Video link to my new device.....

[Jim in Idaho]

Here's a link to a video I did last fall at Bonanza Bar on the Snake. The prototype was built using a cutoff 55 gallon drum. Diameter is about 22". The units I'm selling are 18". They weigh about 11lbs. Made of painted mild steel, with some moving parts made of stainless. Time to let this cat out of the bag...LOL. Looking forward to comments, good or bad. It doesn't look like much, does it? Hard to believe how well it recovers the ultra-fine gold, even fed nearly bank-run material. And very little water for it's size. The bed is 254 sq.inches.
Jim

 

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[Jim in Idaho]

I'm not sure where I'm going with this, at this time. I'm 69 years old, and spent 44 years doing hard labor in the concrete business. I don't really want to spend all day in the shop, even if I could. (and I can't). I'm thinking of finding somebody to make and sell them, and pay me a royalty. But I could build these in any size, and figured I would at some point. The design sort of limits the overall diameter. I think 6' would be a reasonable max. I think a 30" would tax two guys to keep up with. The feed rate it can handle is pretty high. I was working pretty slow at BB, but had to walk back and forth, and clean the large rocks out of the shovel, etc. Should have had 3 guys feeding it in that situation. For one guy I think the 18" is about right, depending on each situation.
Jim

 

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[arizau]

I know you have done a lot of testing. I am thinking more along the line that each sweep could be a small diameter, horizontal (cylinder) roller/idler made up of several small segments of the same size sort of like this ---------. Just clarifying my previous post and assuming that the blade you are now using has a straight edge along the top that is angled down to the hub.

All the best.

 

[Jim in Idaho]

I know you have done a lot of testing. I am thinking more along the line that each sweep could be a small diameter, horizontal (cylinder) roller/idler made up of several small segments of the same size sort of like this ---------. Just clarifying my previous post and assuming that the blade you are now using has a straight edge along the top that is angled down to the hub.

All the best.

I get what you're saying, and thought of it myself. (proving that great minds think alike). The trouble is that each roller, to be tangent to the circle it prescribes around the center of rotation, has to be at a different angle to the arm. if you look closely at the pic of the roller arm, you can see the rollers are at varied angles. Close to 90* at the outer end, and almost parallel at the inner end. This is caused by the arms being offset from the center of rotation.
Jim

 

[Goldwasher]

The gold collects on the diaphragm. The diaphragm droops about 6 degrees to the center, or a little more. The collection zone is at the bottom center of the diaphragm.
This device is mainly for people recovering flour. If you're after gold in the +30 mesh range, might as well use a sluice....other than the sluice can't be used dry....LOL
Jim

Ahhh cool.

Let me know if you want to try some cordura I can get free samples

It has texture too

 

[Capt Nemo]

What about going with a layer of canvas and the visqueen over the top?

 

[Jim in Idaho]

What about going with a layer of canvas and the visqueen over the top?

Yup....that would work. I often put a layer of visqueen over the rubberized fabric on the proto.....mainly because the visqueen is so slick.....I think it helps to recover the flour. Less friction as the flour slides down the slope. That's another reason I like the visqueen as diaphragm material.
Jim

 

[Assembler]

Yup....that would work. I often put a layer of visqueen over the rubberized fabric on the proto.....mainly because the visqueen is so slick.....I think it helps to recover the flour. Less friction as the flour slides down the slope. That's another reason I like the visqueen as diaphragm material.
Jim

A cotton / nylon blend fabric will last longer then straight cotton. Thanks for sharing the very interesting prototype. Have you tried on screened material to increase the amount per hour?
What kind of plastic paddles are used on the rotating arms?
Thanks.

 

[Johnnybravo300]

I haven't heard this album since I was 16!! Would make an awesome background to a video!

 

[Assembler]

On the cons...assuming you know the largest gold size in the spot you're working, you just screen the cons to that size, and then pan what goes through the screen. When you're done with a run, you let the unit run until nothing more comes off the edge. At that point, with an 18" unit, you have about a gallon, or a bit more of material left on the diaphragm. Just screen that to the largest gold size you expect, and pan the remainder. On the Snake I screened to 30 mesh, as there isn't anything larger in the river.
Reed, under the diaphragm is nothing more than a rotating arm assembly, that contacts the bottom surface of the diaphragm and causes it to go up and down in waves.
There are some beneficial aspects to the makeup of those arms...orientation, angle, offset, etc. I'm not yet releasing all that, as testing is ongoing.

