Liberty 1804 Real or Fake ?

[k9secret]

Please help me proof Real or Fake ?







Regards,
K

 

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[cudamark]

What denomination is it? Half dollar? I just doesn't have the "feel" of an old coin to me. It seems a little too flat and lifeless somehow... almost too perfect. As for the gold, I don't have any experience with those.

 

[Mackaydon]

Welcome to Treasure Net !!
If you paid over a million dollars for it, it may be real; otherwise fake.
Don.....

 

[Iamrussell]

Looks fake to me-but im no expert

-------------------------------------
just keep stacking, just keep stacking, stacking stacking stacking

 

[1235CE]

OK, I'm confused.....the gold coins look like they are in your possession so why we are looking at a picture of a picture of a Bust Dollar??

HH all!

Greg

 

[huntsman53]

I am confused! Which of the coins does the O.P. want to know is real or a fake? The top pic of the 1804 Bust Silver Dollar appears to be a cut and paste from an article as there is no depth to the coin. Post an actual pic of the coin and maybe we can ascertain whether it is real or not!


Frank

 

[1more4me]

Buy that top one if you can!

It looks to be a picture of an 1804 Draped bust Dollar- in fact- it looks exactly like the photo of an authentic draped bust Proof that represents one of 15 known to exist. (gouge over E in Liberty and spot over breast near lowest star...) So yeah, it's probably real. Real picture of another picture of a real coin. The last 2 sales of any one of these went for 2.3 and 4 Million each.
There are a lot of great stories related to this coin- like- though 19,000 were minted, nearly every one of the coins, because of a short supply of Spanish coin available, was on a tea trade ship to china that sunk..
It's one of the most counterfeited of all coins- and thought to have been counterfeited as early as 1820- the shortage was already known. One of the earliest "Coin collector" buys recorded was in 1888 where a fellow paid a bit over $500 for one!
Yep, buy it- but be aware that all 2 are in Government museums like the Smithsonian- and the other 13 have long documented lines of ownership...
PEACE

 

[k9secret]

Thank you every body .... i'll tell them to take a picture real coin and post here again.

 

[srcdco]

If you are going to tell stories about coins, at least please research them first. Although there was a mintage of dollars in 1804, they were all dated 1803. It was common practice at the time for the U.S. Mint to use dies until they became unserviceable, regardless of the year on the dies. When the U.S. government wanted to present the King of Siam with a set of current coins in 1834, they were not currently producing silver dollars or ten dollar gold coins. In looking back at the archives, they saw that they were both last minted in 1804, so they assumed that the dates would be 1804 and created coins dated 1804. In the case of the silver dollar, that was the first time that coins dated 1804 were produced. There were additional ones made in the 1850's for sale to collectors, illegally.

Reference: 1804 silver dollar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Scott

 

[1more4me]

If you are going to tell stories about coins, at least please research them first.
Scott

Scott - Who are you replying to?
If it was me- print a nice fresh copy of your wikilink, wad it up, and shove it where the sun don't shine!
First- I said there "ARE A LOT OF STORIES-" and gave one example. In fact- why don't you take a copy of the 2013 REDBOOK page for this coin and add it to the wad above- because according to your FACTS ( Source (1),that were made up in the late 1880's)- the Redbook is wrong. How about you re-read the documents that your wikisources wrote- then come back and tell me or explain WHY the 1804 dies were MADE if not to make coins in 1804. Oh- by the way- YOUR wikiproof also tells a story of nearly all the coins of that year going to US Soldiers and allies in Tripoli during the 1801-1805 Barbary Coast war - so Tell me- is your first source or second source of that wiki fact correct because both are "alleged" stories?
Your Wiki Fact -Source- Is an individual that wrote his version in 1997. Basing his fact on the PROOF that ONE 1804 Dollar was struck on an 1850's Thaler sometime in the 1850's - How does that (in 1888 or 1997) prove that NONE were made in 1804 or 1805. Oh wait- you didn't check any other sources ... or more credible sources... or anything else.
You do the research clown- before you slam someone for lack of it.

