an example of night hunting to keep the peace

[Tom_in_CA]

In the discussion of potential gripers (park workers, or whatever), I have often suggested to pick lower traffic times. Or even at night, to avoid singular gripers. Which, of course, elicits images of "sneaking around" ,"breaking the law", "having something to hide" & "looking over your shoulders", etc....

I thought of an example which to me illustrates the legitimacy of sometimes having to employ the need to be more discreet. And not " swat hornet's nests" :

There is a spot in CA, that is an off-limits historical sensitive monument. But some property adjacent to it is private property farm/ag land. And the influence of potential targets extends over into that adjacent land. We got very casual permission. Ie.: nothing more than bumping into the farmer while happen-chancing onto him while he was driving past this portion of his 100's of acres one day. Just a casual "whatever" type nod. Nothing written. No names exchanged. Not clarified if for a single day or on-going, etc...

Not being ones to argue with a "yes", we proceeded to hunt it several times. We were getting buttons and coins. HOWEVER: About the 3rd or 4th time there, a caretaker/administrator of the adjacent historic off-limits spot next door spotted us. She started her rant of "you can't be doing that." To which we replied "We have permission". She then challenged that. Asking who gave us permission, etc... She marched back into her offices saying "we'll see about that" .

It was clear to us that she was probably calling her neighbor ranch offices, to see if we were telling the truth. Which gave us the willies. Because we knew that if push came to shove, then OF COURSE the rancher would align with his long time neighbor . And not two yahoo strangers from some far away city.

She came back out a few minutes later and started harping that we could not cross the dirt road that divides the 2 properties. To which, we assured her: We were well aware of the dividing line. Then ... she just stood there watching us for the longest time. We ended that hunt quickly. And put the word out to the other friend of ours that someone next door was raising a ruckus.

A month or so went by, before we made the drive for the next trek here. But THIS particular time, was becoming the time of year when it's getting dark early. So quite coincidentally, just by virtue of our work schedules (not off work till 5pm) it turns out we weren't arriving till it was after dark. Which, of course, doesn't affect the ability to detect.

And naturally, guess what ? No lady to come out and bark at us. No risk of our permission being revoked . And ... to this day, 10 yrs. later, we just make that a practice for this spot. We only ever hunt this at night.

So to me, THIS is an example of how being un-seen solves things. And is an example of how you're not necessarily breaking a law in the process. But just to face the reality that "not everyone on earth is going to love metal detecting".

We *could* have gone to the farmer to cement and clarify our "permission". And we *could* have gone and defied the lady and told her "neener neener". But as you can see, odds are, the decision would have come down AGAINST our favor, rather than in our favor.

So too is it the same mentality in all the posts about guys who catch flack in parks. They get a verbal "scram", even though perhaps there is no express and explicit "no detecting" rule/law. So they run around like a chicken with their head cut off trying to split hairs on verbiage about "alter/deface" or "take/remove", attempting to over-turn a scram. And I have suggested "avoid that singular lookie-lou" . And this post is an example of that practice working just as it should . So peaceful. So serene

 

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[angelito1]

Well stated...........

 

[flinthunter]

Almost all public parks in my area have a "park closed" time. No one is allowed in and you are subject to arrest for being there after closing time.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... you are subject to arrest for being there after closing time.

flinthunter: Do you have any examples of someone being arrested for being in an innocuous normal park, that had a "park closed at sunset" type sign ?

I live right across the street from a park with an obligatory sign like that. And the ONLY time it's ever been enforced , is when some teens thought they were going to have a keg party down there at midnight. And it took someone who's yard borders the park (who was woken up) to call it in. To even get a cop down there in 1/2 hr. later to shine the spotlight and say "scram" to the kids. But other than that, persons walk their dog , or cut through (as it connects 2 different sides of our neighborhood), etc....

I'm not saying to "throw caution to the wind". But just saying that sometimes those signs are so that no one thinks they are going to camp out there, throw a keg party, etc..... If you have a park where that is religiously enforced (and you have arrest incidents to cite), then sure: By all means, don't step off the sidewalk. But otherwise, don't overthink it.

 

[Goldfinger450]

ALL of you are forgetting that WE the People "LET Government Perform Duties" On OUR Behalf, I am an anti Gov. Patriotic Veteran and these kind of issues really wind me up, I would tell anyone, in a Park to leave me alone as I am Locating, enough said. I'm the guy that would detect most of the homes yards around the park. People need an azz kicking sometimes and it is great when you do it verbally and In the Right.

