Ground Penetrating Radar

[diamondstar]

What if you were to attach some type of ground penetrating radar to the under carriage of a small aircraft, and fly over an area of interest such as an area of mines, caves, etc. Then identify and eliminate targets already known would this type of radar work for finding new mines and or caves? I know I have read about treasure hunters using this over water but with magnetometer's strapped under an airplane or running behind a boat but what about land! just a theory I was curious about. can others elaborate on this topic that know more about different types of radar.

[weldermark]

diamond don't know if that would work,but if you go to the top of the page and click on
accurate locator's you may find the answer your looking for HH.

Mark

[diamondstar]

Thanks, It doesn't sound to far fetched does it?

[ericwt]

I do not think the current GPR will be able to do what you need from the air.I cannot speak for other models,but mine requires very close proximity to the ground. Also It does not work for me if I scan too fast. Please note,I have nether the brains or the intelect to answer your questions. I have a geologist interpret the signals. Unlike a detector you don't pop it out of the box and go, you have to train yourself or(what I do)pay an expert to interpret data. My expert required considerable time to learn my unit as I bought it used and we had to try to create the conditions to test the unit. I will not be able to use this unit, until modifications can be done.

Ericwt

[Donna 2]

This is a response for the person who recommended Accurate Locators? -? PLEASE FOR THE PROTECTION OF YOUR OWN WALLET, MAKE ACCURATE LOCATORS COME OUT TO YOUR SITE AND DEMONSTRATE ANYTHING THEY SELL AND BETTER YET BUY FROM THEM ONLY AFTER ONE OF THEIR PRODUCTS PUTS THE ACTUAL TREASURE IN YOUR HAND.

Someone who has been bitten by them.

[Kentucky Kache]

Does anyone know a brand that does work?

[Darren in NC]

If you'd like a poor man's gpr, look at Tim's website. Even though many are skeptical of his LRLs, I have personally seen his arc geo logger and it works well. For the amateur thunter, it's worth it. I get no money for recommending it Type "arc geo logger" in a search engine and you should be able to find out all about it.

[dulak]

Does anyone know a brand that does work?

The true GPR's are

GSSI : http://www.geophysical.com/products.htm
ZOND-12C : http://www.omnitron.net/radar/0z12_1.htm
MPR-50 : http://www.giscogeo.com/pages/gprsw.html
GeoRadar : http://www.georadar.com/
Pulse EKKO : http://www.sensoft.on.ca/
RAMAC GPR : http://www.malags.se/

[dulak]

This is the true GPR site: www.kellycodetectors.com/gpl/ground.htm

Sorry but it is not GPR but GPL on Kellyco site .
GRP = Ground Penetrating Radar
GPL = Ground Penetrating Locators

[ericwt]

I spent money on one as I have said. My conclusions:

Do not buy a GPR unless you are studying geology or are willing to pay a geologist. This tool is useless unless you know what you are doing. If you are not a geologist or engineer it will take years of on the job trial and error. You can learn how to properly use it if you have 2 semesters of full time studies at a university. You would need a deans approval to do this. But in one year you will no how to use it.

Also GPR will not work in wet or moist conditions. Max depth is 10-15 feet,if you are lucky.

Earth Resistivity is where it is at.

Ericwt

[dulak]

What if you were to attach some type of ground penetrating radar to the under carriage of a small aircraft, and fly over an area of interest such as an area of mines, caves, etc. Then identify and eliminate targets already known would this type of radar work for finding new mines and or caves? I know I have read about treasure hunters using this over water but with magnetometer's strapped under an airplane or running behind a boat but what about land! just a theory I was curious about. can others elaborate on this topic that know more about different types of radar.

From a plane you can use a GEM-2 from geophex but it is expensive and complicate ...
here is the link and you can have a look :
http://www.geophex.com/Product_page/...out%20GEM2.htm
Good luke !

[Hoss KGC]

If the ground penetrating radar worked we would all buy one and be rich. Or we could chip in with nine other treasure hunters until we could afford one. THEY DO NOT WORK. The ground resistivity meter works. If a metal object is buried within the search area of a ground resistivity meter the speed of the carrier wave is speeded up and the meter will show whether it speeded up or not. They now have a light to show when you have found gold or silver as well as copper or iron. Also wells, caverns and other cavities under the ground slow the current down and that too will register on the meter but no light will be given. Dollar for dollar I would buy the ground resistivity meter instead of the ground penetrating radar. The ground penetrating radar has the right principles but the technology to make it work is not there. I mean if all you had to do is turn it on and see a chest of gold or jewels thirty or seventy feet under the ground EVERYONE WOULD HAVE ONE. The man that makes the ground penetrating radar for accurate locators will tell you yourself that the machine does not work.

I don't know why you keep stating GPR doesn't work. Of course they work. They just don't draw a picture of a treasure chest at 30feet. You have to be able to interpret the data. Unlike side scan sonar, they don't draw a picture that rivals a photograph.

Yes resistivity does work but it isn't the end all be all either. The bottom line is you use the tool that works best for the particular situation you have. All tools have their advantages and disadvantages.

I don't understand your statement about speeding up the carrier wave. All electrons travel at the speed of light. The resistivity units I have seen measure the resistance between 2 probes, nothing to do with carrier waves or the speeding up of carrier waves. Is there something out there working on a new principal?

