A Visit to BLM Sacramento Yesterday!!!

[QNCrazy]

I was in Sacramento yesterday and decided to stop by the BLM office to check the status of a claim and some property near my house. The good news is that there is property near my house that is claimable. However, the claim I was looking at appears to be in good standing, for now. The small miner's waiver was filed but no affadavit for assessment. When I asked about the affadavit and the December 30, 2015 deadline, I was told they have a 3 month backlog of paperwork. So I guess I will just have to wait and see. Just wanted to share this info for those who filed their paperwork in December.

 

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[Tuolumne]

maybe we should start a claim jumping post, everyone gets so excited at the new years chance to jump claims.......seems like its easier than ever to take advantage of anothers missed paperwork, Even AMRA and other "pro mining" groups has guys checking the lr2000 data base and others to jump claims when they are available. What happened to helping those who have trouble with the paperwork instead of jumping the claims?? Shannon Poe was on gold radio talk last week bragging about how they use the data base to jump claims that have just been de-activated and open for reclaiming.........Bad Karma dude

http://mixlr.com/goldradiotalk/showreel/ go to minute 10 of the Tues 12 Jan 2016 Shannon Poe tips for claim jumping

QNCrazy, arent you a board member for one of the local clubs?!!

So instead of helping the guy, your waiting to jump his claim. Since you know his claim number you have access to his address for mailing and you can let him know its close to default? Helping him is better than laying in wait to jump his claim!


Mining the miners for sure.....its always the leaders/experienced miners doing the claim jumping, gold club board members or Mining rights groups jumping others land, adding claims to their hoard........

Who hasnt had trouble with BLM paperwork?

Im for helping miners, not jumping claims.........

 

[Goldwasher]

Or he did let it go it only cost him ten bucks? You only have as much info as qncrazy has and has given. He didn't jump anything. In fact he is just mentioning public info so what. He was actually giving a heads up to guys who may get jumped because of the backlog. This is the main reason I do everything before I turn in my waiver and assesment. If you know your gonna hold your claim just do the paperwork and pay. Why wait for December. Pretty rude to accuse a guy of something that it seems he isn't even doing.

 

[Goldwasher]

Also if blm is behind its one thing if a claim holder missed his deadline it's on him and maybe he shouldn't have a claim

 

[Tuolumne]

keep your claim jumping to your self....... not everyone is excited about taking advantage of the misfortune of others or glitch in paperwork and posting/gloating on T-net about it.......He went to the BLM looking to jump it if it was open or a glitch in paperwork made it be open.....read his original post!

its pretty obvious he was looking to get that claim, plus being a Local gold club board member he should know better to be tempted to the dark side and be helping miners rather than hunting and jumping claims.......

even the Head of AMRA on the radio show talked about all the claims hes messed up and how he had been jumped in the past numerous times.....smart guy, doesnt know how many claims hes had and lost track of how many times his paperwork has been wrong........those people are running the show, great.......

miners need to help each other, not wait for claim jumping opportunity to arise.......

My neighbor messed up his paper work, I saw it on the LR2000 and I helped him get it back- thats good karma fellas and I will continue to help my neighbors to dodge the claim jumpers and big clubs/rights groups looking to game the system.

 

[Asmbandits]

keep your claim jumping to your self....... not everyone is excited about taking advantage of the misfortune of others or glitch in paperwork and posting/gloating on T-net about it.......He went to the BLM looking to jump it if it was open or a glitch in paperwork made it be open.....read his original post!

its pretty obvious he was looking to get that claim, plus being a Local gold club board member he should know better to be tempted to the dark side and be helping miners rather than hunting and jumping claims.......

even the Head of AMRA on the radio show talked about all the claims hes messed up and how he had been jumped in the past numerous times.....smart guy, doesnt know how many claims hes had and lost track of how many times his paperwork has been wrong........those people are running the show, great.......

miners need to help each other, not wait for claim jumping opportunity to arise.......

