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Thread: an update on the mine El Naranjal

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  1. #1

    Apr 2008
    103
    262 times

    an update on the mine El Naranjal

    The state of Durango is one of the most mineralized areas in the country of Mexico. It is also one of the most difficult to reach many of the earliest mines as access to those worked prior to the 1900’s was by mule trail and the ore was packed out by mule train. Infrastructure is still undeveloped in many places and never will be as there doesn’t exist any logical reason to build roads through this mountainous /canyon country, so many of these mines are lost due to their lack of accessibility as lost in memory. Such is the case of the mine known popularly as Él Naranjal’. And as legend tells us it is almost impossible to reach. Well, if you know where to research and are able to read Spanish the true story about El Naranjal is readily attainable, and if you have a good mule and local guide, and a good “pomada” anyone can go directly to it. The following is a very condensed and loose translation from local historical archives on record in the municipality where El Naranjal is located. ///// A indigenous (native) brought a single stone to show to the local mission priest, the priests name was Fr. Jose Ignacio Garibay. After examining the stone is was identified as containing gold. The priest formed a group and registered the mine under the name “La Garibaya”. The local Indians were enslaved, the actual translation from the historical records state that the Indians rendered their services free of charge. And they worked under the “Faena “system. I know the modern definition for ‘Faena “but not this particular definition. At any rate the mine was incredibly rich, all production was done with hand tools and slave labor. It goes on to say that from the taxes paid from the mines production the Zambrano Palace was built. This is the governor’s palace in downtown Durango, Dgo, a very impressive building to say the least. You can google it and check out the images. It is not known how long the mine was worked as many of the records were lost in a fire in 1810 when the community was attacked by Spanish troops. A short time later the Indians rebelled and in the attack Father Garibay was killed by an arrow in what was known as the Los Tepalcates incident. After this the mining activity was reduced to locals working in primitive fashion until little by little the area mines were left idle. There were ten mines in all being worked in the area. The very last paragraph of this archive states that the mine officially as El Garibay was known locally as El Naranjal from the beginning and after the death of the original owner took over as the recognized name. ////// I am 100% convinced that the Garibay mine is the El Naranjal mine known in the treasure writings. I have researched this not only through this historical document but also by backtracking the tax records both which indicate that the Garibay and the El Naranjal mine are one and the same. The area was initially chosen by the Spanish for settlement for its climate and abundance of native fruits growing in the area as well as facility of growing criolla fruits. Hence the local name for the mine El Naranjal.//// I would think the dumps for this mine could be very high grade although no one apparently has evaluated them or a good dump for metal detecting.

  2. #2
    us
    Sep 2013
    Michigan
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    Thank you for that Lilorphanannie......Very interesting!! More please!
    Thank you in advance.

    All the best-
    JA
    All the best-

    J.A.A.


    "May the best of your yesterdays,
    be the worst of our tomorrows."

  3. #3

    Aug 2013
    465
    1394 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Hello Lilorphanannie I second that.

    Amy

  4. #4
    us
    El Dorado: Gold is where you find it.

    Apr 2015
    Valley Center, CA/Yuma, AZ
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corporate Investigations View Post
    Hello Lilorphanannie I second that.

    Amy
    Make that 3. And, welcome back, Amy.

    JB

  5. #5
    mx
    Nov 2004
    Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
    14,603
    11793 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Hi my friend Orphan Annie: You know that Durango at that time encompassed Chihuahua, and other present day states etc. 'the interdependencie of Durango.. Later in 1823 it was reduced to the present state of Durango.etc. This has confused many searchers.
    Oroblanco, J.A.A. and Simon1 like this.
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  6. #6
    um
    Nemo me impune lacesset

