Did anyone else see this story about the found ring being held ransom?

[Tom_in_CA]

Got this alert in my email today. A hunter finds a ring. Nothing unusual so far. Another md'r figured out it was a ring that had been reported lost to this "find-my-stuff" co-op listing. He tries to match the finder to the person who lost it, and...... here's the rest of the sad story:


Group Members -- Lost Item Report #505 was sent out last week for a wedding ring lost at Sandpiper Beach in Saylorville, Iowa. One of our members in the area contacted the guy who lost the ring to help him search for it. When they talked our member realized the ring in question had already been found by another detectorist he knows, and that this detectorist had put the ring up for sale on eBay.

When the guy who lost the ring contacted the other detectorist, he was told he could have his ring back ONLY if he paid the detectorist $300 for it -- and if didn't want to pay the fee then the detectorist was just going to melt it for the scrap gold value...

Well... without detailing my opinion of this detectorist who is knowlingly holding a guy's lost wedding ring for ransom, I wanted to say that I think what he's doing is just wrong.

Our member who had wanted to help in the first place, posted a message on the FMDF Forum this morning saying he was going to start collecting donations to attempt to come up with the $300 ransom so this guy can get his ring back. The guy who lost the ring is unemployed with a wife and young baby to support, so there's no way he'll be able to get it back otherwise. I whole-heartedly support our member's efforts and if any of you can help, that would be great!!! His FMDF post is here:

--- Need to raise some money to help a guy get his ring back - Friendly Metal Detecting Forums

Regards, John Hawken, Founder The Lost My stuff Group Lost My Stuff Group - Home Page

 

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[Tom_in_CA]

If I'm not mistaken, this md'r who found the ring, has already run afoul of lost & found laws. Every state has these laws, which have value-cutoff levels for having to turn things in to the police. In CA, for instance, it's $100 or more value. These laws were born out of "wandering cattle" laws (where a cow slips through a fence, for instance), so that a neighbor can not simply say "I found it" and keep the cow. Or when a Brinks armored car door swings open on the freeway, passerbys can not merely say "I found it", and so forth.

So this fellow, in the story, depending on his state's specific verbage ($ value cutoff) appears to have already run afoul of the laws. In addition, of course, to being totally insensitive &*$# as well.

 

[Sandman]

Also the finder of the ring can be charged with extortion by wanting a ransom amount for the return of the ring. If the owner is known you should return the ring. Demanding a "reward" is extortion too.

 

[ticm]

Yep got a email. Gee what a guy.

 

[lookindown]

One guy like that can give thousands of detectorist a bad name...hope his detector gets stolen and held for ransom.

 

[goodmore]

Being a Pirate has a few simple rules. Never show your treasure. Never sell your treasure through a public listing. I have seen guys post things on this and other forums that they have found. You want to keep your finds don't show anyone but the scrap people.

 

[finderskeepers]

Got the same email (I'm a member of the group) and felt the same disdain for the extortionist... I mean detectorist. I briefly considered donating to the cause, but quickly came to the conclusion that rewarding this person in any way, is just simply not the right thing to do.

 

[Keppy]

Like i always say i sell every thing i find.....And finders keepers.......... But if i know who the lost item belongs to...... I do return it...... But i don't go crazy trying to find the owner............... As a matter of fact i never try to find the owner......Unless it is a class ring or something that has some kind of identification marked on it............... But this person that will not return lost item when he knows who it belongs to............ IS a SLEEZE ball a real peice of work.... Not one that you would want to associate with....

 

[norbyx]

I don't understand why someone doesn't call the authorities and demand the return of the ring or just sue the guy....

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[sky355]

Yeah Im with everyone here this guy will get his. Karma is a *****. He should give the ring back and be happy to help someone out. ridiculous!!!

 

[Frankn]

Well, let me play the devils advekit. I was on a beach detecting and found a heavy gold wedding band. A guy that had been watching me said,"hay! you found my wedding band". I held it up to see the inside and said," Sure, Jest tell me the inscription on the inside." He turned around and walked away. note: There was no inscription on the inside.

 

[kdawg]

unless its a custom ring im sure there are 100's of the same rings around. (unless its ingraved). how can the guy prove that that is for sure his ring? if you found 100 dollallar bill and i claimed i lost it would you have to give it to me by law? im not taking this guys side im just wondering how this law works.

 

[norbyx]

Well I assume that if they knew that was the correct ring it had to have some inscription otherwise it would make no sense in asking for it.

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[Tom_in_CA]

reply

unless its a custom ring im sure there are 100's of the same rings around. (unless its ingraved). how can the guy prove that that is for sure his ring? if you found 100 dollallar bill and i claimed i lost it would you have to give it to me by law? im not taking this guys side im just wondering how this law works.

