ICAHM Protests Television Programs That Encourage Destruction of Heritage

[DrJoePrime]

You are pretty brave, Alexandre, posting that ICAHM protest.

My blood is boiling and I feel so embarrassed by all the less than thoughtful responses of the Tnet MD community (of which I choose to be a member).

It's both sad and a little funny that "archaeologist" can be turned into the dirty word, "archie" ... (or is it that they just refuse to learn to spell?).

The Little Big Horn Project is a wonderful example of what can be learned when we co-operate. It is possible.

If we (as MD'ers) do not act responsibly in NOT destroying our heritage...then we will surely be forced to (act responsibly)! Please think about it.

Joe

 

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[jeff of pa]

Alexandre,

If you don't own any Relics ?
is it because you realy don't care about History ?
just the Paycheck ?

Seriously though, I Think yous may be a little too hard
on Alexandre. If they are anything Like England,
at least they may pay for the relics they want.

I'll stick to Judging the ones here in the U.S.
after all they are the ones trying to run my life.

 

[bigscoop]

Alexandre,

If you don't own any Relics ?
is it because you realy don't care about History ?
just the Paycheck ?

Seriously though, I Think yous may be a little too hard
on Alexandre. If they are anything Like England,
at least they may pay for the relics they want.

I'll stick to Judging the ones here in the U.S.
after all they are the ones trying to run my life.

Point taken. Removed post.

 

[buzzgator]

Joe, thanks for informing me on archie being a dirty word. As for ur (sp) blood boiling, wow you must really have a low boiling point! Now if u really want ur blood to boil check out whats going on in Fla with the mders (sp) rights! As far as mders (sp) oh wait is that (sic)? Im just a no spelling abrev using mder n NA artifact hunter. Archeaologist cant get over Clovis first because it would mean addmiting everything they believed was wrong, even tho there has been proof since 1997 that man was in the Americas long before Clovis. Archies are akin to public school history teachers spewing lies of Columbus first.

 

[lookindown]

Lets start a petition against archeologists that are against detectorist...to say they were looting says a lot about you Alexandre. Im glad that Nat Geo told prof. Limp to be quiet. It would be great for you to have it all your way but it dont work like that. Your looking in the wrong place for support and if you didnt know that, then your not much of a threat to us. Go tell prof. Limp, he will listen.

I just love it when people respond without having a clue what they're talking about.
It's called cut and paste. He didn't write the letter.
He's just posting it for us to see that there's repercussions already from one show.
Try looking into it a little deeper next time.

He posted a link that said petition against looting....Those guys on the show WERE NOT LOOTING...Every historic place is not owned by archies. Alexandre is the same guy that was so proud Spain stole that silver from Odessey. The only detectorist he tolerates are ones working with archies. Try looking a little deeper yourself.

 

[ouachitacaveman]

.. what most of the good folks here are
not understanding is this: The archaeologists are NOT the ones making
the laws, it's your lawmakers in the state and Fed. governments. The
archaeologists are the ones who are given the task of trying to save
any human or cultural remains from being destroyed, with human remains returned to
the tribe that originally came from the locality where any remains may have been discovered.
No, not all the artifacts dug by archaeologists have been given to museums, because
many are displayed elsewhere, like universities, libraries, colleges and other important public buildings. Furthermore,
there is a shortage of workers to analyze and record the data of said artifacts -before- they can be displayed.
Why are so many of my fellow MD'ers pissed at Archaeologists because they can't detect
the Federal or State lands ? Call your lawmakers on this, not the Archaeologists.
The "archies" do not make these laws governing protected lands. They abide by the laws.
As far as the diggers programs on TV, it looks like about 1/2 the folks on this website are
against these ( treasure seeking ) shows. This is the same opinion the "archies" share... they are against these shows.
We MD'ers can work with, and stand alongside the archaeologists in protesting these shows, and
by working together we could all get along much better, and could find common ground if everyone
would just try.