 

[Xraywolf]

I've been accused of being sneaky hunting at night - To which I reply, if I was being sneaky, I would not be walking around with a 300 lum light beam radiating from my head.

 

[masterjedi]

Tom I agree with you...
You can tell by your videos that you are hunting next to a highway/freeway.... Good for you... Thats where all of the gold coins came from? Big smile

 

[flinthunter]

It's very simple. When you break the law with a metal detector, you give all of us with a metal detector a bad name and an excuse to ban all of us from public places. It's these types of actions that give all of us in this hobby a bad name.

flinthunter: Do you have any examples of someone being arrested for being in an innocuous normal park, that had a "park closed at sunset" type sign ?

I live right across the street from a park with an obligatory sign like that. And the ONLY time it's ever been enforced , is when some teens thought they were going to have a keg party down there at midnight. And it took someone who's yard borders the park (who was woken up) to call it in. To even get a cop down there in 1/2 hr. later to shine the spotlight and say "scram" to the kids. But other than that, persons walk their dog , or cut through (as it connects 2 different sides of our neighborhood), etc....

I'm not saying to "throw caution to the wind". But just saying that sometimes those signs are so that no one thinks they are going to camp out there, throw a keg party, etc..... If you have a park where that is religiously enforced (and you have arrest incidents to cite), then sure: By all means, don't step off the sidewalk. But otherwise, don't overthink it.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Hello flint-hunter. If a "park closes at sunset " sign is something beyond obligatory boiler plate. Ie.: if it's not there to be actually implemented in cases of late night keg parties or overnight campers. Or if you're in a locale which, for some reason, that is a priority to-which LEO's prowl for. And the md'r is using headlights to make a beacon of himself. Then yes. All that you're saying is true.

I'm not speaking of those types of situations, where, yes, it's a true issue. If it is so, where you're at, then by all means , don't hunt at night. But where I'm at, that's just not the case. A late-night couple on a stroll, or someone walking their dog, etc.....

 

[Honest Samuel]

In all of our lives, while detecting, we have to deal with people with mental problems. Be careful.

 

[George (MN)]

It's very simple. When you break the law with a metal detector, you give all of us with a metal detector a bad name and an excuse to ban all of us from public places. It's these types of actions that give all of us in this hobby a bad name.

Is it worse if someone is metal detecting after 10 pm in a park vs. fighting, drunkenness, or using illegal drugs? But if a lone detectorist is the only person to bother, they talk to them. The police choices are you can continue detecting, a scram, or a fine. This will vary by city and individuals in a police dep't in the same city.

A police officer can ban an entire group of people from a park for 1 year, and if any of them come back within a year, they can be charged with illegal trespass on "public" property. It doesn't matter if you were the source of trouble, it's guilt by association, even if you're barely acquainted with the person that caused a problem. You can be fined for sitting near a person or talking to a person that the police don't want in the park. Metal detectorists aren't the only ones banned as potential trouble.

Around here parks close at 10pm. It gets dark about 9:20 pm late June and about 4:30 pm late December. So, late June being in the park 1 hour after dark is illegal, but late December, legal to be in the park 5 hours after sunset. But anyone can get a scram, regardless of what they are doing, like quietly sitting still by oneself. Police may wonder if homeless or drug dealing. The anti "marijuana" patrol is increased at sunset, then after 2am bar closing anyone will be questioned even if just walking for exercise on a residential street. Best wishes, all.

 

[Honest Samuel]

Searching at night may not be safe, be careful.

 

[George (MN)]

I should add that the noise ordinance around here is 10pm-6:30am, meaning people shouldn't talk loud, play boomboxes outdoors or loud radios in cars. The parks around here do allow drinking, but groups of drinkers can get noisy, so they must be sent away as quiet time begins. In the case of metal detectorists, we can do what we do quietly, so might be allowed after closing. Closing time is mainly to break up groups (groups=noise).

We use headphones, quiet pinpointers & lights that aren't bright enough to shine in peoples homes. We may be in the shadows, but school buildings and park buildings have lights and there are streetlights. I'm in a low-crime area, so the police likely know I'll be safe. Maybe in high crime areas the boot at park closing is more certain. In a neighboring suburb, Park Service Officers just drive through minutes after closing as a reminder. Best wishes, all.

 

[cudamark]

That's the same way with some of our local beaches. Some have a curfew, but, they're not generally enforced for detectorists. They mainly want to get the big parties and rowdies off the beach so neighbors don't have to put up with noise. Of course, now we have the problem with bums camping out on the beaches at night. Personally, I'd rather see the parties!