 

[enamel7]

Nice response! You won't be here long. I read the Redbook and it states coins were minted in 1804, but not necessarily with that date. Others were minted for presentation sets for collectors. Please go back and read the page again.
HH
enamel7

 

[1more4me]

Although there was a mintage of dollars in 1804, they were all dated 1803.

Scott- your condesending reply has really tripped my switch! Lets look at your second sentence above. This is by your wikidata FACT right?
WRONG- it is the OPINION of two writers, in fact, it's a word for word quote from- The Fantastic 1804 Dollar, written in 1962 by Eric P. Newman and Kenneth E. Bressett.

Why would it be more factual than an excerpt from----

1883 edition of Dye’s Coin Encyclopedia:
“There is no authentic history of the 1804 dollar. ...in Salem, Mass., at one time the most extensive tea-importing place on the continent, that the scarcity of the 1804 dollar was owing to the sinking of a China-bound vessel having on board almost the entire mintage of 1804 dollars..."

Or more factual than:
The 1893 edition of Harper’s Popular Cyclopaedia of United States Coins;
“Yet during the years 1804-5 there were issued from the Mint silver dollars of the coinage of former years to the amount of $19,891. The dies had been prepared for issuing the dollars of 1804, but not more than 20 pieces were struck. These are held in the most sacred reverence by the few fortunate collectors who possess them."

Or more factual than:
Mr. Preston, for many years Director of the Mint, who is also an authority on such subjects, believes the records are correct, and that 18,570 were coined, as the books show. His theory is that they all went to Central America and that a few of them drifted back to this country

Here's the real problem- you clicked on the first link that came up on your google search- and all the sudden you're T-nets presiding authority on Antiquites of the Americas and Chief Fact Checker extraordinare. WRONG ---- you didn't do the research for yourself and believed the first link you clicked. Your boyfriends not a french model is he?
There is a reason the coin is famous- and it's the LACK of FACTS that Make it that way! UJA!

 

[enamel7]

I see a timeout coming.

 

[cudamark]

I think we can have a debate without name calling, can't we??

 

[huntsman53]

I think that PCGS's Coinfacts is a better source for information of the 1804 Bust Silver Dollar!

1804 Silver Dollars


Frank

 

[1more4me]

Huntsman, I agree- numismatic info from a bona fide numismatic site.
My original post contained info I got from Numismaster.com. I use it to search my gold fractionals and a few foreign coins - but I got called out for Not researching- by someone who probably googled Your ID of it and clicked the first link that popped up. I quoted one of dozen well known Stories- of the most "Storied Coin" in American history-because I thought it was interesting---And Scotty boy punked me with a Fact <-- that's not even a fact! Unless of course everything you read on the internet is true- they can't put it on there unless it true- right?

 

[huntsman53]

1more4me,

That is why I use qualified, professional source data as wikidata is just as bad as Google for driving directions! You end up driving off a cliff way before you get to your destination.


Frank

 

[Joe777Cool]

Boy this is getting good! I need to visit the coin section more often!

 

[srcdco]

First, I want to apologize for coming across so poorly. Last week was a bad week for me and I shouldn't have said anything. Second, I've seen all of the stories about the fate of any dollars minted in 1804. The link posted from coinfacts.com is very accurate and says exactly what I was trying to say. There were no 1804 dated silver dollars minted in 1804, they were all dated 1803. I know many people discount wikipedia, with good reason. In this case, I read through it and it was correct, with references at the bottom of the page, so I used it. I was only trying to help. Third, from now on, I'll not bother helping. This is the last that I will post on this subject.

Thank you,

Scott

 

[1more4me]

Scott,
No appology necessary. I over-flamed a bit over the "do some research" comment but it's all good now, I figured you just missed the "lot of great stories- like..." part of my comment. Those stories exist because the are no facts.
In fact, I believe just like "numismatist beleive" that none were minted in 1804 that were dated 1804... No reason not to- until someone finds a treasure trove one day...
PEACE