QUESTIONABLE INFORMATION POSTED AS FACT CONCERNING THE BEALE TALE

[ECS]

Over the years on various threads statements have been posted as "fact" when there is no documentation outside of the original source, THE BEALE PAPERS, publish by James Beverly Ward during the year of 1885 in Lynchburg, Virginia.
Most appear to be based on opinion of maybe or pure embellished speculation, or force fitting random possibilities to fit a pet theory.

Some of the questionable "facts":
Robert Morriss was related to Robert Morris Jr, signer of the DOI.
The Fine Arts Building on 600 Main St was the Morriss house where Beale stayed.
Indians observed from a distance the kiln fires that the Beale Party utilized to smelt the ore.
Once smelted gold and silver was made into bars by sand box casting.
The gold was about 60% or 14K, the silver little more pure.
The gold and silver bars were transported in false bottom wagons.
To cross Big Otter Creek, the bars had to be unloaded and placed on pack mules.
The treasure was placed in 30 gal salt Boone's Salt Works brine pots.
The "key letter" was never delivered because of a St Louis flood.

None of what is listed above is mentioned in the original source of THE BEALE PAPERS.

Additional questionable information presented as "fact" include:
Jefferson for the initial "J"
The Otey family name
The Planters Hotel in St Louis
from the Hart Papers which was utilized by Pauline Innis and Peter Viemeister
The Planters Hotel from the Hart Papers was embellished by Claudine Fulton Ellis with:
The "key" letter was never delivered to Robert Morris because George Radar Brugh, Planter Hotel proprietor traveled to Virginia to hand deliver this "key" letter to Morriss, but was killed at a stop over at the Blackhorse Tavern by Ebenezer Helms who then hid the letter.
*NOTE* The original Planters Hotel in St louis was a wood frame building built next to the river on 1817, and during the time of the alleged Beale stay, Evarist Maury was the proprietor.

Another variation derieved from the Hart's mention of Otey :
Sheriff Otey and the Luck brothers killed Thomas Read (not Beale) and two companions at the Overstreet Tavern as the true source of the Beale treasure tale.

There exists NO definitive evidence for any of these "facts" , just additional fiction added to fabricate more fiction.

 

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[stephensmith1211]

Thanks for this information. It is useful

 

[ECS]

If one studies the family bloodlines of James Beverly Ward and his wife Harriet Emmaline Otey, the source material for the Beale Papers go beyond happenstance and coincidence becoming deliberately apparent inspirations for the Beale story.

Ward's grandfather J B Risqué had a duel with Thomas Beale (not Thomas J Beale) over Risque's niece Julia Hancock.
Julia Hancock married William Clark, who along with Merriweather Lewis had a perilous adventure in the West.
Ward's father was a thespian, familiar with Shakespeare's "TWO MEN OF VERONA", a play about a duel, a girl name Julia, a missing letter, and the phrase, "the game is worth the candle".
Ward's cousin who printed the pamphlet, was a fellow thespian with Giles Ward.
Ward's wife, Harriet was born and raised 4 miles from Buford's and her aunt was Sarah Mitchell, Robert Morris's wife.
Giles Ward was co-owner of a bookstore in Lynchburg which sold Poe's works, including THE GOLD BUG.
Ward, along with his Kennerly and Hutter cousins had lived in St Louis, Mo.
Ward and his Hutter cousins served in the Confederacy and were well versed with codes and ciphers from the War.
Ward was also friends with Max Guggenheimer, who also served in the Confederate army.
Ward's uncle, John Pickrell Risqué, lived in Santa Fe, and was killed while inspecting gold mine in Arizona by Apaches in 1882, three years before the pamphlet's publication.

A writer does write from what he knows and draws from those experiences, and in 1884, James Beverly Ward was in dire financial straights which would have been motivation to write and sell a localized dime novel to sell at the extravagant price for the time of 50 cents.
While there exists NO collaborating evidence outside of the Beale Papers that can confirm this perilous adventure treasure tale, there is a wealth of Ward family "source" material that can be confirmed that is well beyond being mere happenstance and coincidence.

Even a minimal cursory review on the above posted information makes obvious the source material for the Beale narrative story and ciphers available to James Beverly Ward, and supports Lt Fawcett's submitted conclusion to Col Friedman, that the Beale Papers treasure story sprung from "Mr. Ward's imagination".

