Geoglyphs? Around The LDM?

[SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN]

I have a theory. I call it maps before paper. You can follow the trail out of Mexico right to the mines. When you heard the words in an old western movie by an Indian Scout. " No White Man can (see) read the signs." For all of you who believe that Indian Scout was talking about tracks, broken twigs, bent arms on cacti, tracking footsteps or animal hooves are in for a surprise. My theory goes like this. Example: Just suppose Don Peralta has large amounts of peons coming to the Superstitions to work the various known mines. Do you send them a map like those engraved on the stones? Kind of cumbersome to have all those miners carrying around huge rock maps. "The maps before paper". Okay, say they have copies of the Stone Tablets, each group; these mines have to be marked and the paths to them need to have monuments to show the way to the 18 mines and to assure the miners they are on the right track. Have you seen Don Peralta's map? Research? All those things were used that I listed above, but they were not the only ways they monumented the Superstitions. The Intaglios and petroglyhs and pictographs are everywhere and so is colorful artwork that utilizes art within art. Meaning far away something looks one way and then when you get closer you see the art is made up of other smaller figures, animals, markings, numbers, etc. People looking straight up at the gods and pointing out where to look for precious metal. The Indians are spiritual and this makes sense, they did everything with a religious bent with the approval of the gods. Side bar: Some of the repeated markings are horses, cougars, Indian chiefs, Indian children, Indian Women, turtles, Conquistadors, kings, Jesus, etc. What I need to tell you now is the fact that they really can make this art different at every view because they put art within art in a caricature type art. Very deceiving unless you have spent thousands of hours looking at them in person, (ten (10) trips personally into the Superstitions and in the vicinity with my partner who also happens to be a woman prospector who carries a gun because she is an X-sharpshooter for the military. Example: Rogers Tough, Tortilla Flat, Fish Canyon, Canyon Lake, Peralta Trail and vicinity, etc.) and on Google Earth. There is artwork on the ground, on the sheer cliffs, on top of huge mountains. These Indian monuments do not just apply to gold. They marked all places precious metals could be found: Turquoise, copper, platinum, silver, gold, etc. How they do this is with color within the symbols. If you read Bob Wards books he understood they would use actual gold wedged into the high cliffs that told the Mexican or Indian miner to dig down below. Research? They also place what I call round gems in the middle of the symbols that mark mines such as a circle within a circle with this colored gem in the middle. They not only told you where to dig they told you what you would find there. Which way to go right or left? The artwork will point the right way. Now, I also helped with a book published in November 2006. I am not here to sell books. Which started me on this journey to learn more and more through lectures at the Superstition Mountains Museum, from geologists to gold panning lessons, to theories of books being written by authors that are really off the mark. (My opinion.) Now, guys can we have a serious discussion about this. Many of these works of art, will be introduced to the world for the first time. The Superstitions are well monumented and when White Men can read the signs maybe we can change the laws to allow us to go get the rich minerals that are very prevalent in the Superstition Mountains and the Tonto National Forest.

Please Make all future contact @ > [email protected] Thank you Assistant """"I agree Absolutely Here is a nighttime shot Assistant, And I hereby Am giving Superstition Mountain Museum the right to post any and all of my info Discovery Details, or pics, for any use of or in the museum, at absoluteley no charge to the museum."""" Sincerely John V. Kemm "Here Is A night time shot."

 

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[Oroblanco]

Santa Fe NM wrote

Geoglyphs? Around The LDM?

,

Just a suggestion, but there is a board here on T-net for the purpose of posting our Google Earth discoveries; in fact the title says
Potential treasure hunting hotspots and points of discovery! Share your Google Earth discoveries! Post your Google Earth (.kml) files here!
http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/board,313.0.html

Next, when you say "geoglyphs" some of us are expecting to see real geoglyphs, like this

<the "Blythe Giant" in the Mojave desert, California>

Have you found actual geoglyphs in the Superstition mountains, like what most people define as geoglyphs, that is a large man-made or man-altered landscape, and not just a natural formation of the topography that appears to resemble something if you squint your eyes a bit? Natural landforms are not, by definition, a geoglyph*. Thank you in advance;
Oroblanco

