the 1733 fleet

[cornelis 816]

Can anyone tell me how many ships were part of the 1733 fleet ( the fleet of the Atocha ) .? The next question is , does anybody know how many of the ships have been found ? And the last question is , which ships have not been found ( do you have the names of these ) ? Thanks for helping me . Cornelius

 

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[Mackaydon]

Cornelius:
I don't have the faintest idea about answers to your questions, but I do want to wish you a Merry Christmas and a welcome back to TN.
All the best,
Don....

 

[cornelis 816]

Thanks Don . The answers can wait . You are the part of this net which I highly appreciate . Thank God for the old crew on this web . Cornelius

 

[old man]

Cornelius, From what I gather there were originally 17 ships in the 1733 Spanish Plate Fleet. The below link was written by Jack Haskins. I don't think you could find a better source then that. I believe the Atocha Fleet was from the 1622 .

http://www.atocha1622.com/treasurequest/the loss and salvage of the 1733 treasure fleet.htm

 

[stevemc]

Yes, the Atocha and Margarita, and a few others were 1622, wrecked from the 1500' deep waters South of the Dry Tourtugas, and up to just West of the Marquesas Keys, and the 1733 fleet was wrecked from Marathon to Key Largo. It gave Islamorda its name, translated-Island of the dead, because there were so many dead washed up there. I have all the Lat and Long #s of the 1733 wrecks. I think there are 7 ships? in the 1733 fleet that were wrecked, one did survive. Art McKee worked those wrecks pretty good. My father also did in the early 60s, I dove on them then also. They used to have a few huge timbers sticking out of the ballast pile on one that we called El Capitan, I think it was El Infante. I think 1 or 2 might still be missing, or mixed in with others. Since they wrecked in such shallow waters, the Spanish did a lot of salvage on them. They are still being worked today, but I dont think anything has been found in a while.

 

[cornelis 816]

Sorry for the misunderstanding Ed . I had two fleets in mind , one from 1733 and the other ( the Atocha ) of 1622 . But ... I got some good answers on both of them . Thank you guys . Since I am very interested in the West coast of Florida . I think that some of the ships in the 1622 fleet may have sailed past the Tortugas into this area ( of West Florida ) That is why it is important to know the names of the ships in this fleet . And ... how many of them have been discovered . Cornelius

 

[Tuberale]

According to Robert F. Marx's "Shipwrecks of the Western Hemisphere: 1492-1825", there were 21 or 22 ships wrecked in the Florida Keys from the Nueva Espana Flota which set sail from Havana, Cuba on July 13, 1733 (page 209-215).

Included were:
1) Capitana El Rubi
2) Almiranta Nuestra Senora de Balvaneda (aka El Gallo)
3) Nuestra Senora de Balvaneda (aka El Infante)
4) Nuestra Senoa del Populo (aka El Pinque)
5) San Jose de las Animas (aka San Jose y las Animas)
6) Nuestra Senora del Rosario (aka San Francisco Javier y San Antonio de Padua)
7) Nuestra Senora de Belem y San Antonio de Padua
8) Nuestra Senora del Rosario, San Antonio y San Vicente Ferrer
9) Nuestra Senora del Carmen, San Antonio de Pauda y las Animas
10) Nuetra Senora de Belem y San Juan Bautista
11) Nuestra Senora de los Dolores y Santa Isabel (aka El Nuevo Londres)
12) Nuestra Senora del Rosario y Santo Domingo
13) Nuestra Senora de los Reyes, San Fernando, y San Francisco de Paula
14) San Pedro
15) San Felipe
16) Nuestra Senora de las Angustias y San Rafael
17) El Gran Poder de Dios y Santa Ana (aka Ana Agustina)
18) San Ignacio
19) San Francisco de Asis
20) San Fernando
21) Floridana
22) unidentified schooner (balandra)

Marx also gives probably locations for each wreck.

