Doesnt Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

[NewsMan]

Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Just saying... burial sites are off limits!

http://www.thepostgame.com/blog/dish/201109/texas-drough-exposes-history-dinosaur-age

 

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[bearbqd]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

You're only reading one side though. Did these 30 arrested even know it was a historical site below the water? Maybe they were doing what any one of us would have done; exploring the exposed soil and finding artifacts. Can you honestly say you'd just walk by and not pick up things?

 

[allan]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Any and all native american artifacts , even arrowheads are a no no in Texas, look but don't touch

 

[deepskyal]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Like I said in a related post.....they seal up the cavern accesses and cover it with water for recreational use and "preserve" the relics

It's okay for the government to hide these relics but not okay for anyone to pick a few up and display them for others to see.

The "sick and twisted" is the government's attitude that they can put a lake, highway, etc., anywhere they want, with complete disreguard for anything of historic value, then tell us we can't detect at other locations....because of it's historic value.

Al

 

[NewsMan]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Article clearly says burial sites were disturbed and needed to be repaired. Enough said. That is all that I am referring to.

 

[NewsMan]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

It's okay for the government to hide these relics but not okay for anyone to pick a few up and display them for others to see.

That's the problem, they don't pick up a few for people to see. They go into their private collections or are sold on ebay and at conventions. Besides, no one "picks up a few". Without regulations every historical site known to man would have been plundered by now. Greed ALWAYS trumps history.

 

[lostcauses]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

NewsMan
Do you expect not to get bit by posting such and then replying to the thread??

Yes looting is to "saving history" if it is done on lands with out permission.

It is such any more that the busts, at at least the federal level are more twords property rights, than damage to a site.

Now this statement,
"Can you honestly say you'd just walk by and not pick up things?"
what can I say about such.
It is like a kid going by a government owned car some one left the keys in and saying "Why not take it?"

To be honest it is nothing more than a "I found it I am keeping it."
Of course the average relic artifact hunter will not steel the car, yet any artifact or relic hunter: if they find it, well maybe..

And of course this statement

Like I said in a related post.....they seal up the cavern accesses and cover it with water for recreational use and "preserve" the relics

It's okay for the government to hide these relics but not okay for anyone to pick a few up and display them for others to see.

The "sick and twisted" is the government's attitude that they can put a lake, highway, etc., anywhere they want, with complete disreguard for anything of historic value, then tell us we can't detect at other locations....because of it's historic value.

Al

"

The love of history and the items of the past simply do not allow anyone the right to ignore property rights, even the governments. The correct way with governments is not to ignore the law, get em changed.
Yet at this time, the Archeologist and special groups have more say than the artifact/relic hunter.

And as for what NewsMan said about the laws protecting sites, there would not be much left out there today if not for such laws.
In reality, so far there is no real solution to the situation.

People that want to go out into the government land ( usually fully knowledgeable that doing so is wrong) can and will pick up, dig, metal detect.

Why?? Because in most cases: even knowing it is wrong, they also know the chances of them getting caught is almost nil.

Saving history.. BS.
It just an excuse to go have fun.

 

[lostcauses]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

NewsMan
You and others still think this ios only about how much it can be sold for.

WRONG.
Yes value does help the thrill of the find. Yet value is based upon rarity of an item.
Finding a rare item is the reason for the thrill. One does get tiered of the same old stuff. Finding the same old stuff can get a bit boring.. The thrill of the find just ain't there after a while.

Yes there exist some fools that just do it for the money, yet strangely these are the rare ones.
The ones that ignore laws and just plain decency of property rights etc.. are ones that strangely do such only related to relic/ artifact hunting.

The hunter usually collects the finds, to the point it could be called hoarding before the let go of such.

I doubt seriously if you understand any of what I wrote, and strangely enough this is the Major proplem of why looting is still going on.

You can make all the laws you want. You can throw more man power and money at the problem.
Until it is understood such actions are a result of behavior: and not about the money; well what can I say.. It will just continue.

