression you could care less about his property or the cache/relics! You don't have to speak, BODY LANGUAGE says a lot!

He will MOST LIKELY take you up on your offer being you all had time to sit over at lunch and talk about and had time to think about it and if you start to walk out and leave he may go ahead and change his mind.

 

[Frankn]

Lastleg, He is an expert at locating a location in the land records that has an arcadic description.
Highnam, Send it to the guy in the mirror, he the guy that didn't have his mental detector turned on while reading!
Feidzd, at least the words are English, but the meaning eludes me.

 

[idigdirt]

One last comment Frankn, Do me a huge favor (so that I can sleep well at night). I know I am in the minority here. Most everybody here wants to know how it all turns out except me. If you ever get the chance (maybe you already have), read the book written by George Mroczkowski pronounced "merch- cow-ski" titled "professional treasure hunter". In my opinion it's the greatest treasure book ever written. Why? He always comes up empty handed. Brilliant! I love you George! Take that approach to treasure hunting and people like Karl Von Mueller and Michael Paul Henson will be smiling down on you. So basically what I am saying is this, (and I'm sure George will agree on this), you've found nothing!

 

[Frankn]

idigdirt, You have posted this on another post, and I replied, Do you really think George found nothing? Or were the endings for the IRS? It is true that so far I have found nothing THERE, but then again, I haven't looked THERE yet.

 

[Frankn]

Harley Man 2, I must agree. An in person presentation is always better. I want to point out that I am not trying to sell him anything. This cost him nothing and he might walk away with 3 or 4 million.

 

[Sam 8]

If they are not complete fools, they will at least give you the chance to speak, and then you must convince them to listen. Keep in mind that within the first 5 minutes they will have judged you and based on that judgement they will have decided if you are worth listening to.
If by the time those 5 minutes are up you can get them to listen...really listen...then you have made the biggest part of the leap.

 

[maipenrai]

After following this Very interesting thread from the beginning, and the many ideas, some good and some not so good; my guess is that a 50/50 split will be the only way to go. Of course you have a partner, that you want to give a third to, but what if the land owner thinks the same way, maybe his wife or partner want their share also? You are half of the equation, he is the other half. No matter how many partners each of you have, it is still 50/50. This standoff could go on forever, so you will not win in that case. He might just go for a 60/40, but it would be in his favor, not yours. And has been pointed out here many times, dont underestimate the opposition, he may start his own search, and if he believes that the reward is in the millions, then he has even more reason to do it himself. There is not one member of this site, that knowing a big cache was buried on their property, would give it away. I would dig forever to find it, and remover every inch of soil to find it. That is just human nature, right or wrong, he will not give it away. As far as the amount of time you have spent, most of us have spent lots of time on projects, and then who pays, when there is no reward? If the cache is as big as you believe, then isnt that a big prize? Sure, its your know how, and work that produces the reward, but its still his, he is the owner of that property and all that is on it.

This has got to be one of the most interesting threads on this forum, lets hope you succeed in getting an agreement, and succeed in finding your prize.

 

[spartacus53]

maipenrai, you say "This has got to be one of the most interesting threads on this forum, lets hope you succeed in getting an agreement, and succeed in finding your prize."

Well I'll have to disagree there.. This topic was posted in mid Jan and it's already just past mid April, so just over 3 months have passed since the original posting, not mention the time consumed prior to your e-mail campaign.

Frankn, at this point you may as well hold out for that 1/3 split.. Although I have changed my original position from the 50/50 split, let me explain why.. I am assuming this may be an older gent, and if you wait long enough he will surely pass on and then you can buy the property yourself, or start over making arrangements with the new land owner.

It is apparent to me that after all this time has elapsed you have little in the way of the art, or salesmanship of negotiation. Personally, I would have had this resolved one way, or the other a while ago and moved on already.

 

[Ilovetodig]

I won't pretend to know anything about hunting caches or the time it takes to research it but the I think the bottom line is this; if the man doesn't let you on the land then you get nothing at all plus losing everything you put into it. Its his land, he owns it so he has the last word. Just my thoughts no offense meant or intended.

 

[Frankn]

I have a lot on my mine lately, so I will consolidate replys. I do not think he will look for it because I have already told him it is on one of two lots, his being one of them. It is true, it is his land, but the cach, which is not stolen money, was buried by another. I admitt I am not a salesman, I am a technical type. The thing that gets me is how someone can turn down an offer of $4M in return for no investment, no risks and no work.