On page 200, Marx lists nine ships probably wrecked on the Florida Keys during the 1622 hurricane:
1) Nuestra Senora de Atocha
2) La Margarita
3) Nuestra Senora del Rosario
Five other merchant naos are known, but only one has been named:
4) Jesus y Nuestra Senora del Rosario
Marx states "... and several others were probably lost on the high seas, as they were never accounted for." (p. 200) Several ships of the fleet were damaged severely by the hurricane, but were to return to Havana.

Regarding the Margarita, Marx states it was largely salvaged before becoming covered in sand. He also says much of the Rosario was recovered, including 20 cannon.

 

[Salvor6]

Very good Tuberale. I might add that there were 28 ships in the 1622 fleet. 19 made it back to Havana. Another one of the wrecks found was a merchant nao found in 1500' deep water near the Dry Tortugas by Seahawk Deep Ocean Technology. Seahawk salvaged the wreck and identified it as the Merced.

 

[cornelis 816]

I wonder how many of the ships that did not make it back to Havana were lost between the Tortugas and the Marquesas . Or simply sailed on a bit during the storm , and ended up farther north of these two points . Since the wind was coming from the South , only the last in line may have made it back to Havana . Just my idea ! Cornelius

 

[SHARK]

Marty Malach's book, "Diving to a flash of Gold" has a nautical chart glued in the back cover with 1733 shipwreck locations and coordinates. Shark

 

[dagfoto]

* "El Infante"; "Nuestra Senora de Balvaneda" a galleon owned by the King alleged to have carried 562,509 pesos in silver specie and bullion, 643 marcos in worked silver. The wreck lies on Little Conch Reef. LORAN: 14109.1 // 43266.0 Lat-Long: 24 55.59N // 80 28.23W

* "San Jose y Las Animas" an English built 326.5 ton vessel alleged to have carried 30,435 pesos in silver specie and bullion. Lies inshore of Little Conch Reef LORAN: 14108.5 // 43268.8 Lat-Long: 24 56.03N // 80 29.04W

* "La Capitana; "El Rubi" 60 cannon vessel owned by the King alleged to have been carrying 104 castellanos in worked gold, 3,200 pesos in gold specie, 5,090,285 pesos in silver specie and bullion, 6,099 marcos in worked silver. Lies between Davis and Crocker Reef. LORAN: 14103.8 // 43276.5 Lat-Long: 24 54.62N // 80 30.65W

* "Chaves"; "Angustias"; "Nuestra Senora del Carmen" a 220.9 ton merchant ship, treasure lies in very shallow water just off of Snake Creek ballast pile. Loran: 14098.5 // 43292.7 Lat-Long: 24 55.34N // 80 34.78W

* "Herrera"; "Nuestra Senora de Belemy San Antonio de Padua" English built 242.5 ton vessel alleged to be carrying 1200 pesos in silver specie and bullion, 359 marcos in worked silver. Lies near the Chaves in Hawk Channel. LORAN: 14094.7 // 43296.6 Lat-Long: 24 56.61N // 80 35.37W

* "Tres Puentes"; "Nuestra Senora de Belemey San Juan Bautista" a 212 ton vessel carrying no known treasure lies just seaward of the Herrera. LORAN: 14093.5 // 43296.5 Lat-Long: 24 52.67N // 80 35.15W

* "San Pedro" a merchant nao Dutch built 287+ tons alleged to be carrying 16,000 pesos in silver specie and bullion and Chinese porcelain. Lies off of Indian Key. LORAN: 14082.2 // 43320.8 Lat-Long: 24 51.13N // 80 40.68W

* "Herri-Lerri" Others have identified this wreck as the Arizon. Silver coins continue to wash up near the beach just oceanside of mile marker 75 face the ocean and search the shallow waters just to the left of the billboard. LORAN: 14077.1 // 43330.6 Lat-Long: 24 50.07N // 80 42.75W

