amethyist Umbrella INKWell Pictures ! New Find

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

Hey Guys!
It's Good to be back. I've been gone awhile, life took over it happens, feels good to be back at the old hobby. So I was a with a friend and went to a local flea market today! Had just been thinking about how I wanted to find my first Umbrella Ink and there she was last minute, in the back of items nestled away! I could not Believe it, even more I couldn't Believe what color it was, amethyst ! 8 sided rolled lip(I believe?) looking back at me. At first I couldn't believe it was real until I inspected it more and as I went to clean it up with soap and warm water , what I thought was dirt on the inside turned out to be Dried Ink!! HA most of my worries gone. I do realize its not the oldest type out there, but I'm 90% set on its real. Which is why I'm here, would you guys take a look tell me what you think and to just enjoy it, honestly I haven't been able to put it down since I got home, its so neat and beautiful!

Just wanted the thoughts on you all from the pros to the hobbyist to the admire, what do think or have to say about it, or its potential $ Value??

It is my understanding that in the category of Umbrella Inks come in many colors but rarely amethyst ?

Also What color amethyst would you say guess to call it? grape? , Puce? its for sure has some plum type tone to it?

The Photos are very close to the color of what your eyes would see but camera and lighting do make slight differences.


Thanks Crew I hope you enjoy it and look forward to hearing from you all.

 

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[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

other pics

sorry its been a pain trying to load these pictures. Didn't want to work right the first time around.

 

[unclemac]

does the seam go all the way up the lip?

 

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

Yes it does. that's what worried me at first but then I thought it more so says something about its age, mean its ABM made. does not necessarily mean replica right?

I have an old Lady leg Bitters Bottle but its ABM but still worth 400-800. So ABM isn't always bad I assume.?

 

[gleaner1]

Yes it does. that's what worried me at first but then I thought it more so says something about its age, mean its ABM made. does not necessarily mean replica right?

I have an old Lady leg Bitters Bottle but its ABM but still worth 400-800. So ABM isn't always bad I assume.?

ABM means Automatic Bottle Machine, and has nothing to do with replica anything, good or bad. Your ink is probably a replica, which is not necessarily bad, but could be a a really good little known regional ABM type based on the old umbrella ink style. Yours would be attic mint, due to complete lack of any wear, which is good. I've seen much better replica applied pontil umbrellas, which are okay in their own right, but were made after ABM and are considered as bad. It's crazy. KeepperOfGems, what type is your valuable ladie's leg bitters, can you show us pics of that bad one? If it's worth 400-800, then yes, ABM isn't always bad, it's clearly good. You have a bottle that proves ABM isnt always bad I assume.

 

[Bass]

Don't want to ruin your day but my guess is it has been "nuked". I could be wrong and hope that i am but thats my opinion. Its awful dark looking to me to be natural.

Sent from my iPhone using TreasureNet

 

[RelicDude]

That's a good looking bottle. But I think bass is right it does look to be nuked but I could be wrong. But an other member on this forum epackage and an other collector just documented how to reverse the process with high heat and amazingly it returned to its natural color.

Sent from my iPod touch using TreasureNet

 

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

does the seam go all the way up the lip?

I should have noted in my first response , not sure if this makes a differences, but if you like close at the first pic you can almost see what I mean. The line (seam) is not connected, but that I mean the 2 seams that run along the body are separate from the 2 lines that run along the neck, but yes the seam are on the neck too, they just to not align with the seams body. If that makes any sense or helps.

 

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

ABM means Automatic Bottle Machine, and has nothing to do with replica anything, good or bad. Your ink is probably a replica, which is not necessarily bad, but could be a a really good little known regional ABM type based on the old umbrella ink style. Yours would be attic mint, due to complete lack of any wear, which is good. I've seen much better replica applied pontil umbrellas, which are okay in their own right, but were made after ABM and are considered as bad. It's crazy. KeepperOfGems, what type is your valuable ladie's leg bitters, can you show us pics of that bad one? If it's worth 400-800, then yes, ABM isn't always bad, it's clearly good. You have a bottle that proves ABM isnt always bad I assume.

Glean Thank You for sharing your thoughts!

I get ahead of my self sometimes, I was using the ABM as a mental reference in my thought process newer production method= closer to replica time period. Yes ABM is not a bad thing at all, I just was hoping for something older.

As for your idea of a really good little known ABM type based, I'd say little known is good wording because I haven't found much on this one. I've found same color but not same color with the seam(ABM). Even if so, like said its a damn good looking bottle regardless.

About the Bitters, I would more then gladly tell & show you about it, but I know how forums like to not mix threads, so I would like to keep this one about the ink, I can create a new one or found the old one which still has pictures. I put it on here about 3 years ago when I first picked it up! Still have it and its gone up in value and I have seen a few sold since.

It is a" F.RAHTER ZINGARI BITTERS LADIES LEG" My first true bottle score at a outdoor flea market.
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/bottles-glass/206517-got-new-f-rahter-zincari-bitters-bottle.html
old link

 

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

Don't want to ruin your day but my guess is it has been "nuked". I could be wrong and hope that i am but thats my opinion. Its awful dark looking to me to be natural.