Kdawg, the way the law works, if you found a $100 bill (and let's assume that the "$100 or more" is your state's value threshold of lost-&-found laws), then it's not a matter of the person saying to you "that's mine, give it back" (although they could certainly try ). The law doesn't address that matter between two individuals. What it DOES say though, is you are to give the $100 to the police. They in turn have lost & found procedures, where ........ theoretically .... they will assess the validity of the person's story (eg.: where they lost it, when the lost it, describe the item, and so forth).

In fact, it's not even technically legal for us md'rs to try to re-patriate these items ourselves, to begin with! Like to think we've fulfilled the law by posting a CL "found" ad, whenever we find a nice diamond ring or whatever. The technicalities read that they are to be turned in to the police. So technically, if some police person wanted, they could troll CL "found" ads, and jump on people's cases for not turning things over certain value-levels to the police. Yet when you open CL on any given day, in any big city, you will see found ads like "found mountain bike" or "found I-phone at bus stop" or "found ring" and so forth.

Naturally the police have better things to do. But ..... one time ... I did have a cop answer my "found prescription glasses" ad that I had run on CL. They were in the dry sand, and appeared to be recently lost. So since the glasses only have value to the wearer, I figured I'd run the ad for the fun of it, rather than just pitch them in the nearest trash can. The next day, the police in that little town answered my ad, because it turned out they, in fact, had received a "lost" report for prescription glasses, on that very beach! Turns out, mine didn't match the description, so that matter was dropped. However, the police, upon hearing that I'd found these glasses with a metal detector, gave me instructions that I was to turn in anything I found to the police dept, ".... so as to be in compliance with the law". At first, I didn't know what the heck the gal was talking about. So I did some sleuthing, and realized she was talking about the state's lost & found laws. Doh!

 

[slag]

Some people say your right to the item leaves when you lose it or leave it. Now, I'm not one to follow this viewpoint, but some people do believe that.

If its identifiable and trackable, then the finder should contact the rightful owner and return it. I couldn't live with myself if I found something and it knowingly belonged to someone else that could identify it.

 

[cudamark]

Got the same email (I'm a member of the group) and felt the same disdain for the extortionist... I mean detectorist. I briefly considered donating to the cause, but quickly came to the conclusion that rewarding this person in any way, is just simply not the right thing to do.

I agree, unless it's the only way for the owner to get his ring back. I would start with finding out what the law is in that area and using that to get it back if legally possible. If the finder is in his rights, paying him may be the only option. It's easy for us to say we wouldn't pay the extortionist since the item is not ours but if you are sentimentally attached to something that has more than just monetary value, you might feel differently.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

reply

...... If the finder is in his rights, paying him may be the only option ......

No, he's not in his rights, provided the item is worth over the given value threshold in his particular state. And that's just the value to which an item must be turned over to the police. The law may read differently for lesser valued (or basically ANY object) when the ID is already positive.

I mean, go figure: If you have a $75 silver necklace, and it falls off as you're walking down the street. You suddenly realize it fell off at some point during your walk, so you re-trace your steps. As you do, you look up to see a fellow bend over, picking up your $75 necklace, and pocketing it. You holler at him: "hey fellah, that's mine, I just dropped it!" Do you REALLY think he is "in the right" to do that? Can he just keep it, and tell you "it's below such & such value threshold, so go beat sand"?

Somehow or another, it just smells like this finder is breaking some law, at some point, to refuse to turn it back to the owner, when it sounds like positive ID is not the issue here.

 

[cudamark]

No, he's not in his rights, provided the item is worth over the given value threshold in his particular state. And that's just the value to which an item must be turned over to the police. The law may read differently for lesser valued (or basically ANY object) when the ID is already positive.

I mean, go figure: If you have a $75 silver necklace, and it falls off as you're walking down the street. You suddenly realize it fell off at some point during your walk, so you re-trace your steps. As you do, you look up to see a fellow bend over, picking up your $75 necklace, and pocketing it. You holler at him: "hey fellah, that's mine, I just dropped it!" Do you REALLY think he is "in the right" to do that? Can he just keep it, and tell you "it's below such & such value threshold, so go beat sand"?

Somehow or another, it just smells like this finder is breaking some law, at some point, to refuse to turn it back to the owner, when it sounds like positive ID is not the issue here.

Possitive I.D. might BE the issue here. If it's a plain, generic, gold band with no inscription, it may not be 100% proveable as to ownership. Location, size, where lost, etc. will help in the I.D. but as you found out with your sunglasses, even that is circumstantial until you get all the facts. In your hypothetical necklace scenario, unless the necklace owner can possitively I.D. the item to a cops' satisfaction, it's a he said-he said situation and the owner might not prevail. We all hope people do the right thing on their own but it's not always that simple to make them do it or to prove that you're 100% in the right.

 

[norbyx]

Moral of this story... I keep my $10 stainless weding band and if I happend to loose it I would just go and buy another one....