Good luck,
Boattow

[Carl-NC]

I don't understand your statement about speeding up the carrier wave.? All electrons travel at the speed of light.? The resistivity units I have seen measure the resistance between 2 probes, nothing to do with carrier waves or the speeding up of carrier waves.? Is there something out there working on a new principal?

Errr... common misconception, but "electrons" are actually quite slow in circuits. More like a slug. The "effect" of electron movement, occurs at almost the speed of light.

The term "carrier wave" is an invention of terminology by the guys who make the "poor-man's" resistivity meters, and the notion of a carrier wave speeding up or slowing down is also a fabrication. It is intended to make the buyer think the device is doing something more than what the device is really doing, and that it is somehow $5,000 more complicated than the actual $100 in parts from Radio Shack.

- Carl

[Hoss KGC]

I don't understand your statement about speeding up the carrier wave.? All electrons travel at the speed of light.? The resistivity units I have seen measure the resistance between 2 probes, nothing to do with carrier waves or the speeding up of carrier waves.? Is there something out there working on a new principal?

Errr... common misconception, but "electrons" are actually quite slow in circuits. More like a slug. The "effect" of electron movement, occurs at almost the speed of light.

The term "carrier wave" is an invention of terminology by the guys who make the "poor-man's" resistivity meters, and the notion of a carrier wave speeding up or slowing down is also a fabrication. It is intended to make the buyer think the device is doing something more than what the device is really doing, and that it is somehow $5,000 more complicated than the actual $100 in parts from Radio Shack.

- Carl

You're right about the electrons, my bad!

I would not say that the term carrier wave is an invention of terminology but borrowed terminology. Aren't you a ham radio operator Carl?
Boattow

[Carl-NC]

I would not say that the term carrier wave is an invention of terminology but borrowed terminology.? Aren't you a ham radio operator Carl?

Not a Ham, but I understand radiowave propagation, and that a modulated signal is known as a carrier wave, because it "carries" the signal of interest. In the case of the PM-RM's, there is no modulation taking place, therefore no carrier wave in the classical sense of RF. But, I agree, I should have said "borrowed", perhaps along with "*******ized".

- Carl

[Marc]

Wow - don't know how I missed this thread!!!!? I can't believe some of the crap posted here! (well, maybe I can!)

1. ground penetrating radar works beautifully!? It's great for locating large, buried metallic objects and for discerning changes in the subsurface. (like burials)

2. some planes ARE already equipped with ground penetrating radar - try running a search for "airborne synthetic aperture radar"

3.? there is a LOT of CRAP equipment being sold by dubious "treasure hunting types".? If you want to try GPR, contact a qualified geophysicist!

Here are some links to some REAL GPR manufacturers...

http://www.sensoft.ca/
http://www.geophysical.com/
http://www.malags.se/

I have used it, it works, and it works GREAT.

To say that someone should buy a resistivity system instead of gpr is ridiculous!? it depends on the application and the budget.

I happen to have access to GPR rentals, and am an experience operator.? I'd be happy to discuss your GPR needs!? BTW -? I work WITH a geophysicist! (and it is NOT cheap!)

I would add one caveat. GPR does VERY poorly in clay!

Thanks,
Marc Austin
webmaster@treasurenet.com

[Marc]

I don't believe all of this about GPR's I would have to see one demonstrated and see if it can? find a treasure.

How can you disbelieve in something so strongly if you haven't seen it operated?

1st, treasures aren't everywhere!

2nd, you can BUY a REALLY nice system for under $20K You can get an operator for a couple hundred bucks a day.? You can rent a GPR system for a couple hundred bucks a day. (ask and I'll put you in touch with someone!)

Too many scam artists have given this valuable technology a bad name.?

GPR is a great technology - if it weren't - why would so many degreed geophysicists use them?

[Marc]

I can find a treasure if it is miles deep in the ground or miles away.

Prove it!? If treasures are everywhere,? as you say (God what are you smoking?) show us ONE you have found!

GPR works, and I CAN prove it! (but there is also a lot of crap out there - buyer beware!)

... I guess I'll have to get to work on an online GPR tutorial.

[chard]

The man that makes the ground penetrating radar for accurate locators will tell you yourself that the machine does not work.

The only GPR I see on their site is the Zond equipment. So I'm not sure what your talking about here.

Unless your talking about their GEMS/USA whatever they are calling it which is obviously not GPR and isn't even stated as being that.
But it seems kind of strange that if it doesn't work how they are still in business.

[ericwt]

Anyone see Battlefield Detectives on the History Channel. It was on the Civil War battle of Antietam.

They had a sweet GPR(or Surface Penetrating Radar). They certainly have come a long way from when I bought mine. It is also a good example of an expert using one and not finding what the machine indicated was there. They were looking for grave trenches.

Although I admit the technology is improving,and I am not giving up on it,it seems to me someone should look long and hard before investing in one of these.

This was not the first time I have seen the GPR fail. I have seen it fail quite a few times. Most of the time it was with experts running it

I think I will wait 5 more years and then buy a new one.

In a few more years I do see this as a very exciting technology.

Ericwt