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Trapper John

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Dec 29, 2014
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I’ve been considering telling this story for a while and finally concluded that this is probably the most appropriate thread on which to do so, so here it goes.

First, a little background. I formerly lived in Klamath Falls, Oregon. Our home overlooked the southern end of Klamath Lake, where it is well documented that Native Americans had a very large village prior to and at the time of White arrival. Behind our house and up a steep hill were 14 acres of plum thickets and sage brush. Twice each day, every day, for over 15 years I walked up the hill and wandered around that terrain, training and exercising my Labrador retrievers. I eventually began to notice small pieces of agate and obsidian on the ground, especially after a good rain, and quite naturally began to pick them up and inspect them. Even to my untrained eye it was obvious that some were shards from ancient tool-making efforts.

The story might have ended simply at this point - gun dog trainer finds shiny rocks. But along the way my kids grew up and I became a grandfather. My eldest grandson was about six as I recall, when someone gave him a plastic replica of an arrowhead. He was very fond of it, and when the inevitable happened and the tip broke off he was crushed. I took note of his disappointment even as I continued to walk and work the dogs.

What I am about to describe is the whole unadulterated truth. I mentioned that I worked the dogs twice daily, regardless of time of year. And so one rainy afternoon in mid-November of 2003 I grabbed my whistle and training dummies and headed up the hill with Boomer and Molly, my Labs. At the top of the hill our path broke to the left; after so many years of use the path itself was beaten into the ground and visible in satellite imagery.

On this day, however, everything changed. As we reached the top of the hill, I distinctly heard these words in my head:

“If you walk to the right you will find an arrowhead.”

The voice was my own. No ghosty whispers, no eerie sounds - just my own voice. I broke off the path and headed to the right. I moved slowly, eyes down and searching. It didn’t take long, and maybe twenty feet from my turn-off point I saw something at the base of a sage bush, glistening in the rain. I thought it was a wet leaf, but bent to pick it up anyway.

It was a perfectly formed arrowhead, formed from a brown material which I took to be a form of chalcedony, either carnelian or sard. Subsequent analysis determined authenticity and suggested that it was Paleolithic, probably around 10,000 years old. Thus it may have been crafted at the time that Oregon’s Mount Mazama imploded creating Crater Lake.

The point was given to my grandson in a velvet bag. It is his to hold as the present custodian of an artifact and a subject of great mystery. I hope the arrowhead and its story will become a family legacy and legend. I cannot explain the story as anything more than a spiritual experience, one of those moments when we somehow manage to straddle two worlds, one of our day-to-day existence and another inexplicable.

Let me conclude by saying this was no Kevin Costner/"Field of Deams" yarn. I swear by all that I hold dear to me that every word of this story is true.
 

Last edited:
Nov 8, 2004
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I believe you John, a fine example of dowsing. you wanted an arrow point so you went into the dowsing mind and followed your receptions./ impressions, I have a friend who does that with paper objects, no rod etc. is needed

Now follow that ability up and find me a Gold bar, mint run not a dore' bar.
 

coazon de oro

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May 7, 2010
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Howdy Trapper John,

Great story, I understand only that these things happen, but don't really understand the why. Some are called coincidence, but there seems to be more to this. Others call it the universal laws of attraction, when one wants something so bad, it seems to materialize in one way or another. There is a book, and a movie called The Secret that is based of this universal law.

I too am reluctant sometimes to post things, but yes, this would be the place to do it. Coincidences seem to occur often for me, just a few posts back you will find that Crossie brought up the bucking bull Bushwacher the day after I had purchased a koozie of the famous bull at the PBR in Laredo. Your story also comes a day after and arrowhead find.

Just yesterday, I saddled the mini pony that my granddaughter got for her fourth year birthday back in October. I usually lead her up, and down the entrance road of the ranch. This time I decided to take her down a fence line road to a small brushy hill where we have a deer stand. This hill is covered with sandstone, and I have found at least four points on it before.

Where are we going grandpa?
We are gona look for arrowheads.
Arrowheads?
Yes arrowheads.

This is just part of the conversations, she talks all the way as I lead her back, and forth. I would kick a few flakes, asking her if she thought it might be an arrowhead. I had not found any in about ten years, but the recent rains gave me hope. The fact that I wanted to find one for her was probably what made me take a rabbit trail straight to probably the only arrowhead left in that hill.

