Button Experts Help!! NJ Attic find

[SeattleHistoryNut]

My grandparents in New Jersey ran a small antique shop, and after my grandfather passed I was in the attic and found a small jar with something small inside with a piece of paper. Inside? was a single button and on the piece of paper was, "B Hill." (Bunker Hill I'm assuming?)

On it is the anchor, anchor ring, and intertwining chain bordered with some sort of laurel patterning. Trying to research and find a match over the years has been frustrating. There are LOTS of Revolutionary War, Colonial, and Military era buttons with the anchor and rope design that look very similar, but none that EXACTLY matched mine. Thus the frustration. . . but I have deduced that is British Royal Navy. (Right?)

On the back besides the birdcage is writing. Infuriating writing because I can only make out an "S" and an "I" for sure. Everything else is just hieroglyphs.

Anyways here are the pics, let me know what you all think. HH
-CHN

[CC Hunter]

The button is not British, and actually rather a French Navy button.

Also, I believe that particular design style is post-Rev War, and in fact well into the 19th century.

CC Hunter

[SeattleHistoryNut]

The button is not British, and actually rather a French Navy button.

Also, I believe that particular design style is post-Rev War, and in fact well into the 19th century.

CC Hunter

CC Hunter as I am not an expert in old buttons would you mind elaborating as to what lead you to those conclusions? I am definitely not doubting you, just wanting to glean knowledge
-CHN

[TheCannonballGuy]

CC Hunter is correct in saying that it is a French Navy button, not British. Go to this website, where you can view many French military buttons (and one British Navy button) from a Crimean War (1853-56) site. http://www.packhorsefordrelics.com/c...ar_buttons.htm

The British Navy button from that 1853-56 site has a crown above the anchor, which your button doesn't have.

The key ID-clues to it being French are the "birdcage" shank and (most importantly) the odd-looking "curlycue" which almost entirely surrounds the anchor. That surrounding "curlycue" is strictly French ...as you'll see on the many French military buttons at that that website.

Now, about dating your French Navy button... the use of that "curlycue" surrounding the button's main emblem does date back beyond 1853. It is on typical French Army buttons dug at Revolutionary War sites ...notably here in Virginia, where the French forces participated in the siege of Yorktown. But without knowing your button's backmark, I can't say whether it dates from the 1700s or the 1800s.

[CRUSADER]

CC Hunter is correct in saying that it is a French Navy button, not British. Go to this website, where you can view many French military buttons (and one British Navy button) from a Crimean War (1853-56) site. http://www.packhorsefordrelics.com/c...ar_buttons.htm

The British Navy button from that 1853-56 site has a crown above the anchor, which your button doesn't have.

The key ID-clues to it being French are the "birdcage" shank and (most importantly) the odd-looking "curlycue" which almost entirely surrounds the anchor. That surrounding "curlycue" is strictly French ...as you'll see on the many French military buttons at that that website.

Now, about dating your French Navy button... the use of that "curlycue" surrounding the button's main emblem does date back beyond 1853. It is on typical French Army buttons dug at Revolutionary War sites ...notably here in Virginia, where the French forces participated in the siege of Yorktown. But without knowing your button's backmark, I can't say whether it dates from the 1700s or the 1800s.

Agreed with everyone, however the British have plenty of Navy Buttons without Crowns, so not a good indicator. However as mentioned the Birdcage is a massive give-away, the second highlighted fact & lastly the style of the anchor.

[SeattleHistoryNut]

Awesome guys thank you! And thanks for the link! HH
-CHN

[CC Hunter]

Professor Cannonball Guy has elaborated well on the French details. In regards to dating the time period on both military and civilian buttons, I will add that to the best of my knowledge, company backmarks were not common practice until the early 1800's. I recall there are a few U.S. and British manufactured buttons that had backmarks as early as the 1790's, though we do not see this practice on many examples until the War of 1812 period and later buttons. Also, in my experience, the predominance of Rev War buttons are either flat or very low convex. I have a French Rev War Navy button that I personally excavated, as well as seeing many other French buttons excavated at Rev War and Colonial sites. Based on my memory, none of the French buttons I recall seeing, were as heavy in their casting material, nor as convex (domed), as we see in this example. Styles and designs of all clothing, both military and civilian, follow certain trends and fads, that often change every couple decades or so.

[Bigcypresshunter]

Professor?

[CC Hunter]

The term "Professor" was respectfully bestowed quite some time ago, as the initials PCG for Professor Cannoball Guy has significance. 8)

CC Hunter

[Bigcypresshunter]

The term "Professor" was respectfully bestowed quite some time ago, as the initials PCG for Professor Cannoball Guy has significance. 8)

CC Hunter

OK thanks. He is very knowlegable on artifacts .. Call me slow. What significance is PCG?

[CC Hunter]

The gentleman being addressed, is the author and co-author of some of the best reference books on Civil War ordinance. He's been around the collecting community long before there was an Internet. My first acquaintance was in meeting at the famed Nashville Civil War show more the 25 years ago, where I had questions regarding a few rare items that I had excavated.

I added the "Professor" part to his Internet name on my replies here awhile back, as a respectful "inside" joke, where it matched with PCG.

CC Hunter

[Bigcypresshunter]

He is the author and co-author in some of the best reference books on Civil War ordinance. He's been around the collecting community long before there was an Internet. My first acquaintance was in meeting at the famed Nashville Civil War show more the 25 years ago, where I had questions regarding a few rare items that I had excavated.

I added the "Professor" part to his name on my replies here awhile back, as a respectful "inside" joke, where it matched with PCG.

CC Hunter

OK thanks. I live in South Florida so I dont have any connections with the CW community, authors, artifacts or ordinance.