A little more for the small operator.

[Mad Machinist]

I know someone that scraps/rebuilds EV batteries. They could set you up with a complete pack in the shape you wanted, with the required electronics for probably $5K.

When I have time, I don't have the money and visa versa. With copper jumping in price, we are starting to spool back up. Hopefully soon though.

 

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How to Research for Treasure Hunting and Metal Detecting From Lead Generation to Vetting - Grab it through Amazon!

[Mountaineer2020]

This month, I did some research on equipment rentals for the January ICMJ. There is a surprising amount of stuff that United Rentals and other places carry. Almost all of them have those little Bobcat S70 skidsteers that fit through a doorway, as well as mini-excavators. There is a whole industry around machines that you can drive into a suburban back yard. It might be worthwhile to rent some of these little machines to get an idea of the bucket size and footprint that works well for your operation.

Looking forward to reading this! I might call around and see what a monthly rental rate would be. On another note have you seen any articles about laying track for ore carts? The mine I'm working in was developed with ore carts and consequently isn't very wide. For most of the workings nothing else will fit without alot of additional widening and bracing. Trouble is I've never put down track or laid out a system for tramming ore.

 

[HardRockNM]

Looking forward to reading this! I might call around and see what a monthly rental rate would be. On another note have you seen any articles about laying track for ore carts? The mine I'm working in was developed with ore carts and consequently isn't very wide. For most of the workings nothing else will fit without alot of additional widening and bracing. Trouble is I've never put down track or laid out a system for tramming ore.

I've seen weekly rates of $500-600 for an S70. The United Rental yard a couple miles from me has a pair - I'm looking forward to renting one for a small underground project.

You may want to look at the old Peele Manuals from the early 1900s for rail technique. I know some old-timers who know how to lay rail, but everything I do is rubber-tire. I can find tons of rail equipment, but have no interest in utilizing it at this time.

 

[Mountaineer2020]

I've seen weekly rates of $500-600 for an S70. The United Rental yard a couple miles from me has a pair - I'm looking forward to renting one for a small underground project.

You may want to look at the old Peele Manuals from the early 1900s for rail technique. I know some old-timers who know how to lay rail, but everything I do is rubber-tire. I can find tons of rail equipment, but have no interest in utilizing it at this time.

Looked up the Peele Manual. It's amazing how much of a difference having a name to look for in a search engine helps. Couldn't find anything searching for mining rails, ore cart track etc.. Peele Mining manual though jackpot! Thanks. So it's 3 hours to the mine and there's about 2 foot of snow there right now. All I can do is think and scheme. Latest idea is core drills. Is that something anyone has done or is it best hired? It seems if a fella could core 100 feet or even 50 feet might save alot of work rather than crosscutting or drifting and hoping. Stuff is real pockety here and I think it might be a good way to find those pockets. I haven't priced any out and am not too sure how they work but this https://www.canyonequipment.com/productdetail/bazooka-drill looks kinda good. Core size is only 1" for a 100 ft. hole. Would that be a large enough sample to determine anything?

 

[HardRockNM]

Looked up the Peele Manual. It's amazing how much of a difference having a name to look for in a search engine helps. Couldn't find anything searching for mining rails, ore cart track etc.. Peele Mining manual though jackpot! Thanks. So it's 3 hours to the mine and there's about 2 foot of snow there right now. All I can do is think and scheme. Latest idea is core drills. Is that something anyone has done or is it best hired? It seems if a fella could core 100 feet or even 50 feet might save alot of work rather than crosscutting or drifting and hoping. Stuff is real pockety here and I think it might be a good way to find those pockets. I haven't priced any out and am not too sure how they work but this https://www.canyonequipment.com/productdetail/bazooka-drill looks kinda good. Core size is only 1" for a 100 ft. hole. Would that be a large enough sample to determine anything?

Glad that helped you out.

The main mine I'm working with has a core drill (old Boyles Brothers pneumatic) but nobody who knows how to use it, myself included. Having it contracted will be very expensive - drilling contractors usually charge by the foot as well as a substantial mobilization fee. You could certainly use a "backpack" or other small core drill, and will probably be decently happy with its work product as far as getting you core in hand, but core is not foolproof and can give misleading results in a pockety deposit.

The mine down here is gold/silver hosted in a portion of a quartz vein. Especially in the upper levels, values are primarily contained in "black sulfide" (pyrrhotite) nodules with irregular size and spacing. They're typically marble- to baseball-sized and can run $50,000 per ton but the overall ore averages 0.15-1opt Au because of the barren quartz.This makes for a sort of reversed nugget effect, where a single core hole can hit barren quartz and miss a super-high-grade nodule by less than an inch. Short-range exploration has therefore taken two forms: drifting (more feasible with a 911, other small loader, or a slusher) and longhole drilling.