"Geoglyph: •A large-scale drawing made on the ground by scratching or arranging lines of stones etc"

 

[SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN]

ORO WROTE :Have you found actual geoglyphs in the Superstition mountains, like what most people define as geoglyphs, that is a large man-made or man-altered landscape, and not just a natural formation of the topography that appears to resemble something if you squint your eyes a bit? Natural landforms are not, by definition, a geoglyph*. Thank you in advance;
Oroblanco

"Geoglyph: •A large-scale drawing made on the ground by scratching or arranging lines of stones etc" Ive already recieved confirmation from Assistant. Its has been the best year of my life and ill "never forget" all the hard times you gave me. And My Pics And Info Discovery details Will Be on display At "Superstition Mountain Museum!" So just Give Up the argument ORE! I am now only dealing with The Museum And Heres your ore Oro! Asta! Oh and Thank you in advance.

 

[Oroblanco]

Santa Fe NM wrote

ORO WROTE :Have you found actual geoglyphs in the Superstition mountains, like what most people define as geoglyphs, that is a large man-made or man-altered landscape, and not just a natural formation of the topography that appears to resemble something if you squint your eyes a bit? Natural landforms are not, by definition, a geoglyph*. Thank you in advance;
Oroblanco

"Geoglyph: •A large-scale drawing made on the ground by scratching or arranging lines of stones etc" Ive already recieved confirmation from Assistant. Its has been the best year of my life and ill "never forget" all the hard times you gave me. And My Pics And Info Discovery details Will Be on display At "Superstition Mountain Museum!" So just Give Up the argument ORE! I am now only dealing with The Museum And Heres your ore Oro! Asta! Oh and Thank you in advance.

Hard times? By asking to see an ore sample and real geoglyphs? If you think that is a hard time - what will you tell the TV and news reporters, for they are sure to ask or even demand to see absolute proof to back up your claims amigo.

You don't have to show me (or anyone reading our discussions) the proof being asked for, that is your prerogative. I just thought that your thread here, saying there are geoglyphs in the Superstitions meant that you had found some - there are, after all some pretty unusual things in the Superstitions like Circlestone or ancient irrigation canals etc; heck our mutual amigo Blindbowman stated that he had found an 'Aztec' ballcourt, which would be quite a find and is NOT impossible for several such ballcourts have been found in the southwest. There is even a 'hieroglyphic' type of solar calendar in one canyon too - in the canyon named "Hierglyphic canyon". Very cool and mysterious REAL sites amigo, so when you started this thread I thought WOW - maybe he found some geoglyphs! All I have seen you post however are all natural formations seen by satellite imagery - they may be interesting and could "fit" the Peralta stones but are they really geoglyphs? You seem to know the meaning of the word, so are you withholding photos of actual geoglyphs that you found in the Superstitions, or do you mean the natural formations that you already posted? Are they in the satellite pix you posted, just that I can't pick them out?

Give up the "argument" - sheesh all I am asking is for you to convince me it is not really an argument. If you are going to get so rattled by a fellow treasure hunter simply asking to see the evidence to prove what you found, you are sure in for a shock when you take this to a news media interview! Archaeologists and historians will be even more 'critical' and want to see things that are not something you have to squint your eyes to see amigo. I am not just trying to antagonize you John, but when you say "this is the LDM" or that you found geoglyphs, I am asking to see that proof - it is not an insult or personal attack. You will be asked much tougher questions by reporters, historians etc than you will ever get from me - heck I WANT to believe you, I just need to see that proof.

If you don't want to show us an ore sample, that is your decision. I will very probably be visiting the very museum you named, <in a couple of months or so, God willing and the crick don't rise> perhaps I can see your evidence there? Either way, I am still curious if you found geoglyphs, that is man-made artwork that is so large it is best viewed from the air - for I can't see any in the images posted so far. If I am just missing it, may I ask you to outline it or high-light it on the photo, so that even a dim bulb like me can make it out? Thank you in advance;
Oroblanco

 

[Oroblanco]

PS - I don't know why you put that ugly mug at the bottom of your post there amigo, why that face could frighten small children! Remember this is a family-oriented site, we don't need to be giving the kiddies any nightmares from seeing such a MUG. That fellow looks like a downright bum!

