1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D quarter - Genuine or Not! UPDATE!

[72cheyenne]

Ok, these are some coins from my grandfathers collection that I inherited. Most of the coins he acquired years ago, 1960s and 70s through trading with friends and at couple of coin shops. I recently had this collection "appraised" by a coin dealer, in which these three coins below he said could be counterfeit, but he wasn't 100% sure. I realize that there was and still are many "unethical" practices going on to deceive people into buying something that is not the real deal. The pictures are the best I can do at the moment, and I tried to take pictures of the defining areas to look for in the counterfeits.

The first coin is a 1909-S VDB Lincoln penny.

The second coin is a 1937-D 3 Leg variety Buffalo nickel. UPDATE: IT IS REAL!

The third coin is a 1932-D Washington Quarter that has obviously been polished.

Can anybody tell anything from the pics...... YEA or NAY?

 

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[72cheyenne]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

2nd coin

 

[72cheyenne]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

3rd coin

 

[treasuredog]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

Im not an expert,but they look real to me!

 

[Woodland Detectors]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

Um, Looks legitimate to me. That, is a sweet 1909 s v.d.b. victor david brennan)





The current issue of Numismatic News Coin Market lists retail values from $550 in Good condition to $6750 in MS-65.

Exact value can only be determined when the exact grade of the coin is known.

Please know that there are significantly more counterfeit 1909-S VDB cents out there than real ones. In order to get anywhere close to its actual value, you need to have the coin certified.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

I dont think there were near as many counterfeits of these coins in the 60's and 70's as there are now.

 

[72cheyenne]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

Thanks for the replies. I'm just wanting to get some opinions before I send them to be certified. There were a lot of counterfeits made back in the 60s and 70s, and that is when my grandfather was doing alot of his trading and dealing....so to have an appraiser throw up a red flag caused me to start checking into things. I guess maybe the only true way to know is cough up a little over a hundred bucks and send all three in to ANACS, if only one of them proves not to be counterfeit, then I have gained back the investment.

 

[lostcauses]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

nickel looks like leg has been removed.
The quarter could be goasting due to wire brush before tumbled. Lincon looks ok. Send em all in to have verified.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

Thanks for the replies. I'm just wanting to get some opinions before I send them to be certified. There were a lot of counterfeits made back in the 60s and 70s, and that is when my grandfather was doing alot of his trading and dealing....

OK I didnt know that. I collected coins as a child in the late50's and 60's but I dont recall that. We used to find good coins and of course silver in common pocket change. They just werent worth as much then. I found several 1909-s and 1909 vdb's and my Mom found a 1914-D in pocket change. I dont have them here to compare. I have rolls of steel 43's. I didnt find a 1909S vdb myself but my mom did.. I guess by the 70's counterfeiting was more common. But I didnt know that about the 60's.

I would try to carefully compare to a genuine. Coin dealers are often mistaken. I would think your chances are better because they are old. But Im just guessing.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

There are some good links online. I would try to find out what year these good die struck counterfeits surfaced. Just an idea.

This die struck counterfeit of a 1909-S VDB cent was published by ANACS in the February 1982 issue of The Numismatist, and is published in Counterfeit Detection Volume II, ©1988 American Numismatic Association, page 37. In that volume this very deceptive struck counterfeit is called "one of the most dangerous and deceptive counterfeits ever produced in any coinage series."
http://www.money.org/AM/Template.cf...s&Template=/CM/HTMLDisplay.cfm&ContentID=7239

http://www.bakercoins.net/learn/articles/1909s.vdb/1909s.vdb.html

http://www.oicoins.com/index_files/Page813.htm

 

[72cheyenne]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

Thanks for the links BCH. I have been studying these coins for a while. I always was interested in grandpa and his coin collecting. I can remember going to pawn shops and coin shops and flea markets looking for coins to fill our folders. I never in a thousand years would have doubted the authenticity of any of the coins grandpa had until we just recently had the whole collection appraised and sold. The dealer/appraiser looked at each and every semi and key date coin under a loop. He seemed very knowledgable and honest. I say honest being as he would not take these three coins because he could not be sure of them being authentic or not. I feel that if he was dishonest he would have taken them in the collection purchase. He was the one that produced the story of the added mintmarks and such that began in the 60s and 70s. He gave us a fair deal and price for the rest of the collection, so i don't think he would be trying to pull my leg. I want to get some second opinions on these coins, but don't necessarily want to walk into a dealer and say, are these real or not. Also in my reading, if you submit coins to the grading services and they deem them counterfeit, they turn the over to the authorities, and then there is a big bunch of red tape to go through as far as questions of who had them and where they came from. These are questions I can't honestly answer, plus I would hate to just "hand" the coins, even if they are counterfeit, over to the government. If they are copies, I will gladly mark them as such. I would never want anyone else to be "fooled" by these coins if they are counterfeit.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

Im just guessing here but I would think the first counterfeits to surface were easier to spot. This cent was just not worth as much in the 60's.

I cant help but remember a genuine cob that I found on the Treasure Coast in the late 70's-early 80's. I took it to a reputable Cuban coin dealer that didnt want to buy it after I cleaned it because it was a cast fake. I saved it all these years only to find out from members here that it is indeed real.

 

[72cheyenne]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

Im just guessing here but I would think the first counterfeits to surface were easier to spot.

I cant help but remember a genuine cob that I found on the Treasure Coast in the late 70's-early 80's. I took it to a coin dealer that didnt want to buy it after I cleaned it because it was a cast fake. I saved it all these years only to find out from members here that it is real.

I agree. I guess my next step would be to purchase either a high powered coin microscope or even a handheld loop. I feel fairly certain in my ability, with the help of the good ole internet, to determine from pictures of the known examples whether these coins are real or not. I haven't been able too "see" well enough the known points on the coins to make that determination yet. I posted here to see if any "experts" could pic out something I may have been missing. Out of the three coins, the "D" mintmark on the Washington Quarter looks the most "fake". I would think on the 3-leg buffalo that if the leg was removed, you would see evidence of "removal and polishing". I only see a single scratch that looks like the scratches on the rest of the surface of the coin. I guess getting a loop, looking at them close, convince myself they are real, and then send them to ANACS and keep my fingers crossed is what I'll have to do.

 

[jlb783]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

They all look real to me, but the quarter looks polished.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

You definitely need a loupe.

 

[hogge]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

To me, ALL 3 look to be the real deal. Certification is the only answer. ANACS is a good choice. GOOD LUCK! Hogge

 

[72cheyenne]

Re: 1909-S VDB, 37-D 3-Leg Buffalo, 32-D Washington - Genuine or Not!

Thanks for the replies and opinions guys, keep em coming.

Here is an update on the buffalo nickel. I have determined through much research that the 3-leg Buffalo IS REAL. I will show some differences between the 37d 3-leg variety and a standard 37d.

Here are some pictures to show the differences.

 

[briankb70]

they look real to me also

 

[allen]

only one i really wonder about is the buffy.
have them certified, then you will know for sure.