Audigger....I haven't run it more than 3 hours, continuously, but have done that several times. The weak spot in the unit is wear on the diaphragm. My overall aim was to make a rig that is really easy to maintain, and requires few special parts. The diaphragm material was a stumbling block in that desire. I tried different materials, and they all worked, but some had to be ordered online, and were costly. I finally tried plain old 6mil visqueen, and it worked better that I expected. It lasts about 2 hours, or a little more, and is available everywhere, and dirt cheap. I usually run it with 2 layers, though I've run the unit, dry, with a single layer, for over 3 hours before the first holes appeared. The rubbing underneath is where the wear shows up. Also visqueen is available in larger rolls in 10 mil, which would last even longer.
The diaphragms are easy to change out, of course.
Another point is noise. The prototype in the video required a larger gearmotor. I had to add an extra outside gearset to slow that motor down. That gearset is kinda crude, and that's what you hear clattering in the video. The finished units are extremely quiet, as they run through a simple enclosed worm gear. The motors, however, are not waterproof.
Here's a pic of the frame of one of the later versions.
Jim View attachment 1559464

Reed, this pic is for you....LOL....whats under the old lady's skirt! View attachment 1559461

Really like your idea.
You may want to make a 4 blade paddle. You may like the worm gear drive box that is used on some older sunbeam (electric larger mixer) for a reduction in speed. A weed eater type gas engine may be interesting to help with the battery weight. Just some ideas. In fact a weed eater with the long shaft would help as the engine would be away from the dust.

If the speed is to fast with just one 40:1 gear box use two in line to really get the speed down. Plus like the idea of a enclosed gear box as well.

 

[Jim in Idaho]

I hate gas engines on my gear...no offense. I've tried 4-blade paddles, and the results weren't good. They'd definitely be needed on larger diameter units, though. They have to remain simple, and easy to maintain. A broken down unit, waiting on parts, doesn't help anybody find gold. Also, cost is a factor. Everything needs to be simple to keep costs down. Putting a a horizontal shaft in, and a bevel gear set to drive the vertical shaft just adds to the build complexity, and thus the cost. I toyed with making a model that was hand-powered via a horizontal shaft, but a quality bevel gear set, to convert the horizontal rotation to vertical rotation, was more expensive than the 12v gearmotor, not to mention the addition of the horizontal shaft.
Jim

 

[Assembler]

I hate gas engines on my gear...no offense. I've tried 4-blade paddles, and the results weren't good. They'd definitely be needed on larger diameter units, though. They have to remain simple, and easy to maintain. A broken down unit, waiting on parts, doesn't help anybody find gold. Also, cost is a factor. Everything needs to be simple to keep costs down. Putting a a horizontal shaft in, and a bevel gear set to drive the vertical shaft just adds to the build complexity, and thus the cost. I toyed with making a model that was hand-powered via a horizontal shaft, but a quality bevel gear set, to convert the horizontal rotation to vertical rotation, was more expensive than the 12v gearmotor, not to mention the addition of the horizontal shaft.
Jim

Just thinking there would be less wear per hour as well as 4 waves per rotation instead of 2. Speed will be a factor as well. Have both a electric and gas models and be sure to install third party muffler for sure with a spark-arrester. Don't change the paddle design as this appears to work very well. Thanks.

You may want to try mounting the gear boxes on the end of the vertical shaft you are using now just a idea. Yes the cost will be more.

 

[Assembler]

The increased costs is not the biggest factor if the unit cannot handle say a number of tons to help pay for itself.
By the way a 2 cycle engine does not care if it runs up side down or up right. Toss the factory muffler away and use a better one. A 4 cycle engine is a nice option.
Running gear oil in the gear box (if you can) would help big time as far as maintenance goes. Sealed bearings would be nice everywhere.

A small garden tractor gearbox may work for much deeper material. Just a idea.

 

[Assembler]

A rack with wide rollers can be used as a 'Hand powered De-rocker' if the container is rectangular shape. Just like Fred Hurt's shaped 'De-rocker'.