The latter would be my suggestion to you - an air track drill or heavy jackleg with steels capable of being threaded together can drill surprisingly far. You'll get cuttings rather than cores, which is less visually impressive but cores have to be crushed for assay anyways...only practical downside is the comparatively limited drill distance and the fact that your intervals will not be as cleanly defined.

We've discussed 50' production holes with the air track, which we believe is about the limit before downhole deviation becomes enough to cause problems in a longhole stope (overbreak/underbreak/dilution). The particular drill in question is a Gardner Denver 3100 with a PR-123 hammer and upgraded hydraulic centralizer. You can go further but the hole will start to wander a bit - just remember that the requirements for production blasting are different for those from short-range exploration. Obviously a jackleg will not drill as far - the hammer just isn't as strong. I can ask about what practical distances they've achieved with Gardner Denver 83s versus one of the about five air tracks scattered across the district. While the crew did do something like a 200' longhole to assess a high-pressure injection dewatering technique before a discharge permit was greenlit, these drills suffer exponential decay in drilling speed with very long holes.

Just remember that whatever equipment you buy, you're buying into its dealer/parts ecosystem as well. While EIMCO got gobbled up by Sandvik, only the axles and drivetrain components are especially uncommon - a good shop can rebuild much of that. The engines, tires, and hydraulics are commodities that most tractor dealers will support, and Pillar Manufacturing is happy to sell miscellaneous spares. Same for Young Buggies - they're a Deutz tractor engine, Funk 33000-type HMD transmission and reverser, an Eaton rear end, basic hydraulics, and a bunch of sheet metal work. Bobcat will be even better.

 

[Mad Machinist]

Glad that helped you out.

The main mine I'm working with has a core drill (old Boyles Brothers pneumatic) but nobody who knows how to use it, myself included. Having it contracted will be very expensive - drilling contractors usually charge by the foot as well as a substantial mobilization fee. You could certainly use a "backpack" or other small core drill, and will probably be decently happy with its work product as far as getting you core in hand, but core is not foolproof and can give misleading results in a pockety deposit.

The mine down here is gold/silver hosted in a portion of a quartz vein. Especially in the upper levels, values are primarily contained in "black sulfide" (pyrrhotite) nodules with irregular size and spacing. They're typically marble- to baseball-sized and can run $50,000 per ton but the overall ore averages 0.15-1opt Au because of the barren quartz.This makes for a sort of reversed nugget effect, where a single core hole can hit barren quartz and miss a super-high-grade nodule by less than an inch. Short-range exploration has therefore taken two forms: drifting (more feasible with a 911, other small loader, or a slusher) and longhole drilling.

The latter would be my suggestion to you - an air track drill or heavy jackleg with steels capable of being threaded together can drill surprisingly far. You'll get cuttings rather than cores, which is less visually impressive but cores have to be crushed for assay anyways...only practical downside is the comparatively limited drill distance and the fact that your intervals will not be as cleanly defined.

We've discussed 50' production holes with the air track, which we believe is about the limit before downhole deviation becomes enough to cause problems in a longhole stope (overbreak/underbreak/dilution). The particular drill in question is a Gardner Denver 3100 with a PR-123 hammer and upgraded hydraulic centralizer. You can go further but the hole will start to wander a bit - just remember that the requirements for production blasting are different for those from short-range exploration. Obviously a jackleg will not drill as far - the hammer just isn't as strong. I can ask about what practical distances they've achieved with Gardner Denver 83s versus one of the about five air tracks scattered across the district. While the crew did do something like a 200' longhole to assess a high-pressure injection dewatering technique before a discharge permit was greenlit, these drills suffer exponential decay in drilling speed with very long holes.

Just remember that whatever equipment you buy, you're buying into its dealer/parts ecosystem as well. While EIMCO got gobbled up by Sandvik, only the axles and drivetrain components are especially uncommon - a good shop can rebuild much of that. The engines, tires, and hydraulics are commodities that most tractor dealers will support, and Pillar Manufacturing is happy to sell miscellaneous spares. Same for Young Buggies - they're a Deutz tractor engine, Funk 33000-type HMD transmission and reverser, an Eaton rear end, basic hydraulics, and a bunch of sheet metal work. Bobcat will be even better.

I might be able to help you out with that core drill. Been awhile since I ran one but it should come back to me.

 

[HardRockNM]

Regarding the Bobcat S70, I had the opportunity to run one for work last week and thought folks here would find my impressions of the machine interesting. The S70 I operated has about 1200 hours on it, solid tires (whether foam-filled or solid rubber I don't know), a 36" bucket, and the 23.5HP Kubota water-cooler diesel.

