civil war bullet?

[Rdh5832]

I found this today in my backyard which saw heavy fighting during the civil war. I think it’s a bullet .. it’s solid lead and you can see rings like a mini ball? Am I right? I’m super excited and hope I am! Any feedback appreciated. Also anyone kno why it’s smashed? Did it hit its target?

 

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[BosnMate]

Yes, you have a bullet that has hit something and was deformed by the hit. I'm sure it's a civil war era bullet, but will let the more expert people on here tell you the rest of the information, if there is enough of the bullet left to really identify.

 

[jewelerguy]

looks like an impacted 3 ringer to me

 

[creskol]

What does the "bottom" of it look like?

 

[Rdh5832]

What does the "bottom" of it look like?

I think the bottom is the end where the open hole is?

 

[creskol]

I think the bottom is the end where the open hole is?

Since you showed that in all three photos, I am referring to the portion in your hand that is not shown in any of the photos.

 

[Rdh5832]

Here we go

 

[Yak1366]

There ya go...now where's the next one?

 

[Rdh5832]

Trust me, I’ll be looking!

 

[creskol]

Here we go

Bullets aren't my area of expertise (for lack of a better term), but there is something about the rim of this bullet that makes it look like maybe a high impact Gardner or something. Like I say, I am no expert, but the photo below has an arrow pointing to what looks like a paper groove? Hopefully somebody with more knowledge than I will chime in on this one.

 

[Yak1366]

I don't believe the bullet Rdh5832 found is a Gardner. The lower ring on a Gardner is significantly wider/taller than the next ring.

Typically, 3 groove minies appear to have the same size rings except in the case of a "high base ring" version.

I have found many specimens of 3 groove minies with what I call a 'skirt ring'. I am unsure of how this was created. I feel confident TheCannonballGuy will clarify and enlighten us.

The pic of 3 bullets shows from left to right, a normal base, a skirted base & a Gardner (which was known for it's crimping).

I believe Rdh5832's bullet is a skirted base type.

I hope this helps clarify a bit.

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

Yak1366 is correct on every point. Excellent reply.

More specifically, your bullet's ID is a yankee generic "Springfield" 3-groove Minie-bullet, a .58-caliber one, intended primarily for use in a Springfield Rifle, but it would also fit a .577 Enfield Rifle.

Your bullet is badly smashed because it was fired at very close range into one of the rocks or boulders in Chattanooga's famously boulder-riddled soil. (Long ago when I lived in North Georgia I used to go relic-digging around Lookout Mountain, so I know what you're dealing with.)

Before it was fired, it probably looked like the one in the photo below.

Rdh5832, here's some very basic civil war bullet info for you, since that is the first one you've ever found:
Civil war relic diggers tend to call this type a "3-ringer" but in actuality the bullet has 3 grooves... not rings, which are raised above the bullet's cylindrical body, like a wedding ring on your finger. Your bullet is made of 100%-pure lead, which is why long-buried ones develop greyish-white Lead Oxide ("lead rust") patina. Please be careful to NOT scrape it off when you clean a dug bullet, because that paper-thin patina layer is the proof of your of your bullet's age. If the patina is removed, the bullet cannot be distinguished from a modern Reproduction of a civil war bullet. (Accurate reproductions are made for modern Blackpowder rifle shooters and game-hunters -- you can see some at the bottom of the webpage here: Ol' Buffalo Bullet Mold Tables )

Yak1366, what you are calling a "skirted base" is formed by a slight miss-fit between the body of the bulletcasting mold and the cavity-forming insert part of the mold. In other words, there is a separate part of the mold (containing the cone shape) which fits into the bottom of the "hollow" for the bullet's body in the main mold. If the cone-forming part is not aligned EXACTLY right, the result is an indented line and/or a bit of "flashing" on the cast bullet's base. I regret that I don't have a photo showing that type of mold, and thus I've tried to paint a picture with words. Thus comes the old saying, "A picture is worth a thousand words (of description)".

 

[Rdh5832]

Wow, what a great response! I really appreciate it, I didn’t think I would be lucky enough to get so much information. I’ve been looking for some others - surely there are a few more around in the same general area. You are spot on about the rocky ground, every time I did a hole it’s filled with rocks and sometimes even hard to break the surface. I would like to find one that isn’t smashed. I found this one right next to my fire pit on the south crest in my backyard. Do you have any information about fighting on missionary ridge - it’s hard to find exact details of heavy fighting and skirmishes on the south end. Thanks !

