Are dried up river beds still considered public domain and open for detecting?

[creskol]

Thanks for your thoughts on this matter.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

A History of Mining on the Kenai Peninsula, Alaska - Grab it through Amazon!

[creskol]

Thanks for your thoughts on this matter.

Creskol
I "think" I know where you are going with this question and since you posted under Texas, I'll say No they aren't. When I lived in Ohio the law was that all water ways belonged to the state and were considered public and I'm sure many other states are the same, but what I have found in Tx is that someone owns everything either state, national or private...Hope this helps
J-G

Thanks.. In Virginia they are public land as well. I am in Texas for a month or two, and have noticed that many of the rivers are dry, or are nearly dry. There are several places along the Brazos that have some historical significance that I thought I might hit if I had time and it was legal to do so. Guess I better check with county and state authorities before that adventure. Thanks.

 

[cooltone23]

That would be your best bet. Better safe than sorry bud

 

[sqwaby]

Any navigable waterway is state property open to the public. Once you set foot on the bank its usually privately owned.

 

[lastleg]

Several years ago Boone Pickens restricted his Canadian River holdings from
4-wheelers who used the dried up riverbed as their personal playground.
The recreationists took him to court to gain legal access. Guess who won?
If you guessed T. Boone you are right. lastleg

 

[Kentucky Kache]

I like to hunt dry beds for meteorites...lots of strange rocks.

 

[Neogeo]

Your right about the water and the riverbank.The bank is privite,but what I am wonderin is ...
Does the riverbed become the bank,once it's dry?If so then the dry bed is now privite..right??

 

[redwolf74]

It all depends on how navigable water in defined. Seasonal stream flow is not considered navigable even if exceeds 30 feet in width.

This is from the TX Parks and Wildlife website:


Original Statutory Provision (effective December 14, 1837)

That all streams of the average width of 30 feet shall be considered navigable streams within the meaning of this act, so far up as they retain that average width, and that they shall not be crossed by the lines of a survey.
1 Sayles’ Early Laws of Texas, p. 271, quoted at 286 S.W. 466.

Current Statutes

Natural Resources Code§ 21.001. Definitions.

In this chapter ...
(3) “Navigable stream” means a stream which retains an average width of 30 feet from the mouth up.

Natural Resources Code§ 21.012. Surveys on Navigable Streams.

(a) If the circumstances of the lines previously surveyed under the law will permit, land surveyed for individuals, lying on a navigable stream, shall front one half of the square on the stream with the line running at right angles with the general course of the stream.
(b) A navigable stream may not be crossed by the lines of a survey.

 

[creskol]

It all depends on how navigable water in defined. Seasonal stream flow is not considered navigable even if exceeds 30 feet in width.

This is from the TX Parks and Wildlife website:


Original Statutory Provision (effective December 14, 1837)

That all streams of the average width of 30 feet shall be considered navigable streams within the meaning of this act, so far up as they retain that average width, and that they shall not be crossed by the lines of a survey.
1 Sayles’ Early Laws of Texas, p. 271, quoted at 286 S.W. 466.

Current Statutes

Natural Resources Code§ 21.001. Definitions.

In this chapter ...
(3) “Navigable stream” means a stream which retains an average width of 30 feet from the mouth up.

Natural Resources Code§ 21.012. Surveys on Navigable Streams.

(a) If the circumstances of the lines previously surveyed under the law will permit, land surveyed for individuals, lying on a navigable stream, shall front one half of the square on the stream with the line running at right angles with the general course of the stream.
(b) A navigable stream may not be crossed by the lines of a survey.

That's good info ...Thanks!!

 

[txkickergirl]

not sure how the river works but I can tell you how the lakes work, as the water goes down you own the property out to the halfway mark of the lakes. Each time the water goes down my dad has to fence it off for the horse, now when the water comes back up, he has to go and remove the fence because it belongs back to the state. Its constantly going back and forth.

Whats more to the point about Texas is not the right away its the fact if you find anything anywhere in Texas that is really really old...your up the creek and tresspassing would be the lest of it. If there isn't a law about, they will make one and take it anyway.

 

[Neogeo]

There has been a big stink being made here about artifact pay-dig sites....When will it stop?

 

[creskol]

If there isn't a law about, they will make one and take it anyway.

Man .. I thought this mentality was unique to Galveston .. Is the rest of Texas that way too?

 

[lastleg]

Naw, it's just in places where the most people live. The bigger the city the
more onery the beuracrats are. The only trouble most of us have is getting
permission to hunt old private yards. lastleg

 

[txkickergirl]

no not so much that because I hunt rural areas, If its private owned and you get permission than you are pretty much home free, because chances are the owner isn't going to turn you in for a couple old bullets, maybe a coin or two. Sadly enough most of the sites that you'd like to hunt have been turned into federal or state parks, national seashore or game preserves. The other public land you can hunt still isn't without restrictions, and one of those being the antiquity law of Texas more info can be found here
http://www.neisd.net/redland/roarch/antcode.htm

 

[PICCman]

Thanks for the link.....

 

[21stTNCav]

You know I got involved with the KURV petition to commute Ramos and Capetian sentences. When nothing happend before Christmas, I was a little disheartened. Then the last thing Bush did was set em free (in March). Sometimes when I think of all the laws I am a bit overwhelmed by how the Government(state and federal) has us under it's heel I think of that KURV petition. Possibly it's time to organize and fight, starting with the State. Yeah, they can whup on any one of us, but together I think we could effect some changes. Watch out State of Texas, your employer(us) is getting pissed at ya.

 

[creskol]

I checked with the local law enforcement for the county

and they seemed to be ignorant of any laws pertaining to the subject. They said if I stayed within the confines of the riverbanks, they would have no problem with hunting the riverbed. Perhaps it is a local issue where it's okay in some counties and not others?
Anyway, I hope to try my luck on my return trip sometime in April.

 

[beaks]

the river is public up to the high water line so go for it.
i hunt the brazos all of the time and find some pretty cool stuff.

the width of any creek or river is measured from the high water mark so most in texas are free game for hunters and the smaller creeks are cool too if you ask permission(most landowners will look at you like you are stupid and tell you to go ahead as long as you dont trash the place.)

John

 

[One mans trash...]

Every inch of Texas is owned, either by the state or privately, except for federal reservations. From the beginning (and one of the smarter moves) the state reserved for itself all lands not titled to someone. So they could award grants to veterans of the Texas revolution and maintain a huge college fund from oil leases on state lands and let people homestead and get title if they lived on the place the minimum time and prove it up to the county judge. Amount of land depended on whether you farmed or ranched or both. Also traded an immense tract in northwest Texas to the syndicate that provided funds to build the capitol. It became the XIT Ranch, the last bits of which just broke up. A while back, an old survey mistake was discovered in Bastrop County that opened up some gaps in what people had thought was their property. It automatically became state land. It took an act of the legislature to get it back to them. It happens some times. Some of the property lines, especially the large old tracts, were fuzzy, on account of the mode of running lines in the old days. A surveyor on horseback would ride ahead pulling one end of a rope of known length. When it went taut, he would stop, and the other guy would ride forward past him and repeat. They got tired of that, and often, the man behind would guess the other man was about near the end and would begin to ride forward early.

No one is going to get too excited about someone working the bed of a dry navigable river, especially when ostensibly looking for lost change, fishing gear, etc. Very, very few deputies have any idea of the antiquities laws, anyway. A friendly land owner might even tell where the old fords were.

 

[BigRon]

One might also consider the regulations of other quasi-public entities such as the LCRA that control the rivers.
The LCRA forbids Mding on its parks.