Stemmed Blade...Scottsbluff-like....and Blue!

[OntarioArch]

This 3.25 inch beauty came from a collector who said he acquired it from an Ohio - Indiana regional collector: that's all I know about its provenance, FWIW.
Using several sources, I can't find another blade exactly like this one, but some stemmed Scottbluff blades come the closest to my eye. The base feels ground to me, but then again I have seen/felt better examples. In places, it looks like it has some collateral flaking, but again I have seen better examples (in books...). It think I see a median ridge of sorts; or at least the blade is thicker along the median than it is at the edges.
So I am stumped an would really like to give this gem am identity.

The blue chert must be a clue: how many places can there be with outcroppings of blue chert! Help is appreciated as always!

 

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[welsbury]

Kind of like an Alberta but not

 

[Tdog]

Sure has a lot of Alberta traits.

https://www.projectilepoints.net/Points/Alberta.html

 

[uniface]

When the pluvial lakes in the west dried up and the previously well-watered western plains became semi-arid, there was a mass migration of people eastward, bringing their cultural assemblages with them. You thus end up with Folsom points found as far eastward as Illinois, Agate Basins (with their descendants) across the east & northeast and some even stranger outliers.

Brian Williard would be able to do an inexpensive OSL exam to identify the chert as Coshocton (or not), if that's of enough interest to warrant spending $15 + return postage. Insight Laser Artifact Evaluation

FWIW

 

[Aurora1959]

"The Use of Blue-Gray Chert in Midwestern Prehistory":
https://www.jstor.org/stable/20708332?seq=1
the abstract mentions "Cobdon-Dongola" chert...yeah, I never heard of it either. Also, and not apropos of your question, here is some eye candy for the chert nuts out there:
https://www.mindat.org/gm/994. Point your cursor at the pic and info pops up

 

[ohiofinds 1]

That is a nice point.The material could be upper mercer or there is a blue flint in Indiana,maybe a variation of Holland chert.
Based on the thickness,the edgework and the basal design I would guess that is late archaic,sort of an Ohio genessee type.

 

[The Grim Reaper]

I know you said Ohio or Indiana but it sure looks a lot like this type called Adder Orchard. The material looks like Upper Mercer. I have a Thebes made from what may be the same material.

https://www.projectilepoints.net/Points/Adder Orchard.html

 

[dsmikle]

Table rock possibly?

 

[OntarioArch]

That is a nice point.The material could be upper mercer or there is a blue flint in Indiana,maybe a variation of Holland chert.
Based on the thickness,the edgework and the basal design I would guess that is late archaic,sort of an Ohio genessee type.

Yep. That's what a couple academic papers I just found surmise. Good call, ohiofinds 1 !

 

[ToddsPoint]

It's not Cobden, I've worked tons of it. Holland is light grey but also has a dark phase that is more black than blue. It looks more like Indiana or KY flint. I'd go with KY and guess that it came from the Mammoth Cave area. It does look Alberta-ish, but more likely a late archaic stemmed point. Gary

 

[OntarioArch]

I know you said Ohio or Indiana but it sure looks a lot like this type called Adder Orchard. The material looks like Upper Mercer. I have a Thebes made from what may be the same material.

https://www.projectilepoints.net/Points/Adder Orchard.html

Well, Ohio/Indiana isn't too, too far from Adder Orchard, Ontario. I think you have this one, Grim. When I see how small an area this type has been found in, I see why it was so hard for me to find a reference. I don't see it in Overstreet, for example. Guess it's a 'Canadian' type.

I just now downloaded a couple academic papers that refer to the Adder Orchard as a "narrow-bladed Broadpoint." I'm still coming up to speed on the many varieties of chert, for sure, but after a little review, I like your Upper Mercer call. I'll send my pics into ProjectilePoints.net - a much nicer example than the one he now has, and a slightly different morphology.

 

[OntarioArch]

It's not Cobden, I've worked tons of it. Holland is light grey but also has a dark phase that is more black than blue. It looks more like Indiana or KY flint. I'd go with KY and guess that it came from the Mammoth Cave area. It does look Alberta-ish, but more likely a late archaic stemmed point. Gary

Gary - I would be very interested in your experienced opinion on 'Adder Orchard' as a point type.

 

[dognose]

Interesting point.

Can you show an image of the tip area which shows the cross section of the relic better please?

 

[OntarioArch]

Interesting point.

Can you show an image of the tip area which shows the cross section of the relic better please?

I appreciate your interest and experienced eye, dognose. Here goes:

 

[Buckleberry]

That is a nice point.The material could be upper mercer or there is a blue flint in Indiana,maybe a variation of Holland chert.
Based on the thickness,the edgework and the basal design I would guess that is late archaic,sort of an Ohio genessee type.

Agreed about the material, I find almost exclusively Upper Mercer material around and in Coshocton County and I wouldn't have batted an eye at seeing that in one of my fields...Killer Point too!

 

[OntarioArch]

Here is a map of Adder Orchard distribution from ProjectilePoints.net.

 

[uniface]

FWIW : Late Woodland Madison Triangles (generic category) often go by a myriad of local names, distinguishing otherwise essentially identical (except for local lithics) examples by territory.

That map might be a parallel example -- a specific member of a general class contemporary in time.

 

[OntarioArch]

Interesting point.

Can you show an image of the tip area which shows the cross section of the relic better please?

Did my pics shed any light, dognose?

 

[dognose]

I can see the median ridge you speak of, Its a nice point.

 

[ToddsPoint]

Gary - I would be very interested in your experienced opinion on 'Adder Orchard' as a point type.

I had never heard of Adder Orchard until I read this thread. Gary