The positives: I was impressed by the tramming speed, cutting edge visibility, and ease of cab access. The ROPS/FOPS appears robust and provides good coverage for the operator except to the front. It is an uncomplicated and entirely electromechanical machine, so maintainability is likely excellent for the owner-operator. Build quality is typical for a skid - no cheap plastic fairings in sight.

The negatives: There are a lot of these. It had a tendency to "skip" when turning too tightly, which I suspect is related to the solid/filled tires. The ride was also rough and jarring for this reason. Rearward and rear-quarter visibility were both exceptionally poor and completely unsuited to operation in an underground mine environment without adding a backup camera. You'd leave a lot of paint on the ribs! Breakout force and crowding capacity were seriously limited - obtaining a full bucket of 4"-minus crushed stone was a challenge and involved a lot of wheel spin. The boom and bucket foot controls were both stiff and fatiguing to operate, and the bucket cylinder was prone to jerking down several inches at random with no change in control pressure while dumping.Of course, downforce and carrying capacity were limited but these are a consequence of the machine's size so I don't hold them against it.

Overall I don't think I'd waste my time with one as a production machine. They're suited to light-duty construction and landscape work, not production duty. I'd rather have a slusher, small LHD, or maybe even an overshot mucker. For an extra 18" in width, a 911B is ten times the machine an S70 is.

 

[Mountaineer2020]

Regarding the Bobcat S70, I had the opportunity to run one for work last week and thought folks here would find my impressions of the machine interesting. The S70 I operated has about 1200 hours on it, solid tires (whether foam-filled or solid rubber I don't know), a 36" bucket, and the 23.5HP Kubota water-cooler diesel.

The positives: I was impressed by the tramming speed, cutting edge visibility, and ease of cab access. The ROPS/FOPS appears robust and provides good coverage for the operator except to the front. It is an uncomplicated and entirely electromechanical machine, so maintainability is likely excellent for the owner-operator. Build quality is typical for a skid - no cheap plastic fairings in sight.

The negatives: There are a lot of these. It had a tendency to "skip" when turning too tightly, which I suspect is related to the solid/filled tires. The ride was also rough and jarring for this reason. Rearward and rear-quarter visibility were both exceptionally poor and completely unsuited to operation in an underground mine environment without adding a backup camera. You'd leave a lot of paint on the ribs! Breakout force and crowding capacity were seriously limited - obtaining a full bucket of 4"-minus crushed stone was a challenge and involved a lot of wheel spin. The boom and bucket foot controls were both stiff and fatiguing to operate, and the bucket cylinder was prone to jerking down several inches at random with no change in control pressure while dumping.Of course, downforce and carrying capacity were limited but these are a consequence of the machine's size so I don't hold them against it.

Overall I don't think I'd waste my time with one as a production machine. They're suited to light-duty construction and landscape work, not production duty. I'd rather have a slusher, small LHD, or maybe even an overshot mucker. For an extra 18" in width, a 911B is ten times the machine an S70 is.

The review really helped HardRock. I had been thinking about the S70. Crossing it off the want list. Thanks.

 

[HardRockNM]

The review really helped HardRock. I had been thinking about the S70. Crossing it off the want list. Thanks.

Glad it was helpful. The visibility was the worst part. I would not have confidence in my ability to reverse in tight headings with one. Anecdotally, I've been impressed by the Bobcat MT85 stand-on machines; their visibility is better and operating height is not constrained by a ROPS (though you can knock yourself off the machine via careless operation). The mine I work at for my day job uses both S70s and MT85s for conveyor cleanup, including tunnel work. The MT85s do not bog down as badly when digging, either.

Since that post, my 911B has gotten a bit of use as a forklift and jib crane with a set of screw-on loader forks, which I thought some here would enjoy hearing about given the preponderance of one-man/one-machine mines. I use a set of 4000lb Titan forks; the machine is rated for 5000lb lift/tram capacity but I don't feel comfortable with more than a ton for CG reasons, especially when articulated. It picked a whole bunch of 55-gallon drums and a big double-drum slusher without hesitation. Fork visibility is basically nonexistent from the cockpit, so a spotter is desirable. I've also had some luck slotting the forks into the pallet and maneuvering the machine into the forks. The boom and bucket controls are accessible from outside the machine - I've been known to set the parking brake and dismount for fine positioning.

 

[BlasterJ]

The Tourmaline mine down here uses the stand-on Bobcat with good results.

 

[HardRockNM]

The Tourmaline mine down here uses the stand-on Bobcat with good results.

I've seen a video or two of that machine operating there. It seems like a good fit for such a low-tonnage operation.