Let's work on the laws if we want more public lands to detect. Otherwise, we will
all be stuck working on private lands , which the "archies" also do not control, but like us, must
also gain permission to investigate.
It's all about the law, folks. Lawmakers make the laws. Not Archaeologists.

 

[lookindown]

.. what most of the good folks here are
not understanding is this: The archaeologists are NOT the ones making
the laws, it's your lawmakers in the state and Fed. governments. The
archaeologists are the ones who are given the task of trying to save
any human or cultural remains from being destroyed, with human remains returned to
the tribe that originally came from the locality where any remains may have been discovered.
No, not all the artifacts dug by archaeologists have been given to museums, because
many are displayed elsewhere, like universities, libraries, colleges and other important public buildings. Furthermore,
there is a shortage of workers to analyze and record the data of said artifacts -before- they can be displayed.
Why are so many of my fellow MD'ers pissed at Archaeologists because they can't detect
the Federal or State lands ? Call your lawmakers on this, not the Archaeologists.
The "archies" do not make these laws governing protected lands. They abide by the laws.
As far as the diggers programs on TV, it looks like about 1/2 the folks on this website are
against these ( treasure seeking ) shows. This is the same opinion the "archies" share... they are against these shows.
We MD'ers can work with, and stand alongside the archaeologists in protesting these shows, and
by working together we could all get along much better, and could find common ground if everyone
would just try.

Let's work on the laws if we want more public lands to detect. Otherwise, we will
all be stuck working on private lands , which the "archies" also do not control, but like us, must
also gain permission to investigate.
It's all about the law, folks. Lawmakers make the laws. Not Archaeologists.

Law makers make the laws and the archies support them, detectorist dont...thats why there is friction between the two groups...plain and simple. Not against archies doing there job...but I am against them not wanting us to detect.

 

[buzzgator]

When metal detecting is outlawed only outlaws and ARCHIES will have metal detectors!

 

[ouachitacaveman]

Please, somebody give me
a reference where an archaeologist has stated he
is against metal detecting as a hobby.

 

[lostcauses]

Alexandre, you shore stirred the pot.
first thing the definition of looting needs to be clarified.
It is not just a pot hunter etc.
It is any one who goes after a item of history for the value of the item itself. It eventually becomes an art form with out the information of exactly were it comes from. cool coin from the past is great to some, were it was found and its relation the the rest of what could be found may have more value. Even a mini ball, arrowhead and so on, can easily fall into this category. .

Once the item has been displaced it no longer has a part other than itself in the history that may or may not have happened at a location.

This is what is meant by an archeologist saying MDrs, relic. artifact hunters are looters.

By there meaning of the term " looters" we mostly are, plain simple: and no way to argue against em.

Now an item found that good records are kept as to were an item came from exactly, it is a different story,
An item in this form can be traced back to its location and posibly add to the history of an area, and not just the item.

The Archeologist would still not like it, yet it goes past what they call "Looting"

Gps and depth of an item is a good way to record the item to its history.

I have already suggested such, and any show should do such showing the log book at the end of the show.

 

[buzzgator]

Caveman, did you not read the opening post? It may not state hobby exactly, but the implication is the same.

 

[buzzgator]

More info? Research this fla archies stance on any type of treasure hunting, Charles T aka chuck Meide. Theres a archie that wants no one without a archie deg or phd by their name finding anything.

 

[ouachitacaveman]

What does he say about the " hobby " in general, since
we are all generalizing here . One "bad archie" doesn't represent the whole field.

I read all the posts including the opening one.
Most of the people here seem to think the
" archies " are against metal-detecting as a hobby.
This is the implication I seek to clarify.
This is not what they demand, despite what has been posted, and I simply want
to know why this is what people are thinking without
any proof. The - laws - seem to be against us, but as people like you and I , not the " archies ".
I personally know too many of
these folks that in no way have these thoughts !
My point is ( the laws ) are what we should be trying to reform,
not the people working to abide by the laws. Please re-read my posts above
if you don't get it.

...... all I want is a link to references ....

 

[buzzgator]

Who do you think writes the briefs or opinions that get these laws started? State and fed archies.

