Give us a bad name

[jeric2]

These are the kinds of detectorists that give us a bad name:

SUSSEX: 3 charged with removing artifacts from wildlife area
7:41 AM, Mar. 18, 2011


Three Sussex County men face criminal charges after authorities say they were caught unearthing archaeological artifacts in a state wildlife area near Townsend.

The men dug up items such as old pottery shards, pieces of glass, brass belt buckles and old coins, said Sgt. Gregory Rhodes of the state Division of Fish and Wildlife Enforcement, whose agents arrested the trio.

He said one of the men had been previously warned to not dig at the Cedar Swamp Wildlife Area.

“He was definitely aware that he was in an area that he was prohibited to do that,” Rhodes said. The men were seen digging March 14 by a Fish and Wildlife agent who called in backup and a boat.

“We had an observant officer,” Rhodes said.

Arrested on charges of removing archaeological resources were John W. Justice, 44, of Lewes; Elmer N. Justice, 68, of Laurel; and Mark D. Silicato, 50, of Milford. Silicato was also charged with a boating safety violation. All three were issued a summons to appear in Superior Court.

It is illegal under state law to remove archaeological resources - artifacts at least 50 years old - from state lands without a permit.

The Cedar Swamp Wildlife Area includes about 5,000 acres.

 

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[Frankn]

I wonder if the wildlife really missed those items.
I wonder if they would have issued them a permit to look for them.
If this stuff is so important, why haven't the Arches claimed it already.
This persecution of TH's defies logic.
The Gov. preferrs DECAY in the ground to DISPLAY of Items. It's like saying, " If I can't have it let it rot."

Logic, Logic, logic, out the window! Frank

 

[lostcauses]

I wonder if the wildlife really missed those items.
I wonder if they would have issued them a permit to look for them.
If this stuff is so important, why haven't the Arches claimed it already.
This persecution of TH's defies logic.
The Gov. preferrs DECAY in the ground to DISPLAY of Items. It's like saying, " If I can't have it let it rot."

Logic, Logic, logic, out the window! Frank

"I wonder if the wildlife really missed those items." Nope them critters other than the human type dont care.
"I wonder if they would have issued them a permit to look for them." To a qualified archeologist, possibly, yet due to the wild life, may be not..
"If this stuff is so important, why haven't the Arches claimed it already." Because if a site is dug, even by archeologist it is destroyed." The items are not the value to archeology, the over all of a site can provide a great deal more data than one object.
"This persecution of TH's defies logic." Yep they ( relic hunters/TH's) were WARNED, and still went back, Persecution of stupidity seems to be the norm.

Not Logic: Excuses of an addictive hobby to justify breaking, or being tempted to break the law.
Such statements, as well as them fools getting caught breaking the law:
are the best tools for people to justify laws against all forms of relic hunting,
They sound good to the uniformed: yet they are not so logical when examined.

 

[jeric2]

well said lostcauses. they were warned and still went back. Should have understood the first time (actually, should have checked to see if they could have obtained a permit or permission.) Now they (or anyone else for that matter) will never be able to get what lies beneath the surface at this site. AND....it makes it harder for the honest treasure hunters to gain permission and/or trust with those that give permission. THIS gives us all a bad name and should not be tolerated.
I have a house that I have wanted to detect on for years. It's currently not occupied, but that doesn't mean that I just go whenever I want because no one is there. I believe my patience will pay off and I will eventually gain permission. It's currently owned by The Nature Conservancy, but is for sale.
The point is.....don't be ignorant and ruin it for the rest of us. We have a code of ethics. Follow it at all times and you're more likely to be accepted and given permission. Would you want someone detecting on your private property without your permission? Or to go to a house that's not currently occupied without permission just because it's empty? It's not right.

 

[deepskyal]

Yea...that archeological resource act is a catchall. Coins? really? Pieces of glass....
And what for Pete's sake were these guys digging with?

That act can be enforced anywhere. That's the real crime. That's what's ruining it for the hobby.

The guy was stupid for sure. If I were warned, absolutely, I would not return to a site.

In Pa. state gamelands you're allowed to detect...you're just not allowed to dig up anything. Same reason...could be some archeological resource.