Sent from my iPhone using TreasureNet

That's a good looking bottle. But I think bass is right it does look to be nuked but I could be wrong. But an other member on this forum epackage and an other collector just documented how to reverse the process with high heat and amazingly it returned to its natural color.

Sent from my iPod touch using TreasureNet

Thanks Fellas

This is a possibility which I do not know much about. a Few Points , The color is hard to pic up exact with my camera phone. Honestly in the light, specially the sun its not all the dark at all, its actually very bright . I did a search on nukes and most of what I saw was a very Dark Purple. This is much more amethyst with a reddish pink tone! And I have not fully cleaned it with a brush and gotten all the ink out of it, so the bottom end still seem darker , still dirty.

also I've seen examples of pristine older umbrellas that are amethyst in color, the shade varies. On collectors page, So what is the difference or how does one tell Nuked from true amethyst? Just want to learn and understand, what makes it look "nuked" to you?

Thank you

 

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

Another Reason that leads me to Believe mine is NOT a Replica, before I found this I learned, that Many Replicas where made in Japan. They would be Stamped with JAPAN on the bottom. This was the first thing I looked for when I found it. Mine does not say Japan on the bottom.

here is a example of a replica that looks very different but is amethyst and marked JAPAN, not the same inkwell!
Vintage Dark Purple Amethyst Octagon Shaped Glass Inkwell | eBay

which is why it was $5.24

 

[mrmozambique13]

Most of the time you can tell with the nuked purples, it comes out a nice "purple drink" color. If you didn't pay too much for it I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

Thanks , Yea I only paid $15 for it, so weather it is or isn't , it is or isn't . It's still a neat find, and pretty piece to enjoy it for what it is.

 

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

So on the "nuked" or not thing. Nuked comes it 2 ways that I've found. The Sun, Natural, or UV Tan (light box).

Everything that I've looked at NUKED wise is Purple and I mean PURPLE! almost a dark blue purple. Depending on how long its been cooking.

Like I said, these weren't the best pic, and it seemed darker because it still had ink in it, I've gotten it thoroughly cleaned and shinning now. I will take pictures tomorrow in the Sun Light so you can see its true color!

It is more of a Reddish Toned Pink/ amethyst.....Not the color of GRAPE KOOL AID or The picture I am about to post. It has a Red Plum wine hue to it . I am convinced it is not "nuked" and if so, then maybe slightly by the sun. But I have been looking At these artificial PURPLE COLORS all day....and this ink is Not nothing like these DARK ROYAL PURPLES I've seen do to nuking.

Irradiated Purple= My piece isn't even closes.

New pictures coming. Again Thank you , not saying anyone is wrong or I am right, Just Putting all the pieces together. Learning in the process.

 

[gleaner1]

Glean Thank You for sharing your thoughts!

I get ahead of my self sometimes, I was using the ABM as a mental reference in my thought process newer production method= closer to replica time period. Yes ABM is not a bad thing at all, I just was hoping for something older.

As for your idea of a really good little known ABM type based, I'd say little known is good wording because I haven't found much on this one. I've found same color but not same color with the seam(ABM). Even if so, like said its a damn good looking bottle regardless.

About the Bitters, I would more then gladly tell & show you about it, but I know how forums like to not mix threads, so I would like to keep this one about the ink, I can create a new one or found the old one which still has pictures. I put it on here about 3 years ago when I first picked it up! Still have it and its gone up in value and I have seen a few sold since.

It is a" F.RAHTER ZINGARI BITTERS LADIES LEG" My first true bottle score at a outdoor flea market.
http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/bottles-glass/206517-got-new-f-rahter-zincari-bitters-bottle.html
old link

the ladies leg you have is NOT abm

 

[gleaner1]

Most original umbrellas are crude, old and pontilled. I had a very nice attic condition eight side emerald green bona fide ink that is bimal i got lucky at a flea market paid eight bucks, this was thirty years ago. I gave it to my cousin, a serious ink collector. I will try to get pics. Your ink is almost without doubt a novelty item. BTW, I love that bimal puce bitters of yours.

 

[sandchip]

Most original umbrellas are crude, old and pontilled...Your ink is almost without doubt a novelty item...

I agree. My gut says replica, original color, not nuked. There are a few smooth base examples out there, but by the time the ABM came along, the umbrella was a style long abandoned for other designs. Your example doesn't even look early ABM to me. A beautiful color though. At least you didn't spend 1,500 for what the original smooth-based, tooled top examples bring in that color.

 

[redbeardrelics]

I am onboard with Sandchip on this one. That is the intended color for that reproduction/replica ink bottle. Very attractive, but no more than 20 years old IMO.

 

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

I just wanted let you all know I have a learned a lot from all of you and my on research online in the past weeks on this one, and just wanted to say that I'm Onboard with rest of you guys on this one considered it solved! Thanks again.

To be honest, my gut said the same thing when I first picked it up, didn't have that old have thick heavy glass feel to it, just wanted to believe it the real do, Don't we all.

 

[RRGhostWreckKeepperOfGems]

side not--random, but is my Screen name to long or a pain? its long sticks out in the messages and just wondering if I should ,can, or could change it? though I like it.