Consulted a Lawyer, Re.: the Coin-star return slot contents .....

[Tom_in_CA]

Just consulted a lawyer with the following question:

A) Assuming a coin-star machine is located on private property (Lucky's Grocery store for instance).

B) Assuming some of a customer's coins get rejected, and end up in the return-tray slot. Example: silver coins, foreign coins, gold coins, etc....

C) Assuming customer wasn't aware, (or didn't care) and walks away. Leaving the coins behind. Then ...

D) Who do those coins belong to? Assuming prior customer never comes back for them ?

E) Belong to the next lucky passerby who checks the return tray slot ?

F) Belong to the Store , on whose property the machine is located ?

G) Belong to the Coin Star Vending machine Co's, who placed the machine there ?

H) Belong to the police , as Lost & Found Property ?

Here was the Lawyer's answer: "They belong to the Coin Star machine Co. " Not the store. And not anyone who passes by . And not the police, since it's on private property, not public ( and because presumably they aren't worth the $100 -or-more threshold anyhow). And he said there's usually a ph. # on the machine to call for questions, inquiries, claims, etc....

I asked him for his source/citation of law that would back up this legal opinion. He said that it's "common law". But that .... if someone cared to research it long enough, it would be in "case law". I asked "what case law can you cite?". He said that if I wanted to send them a letter, they would research further to provide the case law precedents. But that he was "100% confident".

I am not going to bother their firm to delve into it , to find case law precedents. As I don't want to test their patience But there you have it. That's the technical answer. Then he finished the phone call by saying he'd once found .50c in the change slot of the soda machine at their office lobby. And kept it.

 

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[ARC]

Tom... Your lawyer prolly sighs and rolls his eyes when his secretary says "Tom is on the phone".

:P

 

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[NHBandit]

Bandit, that's a riot my friend

Keep the faith, it's been a while since we battled the 2nd Amendment!

Disclosure: This is NOT politics!

Been away from here for a bit chasing women instead. Caught one so now I should be around more. Good to see you.

 

[NHBandit]

Fear of "arrest", "tickets", and "confiscations" are sometimes put out there to bolster the notion that we md'rs need to go around clarifying and asking "can I?" type questions. For whether or not they can detect innocuous beaches, parks, schools, forests, etc... And I have often asked the same thing : "Can you show me any examples of someone ticketed and arrested for detecting at a public place (that didn't have a specific prohibition in place). And then all you hear, is the sound of chirping crickets.

So too, in this case, would there probably be zero examples of any facing legal ramifications for taking the coins.

But what about the [gold?] coins in the news story that started all this ? If that father got wind of the fact that someone has his gold coins, that you were seen pulling from the slot after the drug addict left: Don't you think they legally belong to the father still ? (Whether directly to him, or to coin-star, which might have the subrogated duty to return those gold coins to the victimized dad?) .

All of our rationale that we can keep the coins, would probably go out the window in the case of the addict son who dumped his dad's coin collection into the machine.

They most certainly would still belong to the father since he was the last rightful owner AND he can be located. I disagree completely that they become the property of the Coinstar company simply because they were inserted into their machine. When you put coins in the machine you do so in expectation of receiving cash in return. That didn't happen so no transaction occurred.... Disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer and I don't play one on tv but I bet I'm right.... Run that theory by your lawyer friend and see what he says.

 

[b3y0nd3r]

Why not go to the horses mouth:

https://www.coinstar.com/termsconditions

Nothing there about the property of the reject tray.

Right from coinstar FAQ

"Check the return tray for any rejected coins. When all your coins have been counted, you’ll receive a paper voucher for cash, or an eGift Card, which has a unique code printed at the top. If you chose charity, you’ll receive a receipt for your donation."

Does not say, "your", rejected coins. "ANY" means ANY!

 

[Muddyhandz]

Hmmmn, why would I post on this thread? Well because the "man of logic" has to be a skeptic on my threads so I'll return the favour! Lol.

When I read your opening post, I thought surely he isn't going to tie this scenario with his "don't ask permission" mantra that you repetitively state on practically every thread.

The two comparisons aren't the same and are NOT logical my friend! I'm not even going to tell you why as it's so obvious.

Why do you spend so much effort on this? I'll say once again, there are NO parks or public places in my city that are off-limits because someone asked a bureaucrat "can we detect here?"

The only places that are banned are places that the groundskeeper came out and said there's no detecting because someone left big holes everywhere.

I refuse to leave and show them my screwdriver stating that this is all I use and after 30 years of hunting I will not let some one else ruin it for me.