    Jan 2005
    DAKOTA TERRITORY
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    Quote Originally Posted by lilorphanannie View Post
    The state of Durango is one of the most mineralized areas in the country of Mexico. It is also one of the most difficult to reach many of the earliest mines as access to those worked prior to the 1900’s was by mule trail and the ore was packed out by mule train. Infrastructure is still undeveloped in many places and never will be as there doesn’t exist any logical reason to build roads through this mountainous /canyon country, so many of these mines are lost due to their lack of accessibility as lost in memory. Such is the case of the mine known popularly as Él Naranjal’. And as legend tells us it is almost impossible to reach. Well, if you know where to research and are able to read Spanish the true story about El Naranjal is readily attainable, and if you have a good mule and local guide, and a good “pomada” anyone can go directly to it. The following is a very condensed and loose translation from local historical archives on record in the municipality where El Naranjal is located. ///// A indigenous (native) brought a single stone to show to the local mission priest, the priests name was Fr. Jose Ignacio Garibay. After examining the stone is was identified as containing gold. The priest formed a group and registered the mine under the name “La Garibaya”. The local Indians were enslaved, the actual translation from the historical records state that the Indians rendered their services free of charge. And they worked under the “Faena “system. I know the modern definition for ‘Faena “but not this particular definition. At any rate the mine was incredibly rich, all production was done with hand tools and slave labor. It goes on to say that from the taxes paid from the mines production the Zambrano Palace was built. This is the governor’s palace in downtown Durango, Dgo, a very impressive building to say the least. You can google it and check out the images. It is not known how long the mine was worked as many of the records were lost in a fire in 1810 when the community was attacked by Spanish troops. A short time later the Indians rebelled and in the attack Father Garibay was killed by an arrow in what was known as the Los Tepalcates incident. After this the mining activity was reduced to locals working in primitive fashion until little by little the area mines were left idle. There were ten mines in all being worked in the area. The very last paragraph of this archive states that the mine officially as El Garibay was known locally as El Naranjal from the beginning and after the death of the original owner took over as the recognized name. ////// I am 100% convinced that the Garibay mine is the El Naranjal mine known in the treasure writings. I have researched this not only through this historical document but also by backtracking the tax records both which indicate that the Garibay and the El Naranjal mine are one and the same. The area was initially chosen by the Spanish for settlement for its climate and abundance of native fruits growing in the area as well as facility of growing criolla fruits. Hence the local name for the mine El Naranjal.//// I would think the dumps for this mine could be very high grade although no one apparently has evaluated them or a good dump for metal detecting.
    Great post LilOrphanAnnie, thank you for sharing it! Also thank you for saving me a lot of expense, gas, time and trouble, will not be making that trip to Sinaloa after all. So we can now safely cross El Naranjal off the list.

    Good luck and good hunting amigos, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.
    Oroblanco

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  7. #7
    mx
    Nov 2004
    Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
    14,603
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    Oro, you should know by now that Naranjal is in the present state of Chihuahua <---- genuine sock coffee
    J.A.A., Oroblanco and Simon1 like this.
    "I exist to live, not live to exist"

  8. #8

    Apr 2008
    103
    262 times
    I was completely satisfied with the information posted above calling it a closed case but just yesterday I obtained additional info, or at least a slight variation with more detail of the same story, which I will add on here as all of us are in pursuit of the truth as much as we can find anyway. It does not affect the outcome but clarifies some points. It seems that the mine called el Naranjal was part of a group of mines known collectively as la Garibaya, but there were actually 14 mines ,all in and very close to one another. They were the : La Garibaya, La Puerta, Animas de Guadalupe, San Patricio, San Antonio de Animas, Los Limones, Plomosas, La Colorada, San Diego, Jocuixtle, La Jarocha, Metates, Tepixte y El Naranjal. The two most famous for production were the Garabaya and el Naranjal. All metal produced was shipped and taxes paid were under the registered name for the group La Garibaya. All of the mines were part of the same mineral structure with the exception of one and that was El Naranjal. It was /is located slightly to the west of the rest and at the bottom of the barranca at river level. It is located on rio el Naranjo(oranges) and by a ranchito El Naranjo. It is abandonded and according to the geologist who did a reconnaissance of the area for the mapping agency it is flooded being at or below the water table. It was the only gold producer of the group and an oxidized outcrop probably with whats called surface enrichment that initially produces very rich ore. The mine is now listed on the geological maps as la Espanola. I am pasting a section of that map below ,hopefully it will be readable. Click image for larger version. 

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  9. #9
    um
    Nemo me impune lacesset

    Jan 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by lilorphanannie View Post
    I was completely satisfied with the information posted above calling it a closed case but just yesterday I obtained additional info, or at least a slight variation with more detail of the same story, which I will add on here as all of us are in pursuit of the truth as much as we can find anyway. It does not affect the outcome but clarifies some points. It seems that the mine called el Naranjal was part of a group of mines known collectively as la Garibaya, but there were actually 14 mines ,all in and very close to one another. They were the : La Garibaya, La Puerta, Animas de Guadalupe, San Patricio, San Antonio de Animas, Los Limones, Plomosas, La Colorada, San Diego, Jocuixtle, La Jarocha, Metates, Tepixte y El Naranjal. The two most famous for production were the Garabaya and el Naranjal. All metal produced was shipped and taxes paid were under the registered name for the group La Garibaya. All of the mines were part of the same mineral structure with the exception of one and that was El Naranjal. It was /is located slightly to the west of the rest and at the bottom of the barranca at river level. It is located on rio el Naranjo(oranges) and by a ranchito El Naranjo. It is abandonded and according to the geologist who did a reconnaissance of the area for the mapping agency it is flooded being at or below the water table. It was the only gold producer of the group and an oxidized outcrop probably with whats called surface enrichment that initially produces very rich ore. The mine is now listed on the geological maps as la Espanola. I am pasting a section of that map below ,hopefully it will be readable. Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DSC01920.JPG 
Views:	132 
Size:	866.9 KB 
ID:	1256938
    Another great post LilOrphanAnnie! However this does raise some doubts. For one, as far as we know, only ONE other mine is ever mentioned as being "near" El Naranjal, that is Juana del Arco. No mention of any other mines that I am aware of. And there is no mine by that name mentioned here. Could this be another case of that Mexican habit of using the same danged names, over and over and over again, as happened with Tayopa? I am thinking perhaps yes, as there among that list we see a Plomosas mine mentioned and I know of at least two others with that exact same name.