It's like Frankn said...Decay, not display.

Al

 

[Frankn]

lost cause, look at it this way. The government builds gulf coarses on public land to allow for that recreation that changes nature completely in that area, but they ban metal detecting on public land. A recreation that does not change the nature in the area. Where is the logic here?

As far as The Nature Conservancy is conserned, It is nothing but a huge government supported land accusition and sale organization. That land you are talking about in Va. was purchased by them a short while ago, " to save the land". now they are selling it for a big profit. The government even goes in with them on some of their deals. Check on them . You will get some big surprises. And before you knock the "bad guys" check to see how the laws are that are restraining them. It's like the speed limits. It makes law breakers out of honest people in the name of collecting fines. Frank

 

[Daedalus]

And these type of laws will keep being put on us in till ( We the People say No ) . It can not be just a few who write in or say anything about these laws. It has to be as many of us as can be pulled together to stop this.

We are going to have to start making life very hard for the leaders who do not do the will of the people and do what they want.
And when we do that and start telling the elected that there stay in office is going to be a short one in till they do what we want, it will not stop. But it will stop when they see that they are going to be voted out for not doing what we asked.

This thing with the Federal Government taking over State lands and declaring areas Parks to get hold of the resources has got to be fought to a stand still , if we do not then our kids are not going to have anything in their future but what some politician who was put into office by rich company's say they can have !

 

[TheRandyMan]

Everyone needs to understand something...something very, very important. There is no such thing as a "Metal Detectorist Lobby" and never will be. It is an unfortunate truth about our hobby. To understand this fact is to understand that people are "wired" certain ways. Genetic factors...environmental factors..experiential factors...all play a part in determining who we are, how we think, how we act, the spouse we are attracted to and what type of work/job/occupation/career we choose. The term "Personality Types" is a good general term to encompass all of these factors. There are many ways that these are categorized. This website identifies 16 major categories of "Personality Types".

http://www.personalitypage.com/high-level.html

In the subset of people comprised of detectorists, most of us will probably find one of these that describes us pretty well, if not right on the button.

So, basically, even though there are detectorists who range in personality types from anarchistic to authoritarian, there are just so few of us who are of the type to organize in such a way as to have any significant effect, on the political structure here in the US, that it just will not happen. To understand that is to understand the nature of the beast and, of course, having that knowledge...you have power over the situation in your own way.

It was interesting to me that even within this little thread, the various personality types of the posters were almost immediately detectable upon reading just a few words.

Learn how to play the game, learn how to game the play...but above all, don't be stupid...cause there ain't no cure for stupid.

 

[Frankn]

I think you nailed it Randy. We need some help from the manufactures. For guns we have the NRA working for us. For prospecting we have the GPAA working for us. For general metal detecting we have ZIP. There appears to be a hole in the wall and it ain't Butch Cassidies! Frank

 

[Tnmountains]

People do not understand the metal detecting community and they do not understand the people that collect arrowheads. There are bad apples in any hobby and some people will go to any lengths to obtain their finds. I have seen the destruction caused by people metal detecting sneaking in and digging a site upsetting landowners and then posting it on their web sites.
On the other side of the coin is public land which is supposed to be ours but is under the control of the federal government. We should be allowed to pursue our hobby with a permitt of some sort. It is more and more becoming a society of us and them.
I was at a large Civil War Relic show not long ago and was talking to one of the dealers. I made the statement that I always got permission before detecting a piece of land. His reply was" You don't find much do you"?
Go figure.

 

[Woodland Detectors]

That's a shame.

John W. Justice, 44, of Lewes; Elmer N. Justice, 68, of Laurel; and Mark D. Silicato, 50, of Milford.

 

[T Hunter]

guys Please know the whole story before making judgements. thanks and good hunting. Mark

 

[lostcauses]

"On the other side of the coin is public land which is supposed to be ours but is under the control of the federal government. We should be allowed to pursue our hobby with a permitt of some sort."

I agree with this, instead of losing data, as well as relics artifacts, the data could still be obtained. Important sites could be found.
Of course if an are was considered important the permission would go away.

guys Please know the whole story before making judgements. thanks and good hunting. Mark

As for this, they did not have permission it seems. That is the usual story in the end.