 

[SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN]

[mod] Terms of Use Violation[/mod]

 

[Oroblanco]

Well gee John don't soft-peddle it, tell me what you really think. Lets see, out of courtesy I will reply to your questions.

<you wrote>

Who Are You Are You the museum

I have told you my name, it is no secret, I am a fellow treasure hunter as you are. No, I sure am not the museum.


Well, everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I don't ask you to trust me. However as you have already broadcast your LDM site all over the internet, what do you think I am going to do - go and "poach" your gold away from you? I don't even live in AZ now amigo.



Well so far, all I have seen from you are a bunch of Google Earth images, personal attacks and even threats of lawsuit. You think that sort of thing is making ME look bad? Maybe you need to re-think your tactics a bit. As for being "on to me bigtime" what is my big secret? I would love to know what that is.



Give what up? My disbelief of your claims? Like I mentioned to you before, if you think that I am being way too skeptical, you are in for the shock of a lifetime when you start talking to the news reporters. You sure are getting wound up over my asking to see proof to back up what you have been proclaiming all over the internet for a year now. I still have choice amigo, and still haven't put you on 'ignore' as much as you may wish I would - for I still keep hoping that you do have some kind of solid proof, that you really did find the Lost Dutchman, though I am starting to doubt you found any real geoglyphs. Are the Google Earth satellite images the only sort of proof you have? If so, then I must remain respectfully un-convinced. Sorry but no cigar amigo.

Your little rants here are starting to get old Santa Fe NM, this sort of thing is just not going to help your case. Good luck and good hunting John, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.
Oroblanco

 

[Oroblanco]

What is with this name-calling? How old are you John? Are you getting yourself worked up because a fellow treasure hunter isn't convinced of what you say you found? Do you think that calling names is going to make a favorable impression on the children that read Treasurenet? Do you think that calling me names is going to convince me that you found the LDM? So Assistant has already given you the proverbial cigar - then you don't need one from me. As for where I reside, it is on Earth*, if you are convinced that I am on another planet, then where are you located? (*Earth is the third one rotating around the Sun, counting out from it*) You are sure convincing me of one thing, John, though it isn't the LDM or any geoglyphs!

Have a good evening John, signing off so you can go ahead now and call me all the names you wish, threaten lawsuits or whatever, and I won't reply for at least 12 to 16 hours. I would suggest a good cup of coffee and a donut, but the caffiene might get you even more excited. Maybe have a cup of hot cocoa?
Oroblanco

 

[SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN]

Hey Jim calls me A horses Arse. """"And it dosent bother me."""" I rate Jim Hatt on behavior- From one to ten- A Perfect 10 """You I rate Zero.""" Beth 10. Cactus 7. Gollum 10. Ellie BABA 10. Twisted 10. furness 9. Jeff 10. springfield 8. Robert 10. """ as a matter of fact no one has even come close to your low score. You are A liar, And A pretender> I "cant see" the horse or the heart or the priest can you outline it please, cause """"i cant see it"""" Mr. Roy A. DeckerEither you hate yourself and the world and people, or your really braindead, and dont belong in any position to make any judgment whatsoever! OR Maybee Your """"LEGALLY BLIND"""" kind of like a Lawyer!

 

[SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN]

Horse Meets The Priest:

 

[SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN]

Horse meets the priest on bluff spring mountain.

 

[SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN]

ESTA BEREDA ES PELIGROZA/This path is dangerous #1. Yo Pasto Yo Boy 18 Lugares/Go past I go to 18 paces #2. Al norte Busca El mapa/Search the map north. #3. Del rio busca el coazon/ Search for the heart of the river or the source. El Cobollo de santafe 33 degrees East. So When the Horse meets the Priest this is How it comes together and translates. Sincerely John V. Kemm

 

[SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN]

By the way peralta means horse. """"The Peralta Horse/Priest Stone Is now Officialy Connected To The Superstitions, At Bluff Springs "Mountain Spring":"""" By Me John V. Kemm YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWW Kudos to the Superstition Mountain Museum and Assistant to Authors. Major Kudos!!!!!!!!!!