What's that? Do you think it may be an arrowhead, or just another rock?
It looks like a Christmas tree grandpa, it is an arrowhead!

Lord knows I don't make up the stories, but could there be something to coincidence, and to the laws of attraction?:dontknow:

Homar
 

Rebel - KGC

Gold Member
Jun 15, 2007
21,680
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Howdy Trapper John,

Great story, I understand only that these things happen, but don't really understand the why. Some are called coincidence, but there seems to be more to this. Others call it the universal laws of attraction, when one wants something so bad, it seems to materialize in one way or another. There is a book, and a movie called The Secret that is based of this universal law.

I too am reluctant sometimes to post things, but yes, this would be the place to do it. Coincidences seem to occur often for me, just a few posts back you will find that Crossie brought up the bucking bull Bushwacher the day after I had purchased a koozie of the famous bull at the PBR in Laredo. Your story also comes a day after and arrowhead find.

Just yesterday, I saddled the mini pony that my granddaughter got for her fourth year birthday back in October. I usually lead her up, and down the entrance road of the ranch. This time I decided to take her down a fence line road to a small brushy hill where we have a deer stand. This hill is covered with sandstone, and I have found at least four points on it before.

Where are we going grandpa?
We are gona look for arrowheads.
Arrowheads?
Yes arrowheads.

This is just part of the conversations, she talks all the way as I lead her back, and forth. I would kick a few flakes, asking her if she thought it might be an arrowhead. I had not found any in about ten years, but the recent rains gave me hope. The fact that I wanted to find one for her was probably what made me take a rabbit trail straight to probably the only arrowhead left in that hill.

What's that? Do you think it may be an arrowhead, or just another rock?
It looks like a Christmas tree grandpa, it is an arrowhead!

Lord knows I don't make up the stories, but could there be something to coincidence, and to the laws of attraction?:dontknow:

Homar

YEP!
 

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Crosse De Sign

Crosse De Sign

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Thanks Tex,

They're doin' good having lots of fun, good to see them enjoying. :love9: :thumbsup:
Rebel, they would prob say the Beatles' "Birthday" song is too old fashioned. :dontknow:
That's not what we said about our parents music, was it :icon_scratch: ???
I'll give it a try though... :laughing7: :fish:
:cross:
 

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Crosse De Sign

Crosse De Sign

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crose, you posted ---> I typed out maybe about half of a long spirited treasure story,
the other night. But, then thought it may look silly, and deleted
it. What is a treasured story to me personally, may seem ridiculous,
or preposterous to others


You hit the nail on the head in my writing the book. A whole ream of paper has ended up in the waste basket. :coffee2::coffee2:

I understand about being stumped, starting over, writer's block,
etc., though haven't started on a book. Songs are shorter and
easier to me, though they usually need music, a melody line,
verses, a chorus, maybe a bridge, not too long, lots of room
for creativity.

I may work on a book sometime, of longer songs like stories.

Some of the best songwriting has been done by more than one writer,
and who knows how many sessions. Some done in a few minutes, and
others take maybe years to finish. Some maybe pulled out of the trash
can by another writer. Such as The Eagles' "Take It Easy" 8-), there is
a good story.

Glen Frey visiting Jackson Browne, both were aspiring songwriters.
When Glen saw some writing on a piece of paper, he got it out of
his can, and un-crumpled it. Jackson said he was hung up on it
and so gave up on it. Glen wrote a second and third verse, they
finished and composed it, and they both did very well with it.

Turned out to be a very successful co-written hit, that The Eagles
recorded on their debut release, and the rest is music history.

One writer can sometimes help another, though naturally,
one takes a chance, on being vulnerable, I understand that.
I have had good compliments on my written songs that I've
sung for people, even several strangers I had never seen
before. But I did it so many times, singing and playing my
songs, that I got past the nervousness, so I'm used to it.

Storytelling, likes or not, sorta' new to me. Been writing
a long time. Songs aren't that hard to me. I have a lot
of practice. Some tunes light up different people, with
different personalities. Not all like the same ones. That
has been fun experiences for me, taking a chance and
seeing the response. Though I haven't tried to get one
on the radio, other than recording sessions that I shut
down, when I sensed someone trying to manipulate me,
to steal a song he liked, and stopped working with him.