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Just HIS opinion...

 

[ECS]

Opinion based on deductive analysis of existing real facts and discarding the obvious speculative derived from wishful fill in the blanks to fit ones personal expectations and belief theory concerning the Beale treasure tale.
In the words of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle:
"There is nothing more deceptive than obvious fact. Eliminate all other factors, and the one that remains must be the truth"

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Occam's Razor...

 

[ECS]

Occam's Razor...

...clean shaves away all the speculative "facts" attempting to prove the Beale fiction as a document of real events.
For all those that rant and rave
When reality and facts get in the way
and the chips fall where they may
Better get that Burma Shave!

 

[Rebel - KGC]

...clean shaves away all the speculative "facts" attempting to prove the Beale fiction as a document of real events.
For all those that rant and rave
When reality and facts get in the way
and the chips fall where they may
Better get that Burma Shave!

Clean-shaven, then...? You like their jingles...?

 

[Treasures2Find]

Opinion based on deductive analysis of existing real facts and discarding the obvious speculative derived from wishful fill in the blanks to fit ones personal expectations and belief theory concerning the Beale treasure tale.
In the words of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle:
"There is nothing more deceptive than obvious fact. Eliminate all other factors, and the one that remains must be the truth"

As quoted by a fictional character.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

As quoted by a fictional character.

YEP!

 

[ECS]

As quoted by a fictional character.

About a fictional character concerning a fictional perilous adventure treasure story.

 

[Treasures2Find]

About a fictional character concerning a fictional perilous adventure treasure story.

Then how is your fiction any better than another fiction?

 

[ECS]

Then how is your fiction any better than another fiction?

To which of what you refer as my my "fiction" are you questioning?
If, Treasure2Find,when you make such claims, you should be able to state your points and reasons with supporting facts, instead of posting these open ended remarks.
It is apparent that you really have nothing to contribute to this discussion, do you.

 

[Treasures2Find]

I'm referring to your post, quoting a fictional character, as evidence against what you call a fictional story. Thus my question, how is one fiction any better than another?
I do have something to contribute, and that is trying to keep rocks from being continuously hurled at posters who want to come here and discuss topics in peace.

 

[ECS]

I am not preventing you or anyone else from contributing to this or any other topic.
That is your misconceived perception.
AS for that quote, that is the very basis of deductive reasoning.

 

[Treasures2Find]

I am not preventing you or anyone else from contributing to this or any other topic.
That is your misconceived perception.
AS for that quote, that is the very basis of deductive reasoning.

No one said you are trying to prevent anyone from contributing to this or any other topic. I'm talking about you using said contributions as fuel for your unending negativity. I don't think you should have the right to make people feel inferior because they dare to believe something that you don't believe. There's only so many times you can tell people how wrong they are about the fictional Beale story, and how naive they are for believing any possibility that some portion of it might be true. You should know by now that your tactics have failed.

 

[ECS]

When is it considered "unending negativity" to address "questionable information presented as fact" and present a researched factual rebuttal ?
While I have discussed suspect speculation posted as "fact", I have NEVER attacked the poster to make them "feel inferior" or "naïve", that is your mistaken interpretation and lack any real substance beyond your personal attack agenda which you have presented on two of my OP threads.
If you can not rebut the "questionable facts" that I have listed on this thread with hard documented facts, then your "tactic" of attacking the messenger is to no avail, and I will not be drawn into a petty argument with you.

 

[Treasures2Find]

When is it considered "unending negativity" to address "questionable information presented as fact" and present a researched factual rebuttal ?
While I have discussed suspect speculation posted as "fact", I have NEVER attacked the poster to make them "feel inferior" or "naïve", that is your mistaken interpretation and lack any real substance beyond your personal attack agenda which you have presented on two of my OP threads.
If you can not rebut the "questionable facts" that I have listed on this thread with hard documented facts, then your "tactic" of attacking the messenger is to no avail, and I will not be drawn into a petty argument with you.

A researched factual rebuttal? You must have forgot to include your "factual" findings.

When is it considered unending negativity? When you keep shoving the same old worn out arguments down people's throats. Why can't you let it rest? Everyone already knows your views.

 

[ECS]

...and the beat goes on...

 

[Treasures2Find]

...and the beat goes on...

Showing your true nature. You got another one, huh.