 

[coinshooter]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Just a point to make. Don't throw metal detecting in here. You want to lump everything together. I see Newsman as an archie under the cover as "Newsman". Archies are the scum of the earth as far as I am concerned. They hide under the cover of "preserving things" for the future.
For what? What good are they rotting in the ground where nobody gets to see them? I will say emphatically that I do not nor will I ever promote grave digging, but come on. Picking up an arrowhead in an area known to have had indians will not "ruin" a site. The achies just cry wolf because they will not get there first.
I personally would support a system like englands where people are
supported for their finds, not arrested or fined when they find an article of ancient history.

 

[Mzjavert]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Just a point to make. Don't throw metal detecting in here. You want to lump everything together. I see Newsman as an archie under the cover as "Newsman". Archies are the scum of the earth as far as I am concerned. They hide under the cover of "preserving things" for the future.
For what? What good are they rotting in the ground where nobody gets to see them? I will say emphatically that I do not nor will I ever promote grave digging, but come on. Picking up an arrowhead in an area known to have had indians will not "ruin" a site. The achies just cry wolf because they will not get there first.
I personally would support a system like englands where people are
supported for their finds, not arrested or fined when they find an article of ancient history.

If I understand the English system, if the item is deemed to be of great historical value, they will take it and compensate you for it. Fair enough.

 

[Ray S ECenFL]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

A few questions come up since the news video was rather sparse on the fine points.

Was this site posted as an active archie dig site?

Did these 30, "looters" and "thieves" just rampage through the site to steal the artifacts, knowing that it was illegal?

Why did the archies not take advantage of the drought and dig the attracts to preserve them? You know, strike while the iron is hot, so to speak.

Frankly, I think most of the folks arrested probably had no idea they were doing anything wrong. It just seems hard to believe that 30 people would violate the law like this, knowingly.

I do not condone grave robbing, but the site was covered in concrete to protect it? Kind of a lot of trouble to go through if you are not serious about collecting the artifacts when the site is available to do so. Such as in a major drought.

A lot of our nations history will turn to dust waiting for the archies to get around to collecting and preserving the history. Sad, very sad.

Ray S ECenFL

 

[buzzgator]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

It was said that a prior post with a pot was a obvious mound dig because the pic was taken at night! I dont know about you but when I was working days alot of my shelter digs were done at night. Not only is it cooler but it was the only time I could dig. Also quite a few were on hillsides and a pic taken at night could look like a mound dig. Dont make assumptions based on one picture! And as for me if I had a mound on private property I would be neck deep diggin it!

 

[Jeffro]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

It's okay for the government to hide these relics but not okay for anyone to pick a few up and display them for others to see.

That's the problem, they don't pick up a few for people to see. They go into their private collections or are sold on ebay and at conventions. Besides, no one "picks up a few". Without regulations every historical site known to man would have been plundered by now. Greed ALWAYS trumps history.

Gotta call BS on this one. Can you honestly say that the 30 people cited were there to sell items on Ebay? Or whatever?

Most people are just that, people...... with curiousness like most others. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say MAYBE 1 or 2 were there for profit..... the rest just happened upon it or heard through word of mouth that there were some "cool finds" at the lake..... LOL!

 

[NewsMan]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

No Jeffro, the ebay thing is a generalization. However these aren't people just out picking up stones. These are people who knew the sites were there and DUG them up when the water came down. Is it really that hard for you people to say, 'Yeah... bunch of sick bastards digging up the graves. They should be in jail".? It is hard for many of you to say and that's my beef.

 

[diggummup]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

No Jeffro, the ebay thing is a generalization. However these aren't people just out picking up stones. These are people who knew the sites were there and DUG them up when the water came down. Is it really that hard for you people to say, 'Yeah... bunch of sick --deleted--s digging up the graves. They should be in jail".? It is hard for many of you to say and that's my beef.