My neighbor messed up his paper work, I saw it on the LR2000 and I helped him get it back- thats good karma fellas and I will continue to help my neighbors to dodge the claim jumpers and big clubs/rights groups looking to game the system.

I agree that helping your neighbor is good carma but I would think that all claim owners should be responsible enough to know the current status of their claim, owning a claim ain't just digging in the dirt you have to be good at the paperwork dance as well! I don't think that someone that is incompetent with this deserves special treatment in this scenario personaly, I sympathise with it to some degree being a claim owner but understand the gist of it as well and don't feel like you can label the people actually doing the research as claim jumpers.

 

[Tuolumne]

Well this sounds like a hunt down a claim thread.

You can always write the owner, " hey I see your one misplaced three month back log of stamps and whistles from losing your claim. You could probably ask to buy it, make an offer, but no, it's wait and see like a claim jumper....


It's a very polarizing subject, I'm not a fan of its use bar none

You can contact the owners always...

 

[mike(swWash)]

If you've had a claim for years and then don't want to go thru all the hoops and jump all the barrels anymore to keep it....it might be time to pass it on.
If it's just a delay of paperwork to keep it, then it's still claimed.
Contact the last claim owner 1st, be kind to our fellow miners.

 

[Goldwasher]

Yea if the paperwork is actually filed there is nothing to even jump. If the original claim still exists then anything after isn't even valid..and therefore nothing is jumped. Going to blm to make sure is not an attempt.
Checking to see in January if a claimant that filed a waiver pre deadline but, didn't turn in their assesment isn't claim jumping. The original post even stated when he heard of the backlog he would wait to see. No one jumped or attempted to jump anything. Telling people to check and see who abandoned their claims is good advice. Poking around after the December deadline is just plain smart. if an abandoned area is open and you want to locate it is your first chance to do so.

 

[Goldwasher]

If you've had a claim for years and then don't want to go thru all the hoops and jump all the barrels anymore to keep it....it might be time to pass it on.
If it's just a delay of paperwork to keep it, then it's still claimed.
Contact the last claim owner 1st, be kind to our fellow miners.

If a claim has been held for years and then suddenly one year the locator doesn't make annual filings it's pretty obvious that they are abandoning their location.

 

[goldenIrishman]

Checking the status of an area is just part of doing the due diligence dance. We all should be dancing to the tune even if we're not looking to claim a plot. Due diligence includes making sure you're not on claimed ground where ever you're prospecting.

Todd, I found an interesting area by keeping my eyes open. Turns out that the current claim "owner" was running a scam and the BLM finely caught up with him. They told him to downsize from 160 acre claims to 20 acres. Well he did so but he messed up. Instead of refiling an adjustment with the county, he filed it with the BLM only. Now BLM is of course glad to take his money, but his claims are no longer valid due to the lack of filing at the county level.

This is one of the main problems of the current system. The County TRUMPS the BLM when it comes to filing, but we pay our fees to the BLM. There is no communication between these two agencies so in truth the left hand hasn't got a clue as to what the right hand is doing. To my mind it would make much more sense to have the individual counties handle both the filings and the fees on claims. They just forward the funds and a list of new filings to the feds at the end of each week. This way when we go to do our research at the county recorders office, we know that the records are accurate. The LR2000 system could also be updated in much the same way that Clay updates the Land Matters information. This would keep the LR2000 up to date, downsize the number of required people at BLM and allow them to get out in the field to manage the public lands like they're supposed to be doing.

 

[Clay Diggins]

Claim owners have 30 days in which to refile their claims if they missed a paperwork deadline.* That's only if they are actively working the claim during those 30 days. No one else is allowed to enter an occupied claim during that time. If they aren't working the claim during those 30 days the claim is open to location by anyone who comes along first.

Congress and the Courts have consistently sided against claim jumpers. Senior locators are given a lot of slack in the laws as they are written and enforced.

Neither Congress or the Courts have any sympathy for locators who don't work or occupy their claims. Occupation is accomplished by notice and maintenance. Any claimant who can't be bothered to maintain their public record or restake their claim when needed will find no comfort in the laws or the courts.