* "San Francisco de Asis" an English 264+ ton vessel also referred to as "Cayo Vivoras". Lies just off Craig Key, still has huge beams in amongst the ballast pile. LORAN: 14070.4 // 43342.8 Lat-Long: 24 48.59N // 80 45.35W

* "La Almiranta"; "El Gallo" owned by the King a 60 cannon vessel alleged to be carrying 196 castellanos in worked gold, 3.200 pesos in gold specie, 4,895,216 pesos in silver specie and bullion, 2,579 marcos of "plata pasta" lies in shallow water between Lower matecumbe and Long Key. LORAN: 14068.5 // 43345.4 Lat-Long: 24 48.10N // 80 45.87W

* "El Sueco de Arizon"; "Nuestra Senora del Rosario"; "San Antonio y San Vicente Ferrer" The owner and captain was alleged to have carried 24,000 pesos in silver specie and bullion. LORAN: 14053.2 // 43379.1 Lat-Long: 24 46.38N // 80 53.52W

* "San Fernando"; "Nuestra Senora de los Reyes"; "San Francisco de Panla"a 328 ton vessel alleged to be carrying 16,000 pesos in silver specie and bullion, 226 marcos worked silver has not been located but is believed to be near Duck Key or Grassy Key at Cayo de Viboras out near Coffins Patch.

* "Sumey de San Ignacio"; "San Ignacio" English built 292+ ton vessel alleged to be carrying 12,000 pesos in silver specie and bullion, 696 marcos of worked silver in six boxes located near Cayo de Vacas near Coffins Patch. LORAN: 14038.5 // 43399.2



http://sunkentreasure.com/1733/

 

[cornelis 816]

Quoting Martin Meylach ,, All sources concur on her wrecking . She would have a rich reward for the fiders , and is worth the effort to locate ,, . Meylach is speaking here about the ,, Almiranta ,, of the 1733 fleet . I agree with the fact that the Capitana was salvaged ( only part of her ! ) . Does anybody have some information , that I don't know, about the ,, Almiranta ,, . Thanks for thinking with me . Cornelius

 

[stevemc]

I have seen salvage boats in the past working on this wreck, but none for years. I dont know if it has been completely salvaged, I would doubt its all picked up.

 

[Trembull]

Quoting Martin Meylach ,, All sources concur on her wrecking . She would have a rich reward for the fiders , and is worth the effort to locate ,, . Meylach is speaking here about the ,, Almiranta ,, of the 1733 fleet . I agree with the fact that the Capitana was salvaged ( only part of her ! ) . Does anybody have some information , that I don't know, about the ,, Almiranta ,, . Thanks for thinking with me . Cornelius

Cornelius

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php?topic=71351.0

http://www.flheritage.com/archaeology/underwater/galleontrail/shipwreckpages/03_almiranta.cfm

http://www.n-the-florida-keys.com/Almiranta.html

 

[mad4wrecks]

The last person I know to have had an active salvage lease on any 1733 fleet shipwreck was Dr. Ron Molinari. He is retired from treasure hunting now, in part for health reasons, but also because of the restrictions placed on him by the government while excavating the San Jose.

He wrote a wonderful book called "Following the Lure of the Galleon Treasures" and it is available (as are artifacts) from his website, www.reefratsalvage.com

Tom

 

[Salvor6]

Tom, he can sell you his book and pull your tooth at the same time!

 

[Iteach]

Hi Steve, recognize you from Spearboard. Read a lot of your Marquesas and such thread posts. I'll be in that vicinity next week with Steve Moore. I'm new to this treasure thing, but, might you please consider sharing the cords you have for the deep wrecks from that fleet. I'm curious about diving some in the 100-150' range with Steve, spearfishing of course also. Wish us luck for good weather and vis. Thanks for any shared info. As for using metal detectors in the FNMS boundaries, out in the water.... any experience. Thanks, Brian Garlick, ITEACHTECHED over on Spearboard. Newbie over there too, but really anxious to learn more about both passions, hunting deeper than most for big fish and treasure.