 

[ouachitacaveman]

One "bad archie" doesn't represent the whole field.



Most of the people here seem to think the " archies " are against metal-detecting as a hobby.

This is the implication I seek to clarify.


...... all I want is a link to references ....

 

[buzzgator]

I just gave you the fla state archies name that supported their new bill to basicaly make it iegal to detect all state land including beaches or to remove any object other than modern. Do you expect me to just give you the info? An archie would right? Do a little research heck I found it Im sure you can too. How often have you heard of an archie finding something without being pointed to it by john q public?

 

[ouachitacaveman]

.. so you're saying this one guy, who
"supports" this new bill being proposed in the state of Florida, is the fellow responsible
for all archaeologists being against metal detecting as a hobby ?
Sorry, but he does NOT represent archaeology throughout the world by any means, simply
by this support of a new, proposed law on the beaches of Florida.

 

[Mark S.]

I feel these shows are doing the hobby no good. In fact they could do us harm. I have not seen them and will not watch them. However......

When I read that letter I stopped before getting very far. All I needed to know was the part about Little Big Horn. As someone already stated, the entire dig was done by metal detectorists. About 150 people spent a couple weeks searching a large area. No "archaeological" dig took place. The snob archaes always seem to leave that part out. Taking credit for what a great job that was done. Doug Scott even stated that the dig and all the info learned was due to the use of metal detectors. That out of the over 1000 items dug that only about 20 would have been found by "archaeological" techniques. And it would have taken a long time at taxpayers expense!

Second was the old "human remains" crap. The standard scare tactic. Remains still being found at Gettysburg - huh! Who is finding them? Lets see the proof. No different then the standard lib scare tactics, every time a tax cut is put forth, that it will take the food out of the mouths of children and put old people in the streets. Show me the proof of all these human remains that are being dug by detectorists. Metal detectorists do not dig human remains. ARCHAEOLOGISTS DO! SO who are the grave robbers.

Its time the archaes put up or shut up. Dig the sites or get the hell out of the way. They will NEVER show us any respect. The only way to work with them is to conquer them. Yes I know that is a big statement. And yes there are many who see the light but they are not in the drivers seat and in most cases are shunned by the snobs. I am personally tired of always being a punching bag. No matter what we do they still attack us. There is no making friends. They are two faced.

 

[BARKER]

HI Folks; I'm just curious here. When are We as a Party going to get together and use the exact same tactics that the archies use by having all of us as a Formal Group under one so called Banner and as such then "FLOOD" our Politicians Offices and State in no uncertain terms the real reasons and/or conditions We are faced with in our field 'DAILY'. This would in fact at least give us a Political "Voice." As it stands right now We have "none." We are now just batting in the breeze and getting no where. We "HAVE" tried the nice guy approach. It flat out does not work, PERIOD.!!!! Instead of whining and complaining about Shows like this, why don't We work together and obtain a real set of teeth. I have been in the field for 39 years now and I have always heard the same story. As a result. I have seen the Archies continue to grow in their strength against our hobby/ profession while We just sat there moaning aout the whole mess. I know about the FMDAC. I heard many of us complain about it and now it has become from what I see obsolete thus putting us back at square one. So I guess with all this said that We really have no one to blame but ourselves. Me, I'd like to see this change before this hobby actually does fall by the wayside and another great American Past time does pass. I guess what I'm saying is that time has come for 'ALL" of us to either "PUT UP OR SHUT UP." Now if this sounds harsh to you then I say good because that shows me you are actually paying attention. That in closing for now that if this hobby actually does fold up due to the Regulations then i dare say that none of you has anyone to blame except yourselves ok. PEACE:RONB

 

[buzzgator]

Roflmao! Its pretty obvious that you have a archie fetish. In reading the opening post did you not understand what the acronyms the long lines of letters that dont sound like a word stand for? Well let me tell you they are people just like Mr Meide, who have and are influencing how laws are written. Read it again, if u metal detect and remove a SC PALMETO BUTTON or any relic you are a looter and stealing from the rest of the world! That cant be put be put in much simpler terms.