It's not claim jumping to locate on abandoned land. It's impossible and illegal to locate on land that's being worked and has been properly noticed on the ground. As any real miner knows any claim worth having is worth restaking when a paperwork deadline is missed. The 90 day deadline was designed just for situations like this.

Real miners get a lot of slack on their locations. The laws back them up when claim jumpers move in. Taking abandoned claim lands is not claim jumping by any stretch of the imagination. Posers with paper claims will get no slack from the law, the courts or me.

Heavy Pans

*

1872 Mining Act
Section 5
and upon a failure to comply with these conditions, the claim or mine upon which such failure occurred shall be open to relocation in the same manner as if no location of the same had ever been made: Provided, That the original locators, their heirs, assigns, or legal representatives, have not resumed work upon the claim after such failure and before such location.

 

[winners58]

when BLM pop's and closes all the claims usually mid January the claim flippers are ready,
when they close a claim most will have a closed date of sept. 1st
they ether didn't file or didn't fix a curable defect
if a real miner wants a claim he needs to learn the ins & outs and of due diligence.
one claim I got a couple of years ago the claim owner was letting it go and just didn't file,
after talking to him he was very helpful and sent me his original filings so I would know how to write the description.

BLM Handbook H–3830-1 Administration of Mining Claims, Mill Sites, and Tunnel Sites
http://www.blm.gov/style/medialib/b.../H 3830_1 Administration of Mining Claims.pdf

 

[Hoser John]

Both the BLM/FS could NOT find my claims for my public notification of segregation(steal all mining rights for 20 years whilst they try to figure out what they might want to do with my canyon). Ignorance reigns supreme as 23+ years of anal labor and taxes and STILL golly gee wiz attitude sic sic sic-John

 

[QNCrazy]

maybe we should start a claim jumping post, everyone gets so excited at the new years chance to jump claims.......seems like its easier than ever to take advantage of anothers missed paperwork, Even AMRA and other "pro mining" groups has guys checking the lr2000 data base and others to jump claims when they are available. What happened to helping those who have trouble with the paperwork instead of jumping the claims?? Shannon Poe was on gold radio talk last week bragging about how they use the data base to jump claims that have just been de-activated and open for reclaiming.........Bad Karma dude

Goldradiotalk | Showreel | Mixlr go to minute 10 of the Tues 12 Jan 2016 Shannon Poe tips for claim jumping

QNCrazy, arent you a board member for one of the local clubs?!!

So instead of helping the guy, your waiting to jump his claim. Since you know his claim number you have access to his address for mailing and you can let him know its close to default? Helping him is better than laying in wait to jump his claim!


Mining the miners for sure.....its always the leaders/experienced miners doing the claim jumping, gold club board members or Mining rights groups jumping others land, adding claims to their hoard........

Who hasnt had trouble with BLM paperwork?

Im for helping miners, not jumping claims.........

Wo, wo, wo!!!! I didn't even know there was a claim there until last week when I started my research on the land behind my house. Lets not get carried away with the claim jumping accusations. Why do you think I stopped by BLM in the first place? If I wasn't a responsible miner, I would have assumed the claim was defaulting and filed paperwork without doing my research. I had some questions because it looked like the paperwork wasn't in order and I wanted to look at the mapped area. My question was answered when I was told they had a back log of 3 months. By the time I knew there was a claim there and did my research, I would have been too late to help anyone anyway. How about giving credit for doing the research in the first place?

 

[QNCrazy]

Or he did let it go it only cost him ten bucks? You only have as much info as qncrazy has and has given. He didn't jump anything. In fact he is just mentioning public info so what. He was actually giving a heads up to guys who may get jumped because of the backlog. This is the main reason I do everything before I turn in my waiver and assesment. If you know your gonna hold your claim just do the paperwork and pay. Why wait for December. Pretty rude to accuse a guy of something that it seems he isn't even doing.

