Time to upgrade the excal.... Need some coil advice

[jpg963]

I am planning on reworking my current excalibur setup to better suit the New Jersey beaches I exclusively hunt. My current setup is a blue excal 800 with a Coiltek WOL, headphone mod and remote pinpoint, and feel I am still leaving alot on the beaches as I need to run the sensitivity rather low to compensate for the amount of chatter due to the mineralized sand and the wash of the shallow wave action. I have hunted with the stock 8" coil and as it is much more stable in the surf, it is way to small for the wet sand and hunting the rest of the beach. So I am reaching out to the legends on treasure net for recommendations for the most stable coil for shallow water to wet sand hunting that is also bearable to use in the dry sand. I have decided I need to go with a mid sized coil but would like to try and find the most stable and sensitive to small gold alternative to the stock 10". I have narrowed it down to a few including the NEL Hunter 12.5" X 8.5" and the Detech SEF 10" X 12".. Has anyone used or currently use these on the excalibur and how do they perform in the surf / wet sand and what are their pros and cons? Do any of you have any other coil recommendations for the northern east coast beaches? I am open to any feedback in regards to the various coils but do not want this to turn into a how to detect the beach or your using it wrong thread.. Thanks in advance.

 

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[bigscoop]

I don't believe you're going to be happy with any single coil setup, the best solution being the installation of a coil cable connector so you can change coils depending on the hunting conditions. (The best setup probably being the one OBN offers when/if he's open for business.) I would strongly recommend you inquire/consider this option first thus allowing you the most versatility and efficiency out of your machine in most any type of hunting condition. Not a chance that I would ever go back to hardwired setup unless I had 3 machines fitted with different coil sizes. There just isn't a perfect single coil solution.

PS: As for the large coil over the dry sand, etc., I strongly recommend that you invest in a harness if you don't already have one. With a harness you can swing even larger coils all day long with no problem at all. If I get the chance I'm even going to add an 18" SFE to my arsenal - if I can still find one? (Not looked yet.)

 

[cudamark]

I agree with bigscoop. No one coil is going to do the job in all situations. I have several Excaliburs. One is a stock blue 1000 (except for a straight shaft) that I use for the surf. It's easier to swing than the large coils, although I will sometimes use the big coils if the surf is mild. I also have one with an inline connnector so I can swap to an 8", 10" or 15" NEL Attack (which is on it now). I also have one hardwired with a Coiltek 15" WOT. Of the large coils, I find the NEL 15" Attack to be the most stable and pin points a bit better too. All have a straight shaft (the Plugger carbon fiber being my favorite) and the last two have the pin point switch on the handle. The NEL machine has GGA's (good sound and volume control being it's pluses) and the WOT has a custom set (stock speakers, but, nice, comfortable, aftermarket muffs). I hip (butt) mount all mine, so, weight isn't an issue with me. Nor is the dreaded broken cable problem (so far!) that everyone seems to say is inevitable. Been using the hip mount for over 10 years now without a problem. Just zip tie the cables coming out of the control pod to the control pod itself and leave plenty of slack for the coil cable to hang and not bind or kink.

 

[jpg963]

Thanks Bigscoop and Cudamark but let me clarify that I do have an inline connector and frequently switch between the 8" and WOT. What I am looking for is a larger coil than the 8" that is stable enough to use in the surf line. I have read that most prefer the stock 10" coil so was thinking I might look at the oblong coils in the hope of keeping the extra depth associated with a bigger coil but with less of a footprint/matrix to cause chatter. Any thoughts on oblong vs round coils and the beach?

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[bigscoop]

I think you're trying to defeat the same constant variable that I continued to try to defeat before I realized that it just can't be defeated. The problem isn't the coil or the coil size, but rather it's the interference in the search field that is going to cause the same issues regardless of the "coil design" used. A small coil will perform better in harsher conditions for the very reason that there's less interference in the search field due to the coil's smaller size, thus the processor can keep up with the required filtering of that interference. But as we increase coil size we also increase the amount of interference in the search field, this isn't going to change regardless of the "coil design" used. Over some fairly clean wet sand the issue is marginalized and not nearly as noticeable but in moving saltwater the issue is multiplied, and often by quite a bit as that movement in the search field increases. Eventually we reach a point where the stability of the search field just isn't stable enough for the efficient application of larger coils. You can try other aftermarket coils but I think you'll discover that the stock 10" is going to perform as well as any of them simply due to the nature of the environment you're hunting. This is why I change/changed coils so often, so I could/can hunt in the most efficient manner possible regardless of the situation. 8,10,12x15 SEF coils - and I plan to add an 18" SEF later this year for all these same reasons now that I'll be hunting mostly freshwater beaches. Just my 2 cents after an entire summer spent trying to defeat the same issue you're trying to defeat now.

 

[bigscoop]

One other note I'll add....my old blue was an 800 and I've never had the falsing problem with waves crashing over the coil and such, even with the larger coils. I believe, and this is just me, that due to the machine's lack of shielding you have to keep the coil in constant contact with the bottom as any subtle and sudden rise or lowering of the coil at wave impact will cause those false signals. Again, this all goes back to the search field being already consumed with information and then that search field gets suddenly shaken which is what causes the confusion and falsing. When the coil floats up and down or when it is given a sudden reason to shift it's plane, even slightly, the information in that search field gets suddenly scrambled and the processor simply can't keep up. I run my machine's sensitivity pretty darn high most of the time and keeping in contact with the bottom seems to let me cruise right along without too many issues, the same result even when water hunting. Absolute coil control is absolutely critical.

About the only time I would get those falsing issues is when a wave surge "moved me" which in effect caused my coil to suddenly shift about as well. Try what I'm suggesting and I think you'll see some of those falsing issues go away.

 

[jpg963]

First of all thanks for all of the knowledge each of you share with the community. Over the years I have learned and continue to learn a ton from your posts and videos. Bigscoop, your videos are hilarious and very informative...

So I spent a few hours out on the beach today and split my time between the wet sand chasing the tide out with the WOT and in the knee high surf with the 8". Had to run the WOT at a 5 sensitivity with a slow swing speed and as long as the sand wasn't fluidized was able to keep the coil on the sand which did allow a more stable threshold. I then took the WOT onto the shallow water knowing it was always less stable but just wanted to see how keeping the coil pinned to the sand would affect the stability. Lets just say it was definitely better but found I had to turn the sensitivity even lower. Switched over to the 8" and was able to search with maxed out sens. for the remainder which has always been the case. By keeping the coil on the sand it did provide less threshold bounce.

So my next step since I do not own a mid sized coil is to add one to my arsenal. Since I will be purchasing one (unless anyone has one to donate to the cause. lol) does it make sense to buy a stock 10" or should I go with an aftermarket NEL hunter or similar type coil. I can't help to think about Bigscoop's words of wisdom about the amount of processing the detector has to do when you go with a larger coil and I know on dry land at least an oblong coil allows for better target ID in trashier areas due to the search pattern of the coil. Would this not also apply to using the same coil in the wet sand or surf as it would be sampling less but with better depth over say an 8" coil? If you had to buy a mid sized coil for your own rig and already had a stock 8" and a WOT, what would you buy?

 

[bigscoop]

Personally, I've had great luck with the SEF coils, so I'd probably stick with those. Either that or the stock 10".