    An interesting article (online) which was quite difficult for me as I do not speak Spanish, but interesting:
    EL SALTO PUEBLO NUEVO DURANGO

    Please do continue!

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  10. #10
    um
    Nemo me impune lacesset

    Jan 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp View Post
    Oro, you should know by now that Naranjal is in the present state of Chihuahua <---- genuine sock coffee
    Aaii Chihuahua! Right alongside the lost Adams I presume?
    SUPPORT THE BEEF INDUSTRY - EAT BEEF
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  11. #11
    mx
    Nov 2004
    Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
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    Yeah, why not Oro? p.s. that was mentioned with my tongue in my cheek, not to be taken seriously. Just to show how many legends can be misinterpreted. where the same basic data applies,

    But as for El Naranjal being located West of the Tayopa complex, ( state ,of Durango ) it fits every criteria, Except ====?? Perhaps Juana de Arco is one of the un-named other mines in the area also?

    Give with details of Juana De Arco.
    Last edited by Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp; Feb 02, 2016 at 11:19 AM.
    Shortfinger likes this.
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  12. #12

    Apr 2008
    103
    262 times
    I agree that there is and always will be some doubt. i read the piece that oro blanco attached in spanish. it looks to be excerpted from the same historlcal records i read and essentially says the same thing, that la garibaya and el naranjal are one and the same. but the additional info i posted later and the map ,plus the metadata geological report from the mining agency lead me to think that the mine called la espanola is the original el naranjal. which was part of the garibaya group of mines. "close "is of course relative and el naranjal is close as the crow flies but probably not that close walking on the trails. the juana de arco i am told was the original mine which was the reason for the real de san diego, now a ghost town just north of the garibaya group of mines and also mentioned in the piece you sent me to read in spanish. that mine and the real apparently predate the garibay group of mines by some length of time ,how long i dont know. the abandoned real is much more interesting than the el naranjal mine in my opinion. the local people and local historians say that the garibay mine is the el naranjal mine, i side with the geologist that per his information(co ordinates) the la espanola is the former el naranjal mine and the confusion is that there were a group of mines and not just one. also everything about the la espanola fits precisely with the description we find in popular lore.

  13. #13
    mx
    Nov 2004
    Alamos,Sonora,Mexico
    14,603
    11793 times
    All Types Of Treasure Hunting
    Oro, your reference is esentially the same as Lil Orphan Annies'
    Oroblanco and Shortfinger like this.
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  14. #14
    us
    Fortune Favors the BOLD, while Karma Favors the Wise!

    Jan 2006
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    Hey Amy. Good to see you back!

    I only have one issue with the story as told;

    1. Since the early 13th Century, it had been a steadfast rule handed down by every King of Spain that no "Religiosos o Clerigos" were allowed to mine. The specific Ecclesiastical Precept was:

    Rule #4. No one will work mines. This includes the prohibition that no one will have any knowledge about the matter of mining, either directly or indirectly. The intention of the precept is to include all forms of knowledge or interpretations that could even fall within the same precept.
    So, there is no way that there were any taxes paid from these mines. The reason for the rule/precept was because (at least in the 17th Century) the King of Spain was paying the Jesuits 200 pesos per year per Missionary Priest. He was also paying for a lot of expenses for the Jesuits. That is why they weren't allowed to run businesses for profit or have anything to do with mining.

    Mike
    Last edited by gollum; Jan 06, 2016 at 10:32 PM.
    My Motto: "KEEP AT IT!"

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  15. #15

    Apr 2008
    103
    262 times
    Iam not a treasure hunter , but a mining consultant in mexico and do quite a bit of research. Occasionally I come across some of information that I think might be helpful to someone on this forum.. Personally I cant fathom why anyone would pursue a lost mine story such as the lost mine called el naranjal. Being a miner ,and with so many real opportunities to work proven properties I just cant see spending time and money to search for a story tale . at any rate the point of passing on this bit of info is that according to the local historian and remaining documents on record in the office of the president (mayor) for the municipality of pueblo Nuevo, dgo and verbal communication with a geologist who explored the area. The mine el naranjal is in their community. And has never been lost at least to them. So if one wants to believe those people and the written history they have for their community this should suffice and ,I passed that summary on to the interested readers. Since the final objective of the search is to locate the mine el naranjal ,and to the satisfaction of some myself included that objective has been realized ,it is incidental whether or to whom the taxes were paid. But it is on record in the state of Durango, the historical archives that the Zambrano Palace was built and paid for by the Zambrano family via the production from their mines and chiefly the mine known as el naranjal. The Zambrano’s held about a dozen mines and were the richest family in Durango. They took over the operation of the mine El Naranjal after the demise of Father Garibay and worked the Naranjal mine to its depletion.those records are on disc now both the state and church if anyone is interested. Father Garibay is well known in Durango history and the principle mine still bears his name. he is registered as the original owner and then mr Zambrano, maybe this helps.

 

 
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