First, I would use the term grave lightly. The reports mention "burial grounds" as in, they are buried in the ground under dirt (or rather covered with concrete by archies or whomever). Nowhere does it mention human remains because it's just not so. The "small bits of bones" comment does not justify human remains. We all know that archies are the "sick and twisted" ones because they are the ones who dig up graves under the guise of historical significance and relavance. Granted, these people were breaking the law, but as others have said, I believe most were probably unaware of the strict laws against it and only a few may have been in it for profit. What doen't make any sense to me is the fact that there are areas that are actually covered over in concrete to preserve the site. I think that is taking it to the next level of ridiculousness. If the site were that important, it would have already been excavated. I don't want to hear anything about a lack of funding either. If they had enough funding to cover it with concrete, then they had enough to excavate it. Probably cost a few hundred grand jus to cover it over to begin with, back then no less. Just another lame excuse by archies to hold onto another piece of historically valuable land for themselves, because they are obviously the chosen ones, and anybody else is a thief.

 

[Jeffro]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Article clearly says burial sites were disturbed and needed to be repaired. Enough said. That is all that I am referring to.

It cost 30,000 dollars to fill in a hole someone dug with a shovel? Really?

Seems to me the gubmint would be money ahead hiring security guards....


Please tell me with a straight face that you have never been in possession of an arrowhead or fossil?

 

[NewsMan]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Article clearly says burial sites were disturbed and needed to be repaired. Enough said. That is all that I am referring to.

It cost 30,000 dollars to fill in a hole someone dug with a shovel? Really?
Seems to me the gubmint would be money ahead hiring security guards....
Please tell me with a straight face that you have never been in possession of an arrowhead or fossil?

Dude... talk about the topic. Don't present me with hypotheticals. Do you think it is cool to dig up graves or not. Simple, really.

 

[diggummup]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Article clearly says burial sites were disturbed and needed to be repaired. Enough said. That is all that I am referring to.

Burial sites in the context of buried artifacts under the dirt and covered with concrete. If you believe everything the local news tells you then you got problems. Everything is skewed and twisted to fit someones agenda nowadays, you should know that. And i'm sure jeffro doesn't think it's "cool" to dig up graves, nor do I or 99.5 out of 100 people on here.

 

[Ray S ECenFL]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

Article clearly says burial sites were disturbed and needed to be repaired. Enough said. That is all that I am referring to.

Burial sites in the context of buried artifacts under the dirt and covered with concrete. If you believe everything the local news tells you then you got problems. Everything is skewed and twisted to fit someones agenda nowadays, you should know that. And i'm sure jeffro doesn't think it's "cool" to dig up graves, nor do I or 99.5 out of 100 people on here.

Amen to that.

 

[Cuerno]

Re: Doesn't Take Long for the Sick and Twisted

There is a beach area that is called Padre Island National Seashore, I believe it starts at Malaquite Beach and goes along the coast line for about 45 miles to Port Mansfield Cut. There is a large sign posted south of Malaquite Beach that reads no Metal detecting beyond this point, after several miles down the beach you need 4 wheel drive vehicle to get through the deep sand, there is no road so it never gets clean up and at times it looks like garbage trucks went out there and dumped trash for miles, mostly plastic trash from the oil platform. You are on your own when you go out there and if you get stuck in the sand, you hope someone can get you out. Many go out there to surf fish, campout and they dig holes for camp fires and kids dig deep holes to play in but you cannot swing a detector and dig a small hole, even the saltwater within seconds fills the holes back. History show that there were old shipwrecks along the Texas coast in that area and maybe that’s what someone is protecting, leave it there and let it rust out in the saltwater so we don’t have to rewrite history on who was here first. You can go north of Malaquite beach and swing a detector and dig, up to the south end of Mustang State Park but no further until you get to Caldwell Pier. I just don’t understand what they are protecting at P.I.N.S. Now a couple of years ago they stopped metal detecting in the older parks in San Antonio but you can detect at the new ones any time you want. I just don’t understand. That why I’m down to one detector now and doing a lot of Barbecuing and getting more hefty… Oh, a group of us hunted withend eye sight of a cemetery at Indianola, Tex. but that's as close as I have been digging around buried bodies and couldn't wait to get out of there.