The games people play, like a stranger visiting with me,
had told me repeatedly, but that's the other long story,
I mentioned that I had typed halfway, and deleted... :fish:
:cross:
 

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Crosse De Sign

Crosse De Sign

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Trapper John,

That's a good story, I like it. May not think of
the voice the same as everyone else, as I
know we all have our opinions, and our
own interpretations. There is something
to sound, thoughts, impressions, I think.

Sometimes we may miss out on things,
good or maybe bad, by not realizing,
and not acting on our perception.

Hope you get to find some more, of
what men left long ago, some solid
rock evidence of their life's works.

Thanks for sharing your interesting
story, maybe you have some more.
Or, may you have some more... :thumbsup: :fish:
:cross:
 

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Crosse De Sign

Crosse De Sign

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Senor Don Jose,

Amigo, see how ye are, I take a couple days off, someone tells a
good spirited treasure story, an ya go right off into dowsing mind.:icon_scratch:

Glad for the finds, but yer explanation may be a good reason why Jeff-PA
calls some ideas 'hocus pocus'. :laughing7: Although ye make bold claims about
some abilities, it might could be better, if there were some evidence.
Like a pic, er nugget, some proof of finding something supposedly
dreamed up with the help of 'mind dowsing'. :laughing9:

Arrowhead dowsing, by just going into a mental dowsing mode ??? :icon_scratch:
That sounds like using one's wooden noggin fer a bony receptor,
to sense and find a chipped and shaped rock, Hmmn... 8-)

Wild sayings like that, may be what makes the reale spirited treasure tales
look even more kooky, than already perceived. I think that's still called, like
walking and looking, seeing and picking something up. Though the thought
may have been to go that way. If one has a thought and acts on it, well we
all have probly done something like that. Can anyone truly verify the source?
Maybe sometimes an action following a thought, may produce a good result.
But does it always? :icon_scratch:

Mel Fisher said "today's the day" for 20+ years? Suffered terrible losses
on the way to finally discovering 'the garden of gold'. He wouldn't give
up, and pursued his dream with extensive research, planning, state of
the art technology and equipment, highly technicly skilled labor, hard
work, experience, and persistence, then one day he did it, went from
dreamer to achiever.

There's treasure items in a museum, to still prove his accomplishments,
and that is tangible. Otherwise, when someone says this or that works
for me, or someone I know, it appears some ideas, ore claims are from
the 'twilight zone'. What have ye got in yer coffees? Maybe it's time
to change that ole sock out, and clean out the fuzzy stuff, or present
some physical evidence, other than saying, yer hokey focus thinking works... :laughing7: :laughing9:

Here's a fresh cup, no fuzzy squiglies, better lay off
the agave a bit too... :coffee2::coffee2::coffee2: :coffee: :fish:
:cross:
 

Last edited:
Nov 8, 2004
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Crosse, you posted -->but yer explanation may be a good reason why Jeff-PA
calls some ideas 'hocus pocus'.

:laughing7: with all due respects due a mod, course jeff is nuts, but then he knows that :laughing7::laughing7:

You have various senses, the so called common ones, and the supra normal ones - which are natural anyways.

How do you idetify a piece of jewelry in a case full of identical jewelry, say rings ?

I'll look for a picture of the one mule load of silver- 8 Realse - thast was found by first dowsing, then precisely by a detector. There were 8 loads, but one was my part.

Here is part of the load.


8 REALES Alamos minted. 1885.jpg
 

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releventchair

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May 9, 2012
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A friend found one arrowhead. Military in Kansas at the time. Was not looking for anything. Claimed he saw blood first then spotted the stone lithic which was white.:dontknow:
No sense in arguing with him when he told me about it as he would have maintained his position.
 

Nov 8, 2004
14,582
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Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
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GOOD MORNING SWR:

After the fiasco in said leads, I am surprised to see you still posting against the possibility of a luminous gas being produced.

I was especially amused by your reference to the posts in -->

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...c,62201.0.html

Especially on posts #"5" - 11 - 14 - "18" - 39 - etc..