 

[Rdh5832]

I actually found this one a couple years ago also on missionary ridge on the north crest. I did do some research and determined it was a 69 caliber musket ball. Does that sound correct?

 

[Yak1366]

Yak1366 is correct on every point. Excellent reply.

More specifically, your bullet's ID is a yankee generic "Springfield" 3-groove Minie-bullet, a .58-caliber one, intended primarily for use in a Springfield Rifle, but it would also fit a .577 Enfield Rifle.

Your bullet is badly smashed because it was fired at very close range into one of the rocks or boulders in Chattanooga's famously boulder-riddled soil. (Long ago when I lived in North Georgia I used to go relic-digging around Lookout Mountain, so I know what you're dealing with.)

Before it was fired, it probably looked like the one in the photo below.

Rdh5832, here's some very basic civil war bullet info for you, since that is the first one you've ever found:
Civil war relic diggers tend to call this type a "3-ringer" but in actuality the bullet has 3 grooves... not rings, which are raised above the bullet's cylindrical body, like a wedding ring on your finger. Your bullet is made of 100%-pure lead, which is why long-buried ones develop greyish-white Lead Oxide ("lead rust") patina. Please be careful to NOT scrape it off when you clean a dug bullet, because that paper-thin patina layer is the proof of your of your bullet's age. If the patina is removed, the bullet cannot be distinguished from a modern Reproduction of a civil war bullet. (Accurate reproductions are made for modern Blackpowder rifle shooters and game-hunters -- you can see some at the bottom of the webpage here: Ol' Buffalo Bullet Mold Tables )

Yak1366, what you are calling a "skirted base" is formed by a slight miss-fit between the body of the bulletcasting mold and the cavity-forming insert part of the mold. In other words, there is a separate part of the mold (containing the cone shape) which fits into the bottom of the "hollow" for the bullet's body in the main mold. If the cone-forming part is not aligned EXACTLY right, the result is an indented line and/or a bit of "flashing" on the cast bullet's base. I regret that I don't have a photo showing that type of mold, and thus I've tried to paint a picture with words. Thus comes the old saying, "A picture is worth a thousand words (of description)".

Thank you CannonballGuy for the generous compliment & detailed info!!

I try to do my homework. As soon as I read your post, I was kicking myself for not putting 2 & 2 together. I received the book from Jim Thomas & noticed the various mold styles & inserts for the different cavities, but never considered that's how the 'skirt' was created. Do you think that maybe an insert designed for say a 57Cal cavity might have been used in a 58Cal mold?

 

[Yak1366]

I actually found this one a couple years ago also on missionary ridge on the north crest. I did do some research and determined it was a 69 caliber musket ball. Does that sound correct?

Looks correct. If you have a set of calipers, it should measure smaller than 0.69". Most of my 69Cal Round Balls measure 0.64-0.66" not including the mold seam.

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

Yak1366 wrote:
> "Thank you CannonballGuy for the generous compliment & detailed info!!"

Yak, you're welcome. You produced a detailed very-educational reply for the person who'd found his/her very first civil war bullet. I used to be just like him/her, and though it was about 43 years ago, I haven't forgotten how much I appreciated the helpful relic-ID info (and explanations) I was given by a couple of kind-hearted Oldtimers. It's why I do what I do here at TreasureNet.

Yak1366 also wrote:
> "Do you think that maybe an insert designed for say a 57Cal cavity might have been used in a 58Cal mold?"

That's a "reasonable" guess... but the answer is definitely no, for several reasons:

(1) The cavity-forming insert was very firmly physically attached to the bulletmold's main body. It wouldn't get "lost" or swapped with one from a different size of bulletmold.
(2) Neither the US nor the CSA made any .57-caliber (.570-inch bore diameter) rifles. Some versions of Minie-bullet were made for use in the .577 Enfield Rifle, and (according to Ordnance Department size-specifications) those measured about .560-to-.572-inch in diameter, so they would work just fine in either a .577 or .580-caliber rifle.
(3) Even if the bulletmold's base-insert somehow got swapped, a difference of .01-inch of an inch isn't enough to show on the bullet.