I tell them that they're welcome to watch a professional in action and they do watch and then allow me to continue as I am not damaging the grounds.

The mess other hunters leave behind is the GREATEST threat to our hobby. Of course there's also trespassing on private property and night-hawking that also gives us bad name.

It's time to look at what really matters, not taking coins from a privately owned coinstar in a privately owned store.

Like really, why don't call your attorney about phone booths and drink machines? And what does that have to do with detecting PUBLIC places?

Oh yeah, and your driving comparison...."Surely you speed a little when no one is looking, blah, blah, blah." What up wid dat?

What are you trying to say? That line of thinking can be dangerous.

It's like when I took philosophy as a teenager, I came up with this type of thinking.....

Man is inherently evil. Man is imperfect and therefore anything man has created is imperfect, including man's laws.......

Luckily, I have strong conscious and the illogical belief in Karma that prevented me from going on a crime spree but it was close!

All I'm saying is that some of your comparisons could easily be misunderstood by someone reading your posts and can evoke dangerous thinking.

Don't worry, I don't like to beat dead horses and probably won't post again on this thread, unlike you who is relentless with your opinions.

Have a nice day!

 

[G.I.B.]

If you don't get caught that means it's un-enforced.

If it's unattended its mine.

If there is no sign it's okay.

Asking for permission is what people who grovel do.


I've got to change my definition of 'Entitled Millennials' and add a higher age group.




...and for people offended by my post, here is your virtual therapy puppy.

 

[Escape]

Just process your coins then check the return tray.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.....Coinstar could've elected to keep all rejects in another internal bin and they did not, .....

....You're exactly right! As their machines are "designed" with a reject tray, then they have chosen, through "their design", to reject the coins. If they are rejected, then they do not belong to Coinstar, as Coinstar chose not to accept what the machine rejects.......

Hey Swaveab & KCM : At first glance, this line of reasoning is stellar ! Seems insurmountable

But I have an insider's view of how this would fall apart: I own a street sweeper business. We service shopping centers as one of the types of street sweepers we send out. And as such, we are on shopping center properties all the time. Including the alleys, cleaning up where their dumpsters are located. And as you well imagine, they (some) forbid dumpster diving to the general public. On the basis of "private property", etc..... EVEN though those things are "rejected" and slated to be thrown out.

(I'm sure they forbid dumpster diving, for fear of people leaving a mess around the dumpster, or getting sued if the person slips, or whatever. ) But the point remains: The mere fact of items being rejected, does not equal = free game for anyone else.

Hence the mere act of "rejected" and "thrown out", does not mean they can't still be under the control of the private property owner, just as in the case of dumpster goodies. (if the property owner cares to police it)

 

[kcm]

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... When I read your opening post, I thought surely he isn't going to tie this scenario with his "don't ask permission" mantra ....

Muddy, honest .... when I first found the subject (that someone else had linked for comment), I wasn't thinking along those lines! I wasn't even consciously making that connection. I just found it to be an interesting legal dilemma, as did a few others too.

It wasn't till I decided to dissect further, and run it past legal beavers, and when someone posted that this was a "lawyer's waste of time...", that I had to ask myself : Why did I care? It wasn't till THEN that I drew this connection (as possible subconscious musings of human nature, as it pertains to our hobby).

And Yes, I'm the first to admit it's an over-blown bee-in-my-bonnet.

 

[SusanMN]

Found 63 cents in the coin reject tray today. I snatched them and felt like such a risk taker. Haven't felt that rush since the 70's when I went took my bra off in public for the first time. Thanks Tom!

 

[ARC]

"and for people offended by my post, here is your virtual therapy puppy. "

LOL

 

[BigWaveDave]

I checked my coinstar today....struck out.
But there were three pennies on the floor, beneath the front edge of the machine....
Mine now.

 

[Honest Samuel]

Can we put a end to this thread, please?

 

[BigWaveDave]

Not till I add a pic.....
Wait for it....

 

[ARC]

Can we put a end to this thread, please?

Why ? ? ?

Did you check your local coin star slot today and only find a Chuck E. Cheese token and a paperclip ?

:P

 

[BigWaveDave]

Awesome huh?

 

[ARC]

Hmmmmmmm.....

Do you think toilets also fall into the same category as coin star machines ? ? ?

I heard people drop stuff in em all the time :P

 

[ARC]

View attachment 1391814

Awesome huh?

Hey Dave I meant to ask you... you got 2 cents I can borrow ?

 

[ARC]

You can keep the scratched up one :P