Quote SWR: "I choose not to believe Jose's story about an Indian who had been seeing some lights over the years, that some mule-train buried (reason not given) bunches of silver coins in the 1800s. I do not see one old torn-up photograph as being proof. You may, I don't."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Tayopa -- I agree , that is your privilege and right, but to yourself, inferring that I am lying etc publically is neither professional nor acceptable.

Since you have refused to accept my challenge, I can only assume that your are reacting as Pavlov's dogs did and not from applied intelligent thought, but then, what is new?
Tayopa==
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


SWR--- So...does this mean you are going to present some reliable (solid) proof that buried treasures (gold/silver/diamonds) give off toxic/visible gases, produce various colored flames and/or lights that are hovering over the treasures?

Furthermore, if your challenge consists of me going to Mexico to search for those elusive lights, forget-about-it. If it were true, you or others would have already pictures of these mythical events to submit as proof.

PS - debate the issue and not the poster, eh?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Tayopa --If you haven't enough interest to see for yourself why should I bother? Such as calling me a "LIAR" on my statement that I had found this treasure with a fire and posting a picture??
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


This will do for starters, yes "luminous" gases ? from buried metals DO exist, but finding the source is extremely difficult. as mentioned above.

Don Jose de La Mancha

p.s. Definitely read all of the leads that SWR etc. posted.

"I exist to live, not live to exist"
Edit Post Reply Reply With Quote
 

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Crosse De Sign

Crosse De Sign

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I’ve been considering telling this story for a while and finally concluded that this is probably the most appropriate thread on which to do so, so here it goes.

First, a little background. I formerly lived in Klamath Falls, Oregon. Our home overlooked the southern end of Klamath Lake, where it is well documented that Native Americans had a very large village prior to and at the time of White arrival. Behind our house and up a steep hill were 14 acres of plum thickets and sage brush. Twice each day, every day, for over 15 years I walked up the hill and wandered around that terrain, training and exercising my Labrador retrievers. I eventually began to notice small pieces of agate and obsidian on the ground, especially after a good rain, and quite naturally began to pick them up and inspect them. Even to my untrained eye it was obvious that some were shards from ancient tool-making efforts.

The story might have ended simply at this point - gun dog trainer finds shiny rocks. But along the way my kids grew up and I became a grandfather. My eldest grandson was about six as I recall, when someone gave him a plastic replica of an arrowhead. He was very fond of it, and when the inevitable happened and the tip broke off he was crushed. I took note of his disappointment even as I continued to walk and work the dogs.

What I am about to describe is the whole unadulterated truth. I mentioned that I worked the dogs twice daily, regardless of time of year. And so one rainy afternoon in mid-November of 2003 I grabbed my whistle and training dummies and headed up the hill with Boomer and Molly, my Labs. At the top of the hill our path broke to the left; after so many years of use the path itself was beaten into the ground and visible in satellite imagery.

On this day, however, everything changed. As we reached the top of the hill, I distinctly heard these words in my head:

“If you walk to the right you will find an arrowhead.”

The voice was my own. No ghosty whispers, no eerie sounds - just my own voice. I broke off the path and headed to the right. I moved slowly, eyes down and searching. It didn’t take long, and maybe twenty feet from my turn-off point I saw something at the base of a sage bush, glistening in the rain. I thought it was a wet leaf, but bent to pick it up anyway.

It was a perfectly formed arrowhead, formed from a brown material which I took to be a form of chalcedony, either carnelian or sard. Subsequent analysis determined authenticity and suggested that it was Paleolithic, probably around 10,000 years old. Thus it may have been crafted at the time that Oregon’s Mount Mazama imploded creating Crater Lake.

The point was given to my grandson in a velvet bag. It is his to hold as the present custodian of an artifact and a subject of great mystery. I hope the arrowhead and its story will become a family legacy and legend. I cannot explain the story as anything more than a spiritual experience, one of those moments when we somehow manage to straddle two worlds, one of our day-to-day existence and another inexplicable.

Let me conclude by saying this was no Kevin Costner/"Field of Deams" yarn. I swear by all that I hold dear to me that every word of this story is true.

Senor Don Jose, Amigo ~ Coffee? ~ :coffee2::coffee2::coffee2:

OK, let's take a close look at what has been said here,
to see IF there can be a positive ID, or interpretation,
of this so called mental phenomenon, you referred to
as 'the dowsing mind'.