Thanks for having my back, GW!!!

 

[Bonaro]

maybe we should start a claim jumping post, everyone gets so excited at the new years chance to jump claims.......seems like its easier than ever to take advantage of anothers missed paperwork, Even AMRA and other "pro mining" groups has guys checking the lr2000 data base and others to jump claims when they are available. What happened to helping those who have trouble with the paperwork instead of jumping the claims?? Shannon Poe was on gold radio talk last week bragging about how they use the data base to jump claims that have just been de-activated and open for reclaiming.........Bad Karma dude

Goldradiotalk | Showreel | Mixlr go to minute 10 of the Tues 12 Jan 2016 Shannon Poe tips for claim jumping

QNCrazy, arent you a board member for one of the local clubs?!!

So instead of helping the guy, your waiting to jump his claim. Since you know his claim number you have access to his address for mailing and you can let him know its close to default? Helping him is better than laying in wait to jump his claim!


Mining the miners for sure.....its always the leaders/experienced miners doing the claim jumping, gold club board members or Mining rights groups jumping others land, adding claims to their hoard........

Who hasnt had trouble with BLM paperwork?

Im for helping miners, not jumping claims.........

Sure and while we are at it we can help people who stop paying their mortgage because even though they abandon the house, they are still entitled to full possession of it, right?
So how long does a claim have to be abandoned before it's available to be re-claimed?

 

[Tuolumne]

If u see that the claim was not recently active on lr2000 or from county records then it not claim jumping.

He was watching active claim, he noticed that paper work was not complete, he went down to blm to confirm, then he noticed that is was due to blm backlog. Then he say good news land is claimable but bad news someone still has it unless the paperwork is not right followed by a "well see".

Plus he's a board member of a gold club sneaking around gaming the system when he should be helping miners keep their claims. He never even contacted the owner- thats shady

Why is it Miners are always the ones tryin to take out land just as bad as the environs?
We have to worry from all sides...


That's a claim jumper caught red handed!!

The most dangerous animal a claim owner will encounter is another miner jealous of another's mining rights he doesn't have.

I got my claim the old fashion way, I paid a miner fair and square!

 

[Clay Diggins]

So how long does a claim have to be abandoned before it's available to be re-claimed?

Claims are open to location on the effective date of their abandonment. That is usually September 1.

The prior claimant was notified of the abandonment of their claim by the BLM within 15 days. Most locators are aware of their failure before they receive their mailed notice.

It usually takes the BLM 2 - 3 months to change the LR2000 to reflect a change in claim status - in California it's closer to a year. The prior claimant can reclaim the day after their failure to accomplish their annual maintenance. Other potential locators won't know about the abandonment until the BLM updates their case status or the prior locator tells them of the abandonment and their failure to relocate.

Clearly the prior claimant has all the advantage of notice and time to act over members of the public when it comes to reestablishing the claim if they wish.

It's important to understand that the BLM does not abandon claims. Claims are abandoned by the actions of claimants. A BLM CLOSED status only indicates the BLM has closed the case file for that mining claim. The fact that the BLM takes considerable time to update the case file to CLOSED status doesn't affect the original abandonment date. The claim is always legally abandoned on the day the claimant fails to maintain the claim. There is no requirement in law or regulation to wait for the BLM to update their case file status.

If you want to help claimants maintain their claims the only effective way to do that is to educate them about their legally required maintenance duties BEFORE they abandon their claim.

Once a claim is abandoned there is no way to "fix" it. That claim is null and void (no longer exists) by action of law and custom that goes back thousands of years.

Heavy Pans

 

[Clay Diggins]

various opinions ...*snipped*...

I got my claim the old fashion way, I paid a miner fair and square!

The old fashioned way and the modern way is to discover and locate a valuable mineral deposit on lands open to location and entry.

The fact that you purchased a location from another miner that meets those criteria doesn't diminish the validity of the claim but it doesn't make it legally or morally superior to other discoveries and locations either.

Educate yourself and prosper!

Heavy Pans