 

[arizau]

I get what you're saying, and thought of it myself. (proving that great minds think alike). The trouble is that each roller, to be tangent to the circle it prescribes around the center of rotation, has to be at a different angle to the arm. if you look closely at the pic of the roller arm, you can see the rollers are at varied angles. Close to 90* at the outer end, and almost parallel at the inner end. This is caused by the arms being offset from the center of rotation.
Jim

I failed to realize that you have the arms offset from the hub for a reason. I can see that that allows stirring across the center of the bed promoting better concentration.

Wow. Why didn't I think of that considering great minds think alike.

 

[Jim in Idaho]

I failed to realize that you have the arms offset from the hub for a reason. I can see that that allows stirring across the center of the bed promoting better concentration.

Wow. Why didn't I think of that considering great minds think alike.

That also causes a "sweeping" action towards the center that increases the recovery.:-)
Jim

 

[Jim in Idaho]

OK guys. I've got 3 of these ready to go, and would like to get test results back from people other than myself. Here's what I came up with, and hope you find it fair. Whoever wants in on this should PM me. You pay me $100 up front thru PayPal. That covers the building of the reusable shipping crates, and the shipping. You use the unit for a month or so. After that you either send it back, at your expense, (thus the reusable shipping crates), or send me another $350 to pay the material cost, and s small portion of my labor building the units. I'm not going to quibble over an extra couple weeks of use.
These steel units will probably be the only steel units built. I'm going to a full plastic body next, and probably will replace the metal main beam with plastic, too. The idea being to reduce the number of parts, and also decrease the labor costs. If I get more than 3 people wanting to do this, I'll choose who gets them based on their location. I'd like to get at least one out to somebody who can run dry tests. Of course, I prefer people who I've had contact with in the past(you know ho you are), along with Charter members, but will consider anybody.
Thanks,
Jim

 

[Lookinghard]

feed rate of 22-1/2"

Hi Jim,

I read your estimate of persons that could feed units of various diameters. Could you say if just feeding, how many gallons of -1" material/minute or buckets/hr a 22-1/2" could handle on a sustained basis? How much might clay and dirt slow that down?

thanks

 

[Assembler]

Hi Jim,

I read your estimate of persons that could feed units of various diameters. Could you say if just feeding, how many gallons of -1" material/minute or buckets/hr a 22-1/2" could handle on a sustained basis? How much might clay and dirt slow that down?

thanks

If the clay is dry or near dry maybe it can be tumbled off of the rock first. Then process the clay separate after pulverizing the clay. This has to be faster then hand panning in general.

Be interesting to try this machine with 8 mesh material.

 

[Jim in Idaho]

Hi Jim,

I read your estimate of persons that could feed units of various diameters. Could you say if just feeding, how many gallons of -1" material/minute or buckets/hr a 22-1/2" could handle on a sustained basis? How much might clay and dirt slow that down?

thanks

Honestly, I don't know. Based on my other jigs, I'm guessing about 50 gallons/hour, but I don't have enough use with this device to know for sure. I did note, that while down at BB, I'd put a short shovelful in, and the machine digested it almost instantly.....no change in the height of the mound under the feed funnel. I'm sure it would handle 1 gallon/minute, easily, and probably twice that. But these smaller units are more for prospecting than mining. Another thing to keep in mind is that the diaphragm should be emptied, and inspected, approximately hourly, depending on the material used for the diaphragm. Since the gold is captured on the diaphragm, there's a limited volume it can hold, though I dream of the day my diaphragm overflows with gold...LOL On the 18incher that would be 112 cu.in. of gold!
On the clay and dirt issue, running wet, provided you use clean water, the clay and mud don't matter, though I haven't run it in muddy conditions. I read a paper awhile back, and the doctoral guys that wrote it said that dirty water has a big impact on how fast flour gold sinks, and it doesn't take a lot of dirt to cause flour to not sink at all. In fact, dirty water had the greatest impact on sink rate...more than the current speed, agitation of the water, etc. That's the reason flour stays high in the water column during high water, and ends up on top of the sandbars.
Jim

 

[Jim in Idaho]

Well, the first unit goes out to Canada this morning. Going to be used on the Seskatchewan. I'm excited!
Jim