Trapper John wrote:

"As we reached the top of the hill, I distinctly heard
these words in my head:

"If you walk to the right you will find an arrowhead".

The voice was my own. No ghosty whispers - no eery sounds, just my own voice"...

OK, This seems believable, for a lot of people seem to sense,
or supposedly "HEAR", a thought, or voice within their head.

Trapper John said in this experience, that he heard his own
voice speaking to himself, to turn and walk in that direction,
and look. So he did, and found the Paleolithic arrowhead.

I believe my experiences have also been a thought that got my
attention. I have only thought of my own voice talking to me, as
my own voice of consciousness, when I have thoughts and considerations,
or I am thinking of how I said something, but not my own voice suddenly,
and unexpectedly, telling me to do something like what he related.

When I have considered sudden thoughts or suggestions that I have acted on,
and connect the good or bad things that have happened. I try to realize the
difference, and possible source, of a sudden thought coming to me, from
outside of my own current thoughts, like being spoken, or beamed in.

When I have talked to myself it is audible, and I hear it with my ears,
and feel the sound waves. This to me, is different than the thoughts or
impressions I may get, sometimes unexpectedly by thinking, maybe
meditating on an idea, that can bring about an unexpected thought,
for me. That is really the only kind of voice I hear, not audible.

This perhaps from within my own mind, from my own spirit,
or associated with my brain activity, and my central nervous
system. Or, an unseen, unheard, impulse from another
dimension, naturally unseen to the human eye.

Though I do believe in the spirit world, and in the unseen,
oftentimes unnoticed, influences and activities, I can not say I
know exactly how it works. Though I have my beliefs, that doesn't
mean I can prove it, other than by how people act, by responding to a
good or bad spirits objectives. I think that is the only physical evidence.

The good or bad things that people do. Also, the difference in confusion
or chaos, rationale and peace. This is mine, and many other peoples
beliefs, or realizations, based on experiences, that there are unseen
spirits that are actively at work, continually, to provoke humans to
some sort of actions.

They seem to do different things. There are people everyday, that
do appear to be affected by a spirit, or spirits influence. Whether it's
because of good or bad thoughts, that they physically act on, and do.
It also seems that spirits are influencing, maybe guiding, leading to,
or distracting people away from various earthly treasures. That is, of
precious and valuable things, treasures to men, and also extremely
valuable things to unseen spirits, that would be their particular
treasures, including, the power and influence over men's
treasures, and their actions... :fish:
:cross:
 

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Crosse De Sign

Crosse De Sign

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Crosse, you posted -->but yer explanation may be a good reason why Jeff-PA
calls some ideas 'hocus pocus'.

:laughing7: with all due respects due a mod, course jeff is nuts, but then he knows that :laughing7::laughing7:

You have various senses, the so called common ones, and the supra normal ones - which are natural anyways.

How do you idetify a piece of jewelry in a case full of identical jewelry, say rings ?

I'll look for a picture of the one mule load of silver- 8 Realse - thast was found by first dowsing, then precisely by a detector. There were 8 loads, but one was my part.

Here is part of the load.


View attachment 1108710

Don Jose

Another cup? :coffee2::coffee2::coffee2:

OK, you found 8 loads of silver, "found by first dowsing, then precisely
by a detector".

What exactly did you do. What did you use, in performing your dowsing?

Don't doubt that you found the silver, or that you, or the Indian
saw a fire or light. I would take yer word on that, and there
seems to have been other peoples varying accounts, of
seeing a glow, fire, or lights. Some, sources of gas,
that seem are explainable.

Just curious, how deep was the silver?

You wrote to Trapper John, " I have a friend who
does that with paper objects, no rod is needed".

What does this mean, dowsing paper objects?

You also wrote: "You have various senses, the so called common ones,
and the supra normal ones - which are natural anyways".

Everyone is aware of "the so called normal ones".
The supra normal ones, can you explain? Does this
mean you have supra normal senses to find treasure,
by having a special dowsing mind sense?

I re-read the gas/lights posts. If the 'luminous gas', or 'fire' is visible,
what does it have to do with going into 'the dowsing mind' to find a rock,
or paper, or metals?

Last, you wrote: "How do you identify a piece of jewelry,
in a case of identical jewelry, say rings".

Hmmn, sounds like a magic trick ??? ... :fish:
:cross:
 

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texasred777

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This brings to mind a post I made some time back on another forum. When my dad was in his 20s, so in the 1920s, as he was born in 1900, there was a cemetery where people had seen a light at times above a grave. Dad said that he had seen it also. I don't remember if the cemetery was in Alvarado or Hillsboro, Texas; possibly elsewhere in central Texas. If my memory serves me correctly, the light was either purple or blue. As one approached the light, it disappeared. So no one really knew what to think about in the 1920s. It was learned in later years, sometime in the 1930s, that there was a woman buried in a grave in that area where the light could be seen. She had piece of silver for a 'plate' in her body, possibly her shoulder. It was said the silver caused the light to shine above the grave during certain times. I'm not sure if it was atmospheric, time of the year, or what caused it to shine some of the time, but not others. As a young man, I thought several times about asking my dad again about the phenomenon, but never thought about it when I was in his presence. I would have considered it a real honor and thrill to have seen that!
 

releventchair

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Crosse: Have you tried dowsing? Do you believe it is tied to the occult?
Pages could be written debating it. Watching it done would be one page.
A study of people that survive lightning strikes can be compared.We are mostly water,conductive also. Leaders can emerge from the ground and then be joined with energy from above. The track energy follows and why it takes a particular path and why the very spot it strikes all have a reason. Too bad we don't harness that energy to power our grid. A big o capacitor maybe....
My "phantom" pain of a burning toe where no leg exists is a short study yet it remains.Study has filmed an electrical aura showing missing limbs in some but not in others.
A Kirlian type technique.
Sixth sense, peripheral vision. Subliminal input of a couple frames of film that the brain sees but the eyes that had to see but do not register can be compared to our rest cycle and the brain sorting out what we did see but did not recognize at the time. Problems can be resolved over a couple nights rests. Things seen that did not register at the time can be recognized. Nothing evil about it. Fishing for evil however could cause havoc in a normal pattern for sure.
Dowsing is neither way spiritually. Consider we don't see parties of good or evil out practicing it.
Those voices can be logic or reason too. Where would I look for a particular object can have complicated logic behind it. Even stored peripheral input we don't recall seeing.
Fault may occur looking for something we misplaced only to find it in last place looked but why do we look where we do? Could be talking to ourselves but we still look in the wrong place. Where is the voice when standing in a room wondering why we entered it? Yet what is happening when a detector faults?
 

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Crosse De Sign

Crosse De Sign

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I have 3/16" welding rods (now), with all of the flux, or coating,
all cleaned off, and bent @ 4.75" x 9.00" that work well for me.

Don't doubt the glow or lights, explained scientifically, or not.

I am the son of an old well digger's grandson. Though I was
not ever trained, nor ever tried it then, I dig see grandpa walking
with his stick, but never saw him locate metal, or dig a well. I was
told he was taught by his father, and could do it. But he migrated
young from his home in MISS. to pursue sawmill and logging work,
and he did mostly something pertaining to those jobs most of his
working days, except for working in a bomb plant during the war.

He was a worn out old man when I met him, so I just wasn't
around him, in his earlier days. My father never did it in front of
me, so I don't know about him. He liked to build hot street motors
drive cars across country, and trucks OTR, though did do some of
it in the oilfield, after his service in the US Army.

Never considered it to be anything, but maybe certain peoples
body electricity, reacting with the metal, etc. Never have tried
to find water, don't doubt it though. They say Great Grandpa
was good at it, supposedly Grandpa too. Works for me, on
metal above ground anyway, from a fairly good distance... :fish:
:cross:
 

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Trapper John

Jr. Member
Dec 29, 2014
85
136
St Helens, Oregon
Detector(s) used
Garrett AT Pro
Primary Interest:
Metal Detecting
What I am enjoying about this thread is that folks are for the most part listening without judging. Sure, arguments over explanations and interpretations are inevitable, as are differences over beliefs or lack thereof. The real point is that we all share the drive to search for things, to share information and ideas, and to test our own techniques and findings against the light of other experiences and perspectives. That makes me feel good.
 

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