AMRA FRAUD COMPLAINT

[MadMarshall]

https://oag.ca.gov/charities

Gentlemen I feel I have no other choice and I encourage others to submit a complaint as well, sharing their concerns about AMRA if you have them.. For me I am focusing on AMRAS fundraising under false pretenses. The fact that I feel and see Shannon is using Funds for his own personal benefit.I also will include the fact that AMRA has used intimidation to dissuade me from my inquires.
I see no other recourse. I have aksed these men to explain to me and share the information and instead of cooperation and civility I was bullied and intimidated..
Gentlemen thank you for your time..

The link above will provide you with a complaint form from the California State Department of Justice, Attorney General office..

 

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[MadMarshall]

This is what I don't get. I don't belong to AMRA but I stopped by an AMRA outing last year and all I saw was smiling faces and people having fun, not one person I met felt they were being scammed. It appears only non-members like yourself and Todd, who have not lost a single cent, are the ones that have it out for AMRA. $200 can buy a two day pass to Disneyland for one person or a years worth of mining and adventures for the whole family plus a friend or two. If you want to be civil minded, there are a lot of bigger fish in the sea wasting millions of dollars and DO have people disgruntled members, go help them.

I believe I have lost due to AMRA and so has the mining community. You are right about me not losing a cent to AMRA.. I saw AMRA for what it was the moment they were created.. Plus I aint dependent on the recreational mining community for a single cent. Paydirt teaching people to pan/taking people out and remakes of pans and sluices and all this other stuff is outta my league I guess. For me recovering the gold is really not a concern . I focus on finding it.. The biggest problem I see is how AMRA makes mining into a DISNEYLAND. It doesn't take no knowledge or responsibility when bein an AMRA member. Just dig have a good time fill in your holes please.. Over the years I have noticed a big distinction in people who recreationally mine and people who mine for a wage or extra income. Not only in attitude but in land use.. Truth is the mining community is losing because our frontrunners are full of crap and pretenders.. in short RECREATIONALIST.. I believe mining rights were intended for men to find and exploit deposits of Value for income.. When did the Value /deposit ,become exploiting the experience of find gold? Why is it now that the individuals who actually use mining rights as an income voice is overshadowed by recreationalist sense of entitlement? Unfortunatly the recreational community has all but complety destroyed the small scale mining community. And its obvious why.. Like I said recreational land use is different.. Way different. Recreational claims are used differently.. AND IT SHOWS.. Anyway if you guys think that supporting AMRA and groups associated with them is a good thing or it cant hurt.. I say you are sorely mistaken.


"AMRA FaceBook Post"
Happy Easter.

We've been off the grid for several days mining and are gearing up for our Vegas trip this coming weekend.

Years ago when AMRA was just a thought in the mind, we knew we didn't want to create a non-profit (501(c)(3)) that just begged for money, we wanted to have something tangible people could have for a donation to the legal fund. We knew a shirt or hat wasn't sufficient and honestly, for over 6 months I said I wouldn't start something where we just asked for donations. One sleepless night I was laying next to my wife thinking of the 9 claims we had and boom....it dawned on me. What if we offer access....no, unlimited access to their entire family for a donation. That one night formed AMRA. We now have over 75 claims in the Western United States and growing rapidly.

We've come a long ways and I'm very proud to say we have the best staff of volunteers on planet earth. We have added a few new board members, Melissa, Nicole (well, not that new, but we wanted to mention her anyway), Matt, Steve, Jeff and Reb.

Many people ask us what would we do if we had the funds to do whatever we wanted to. We'd file many, many lawsuits. All of them against regulatory and management agencies for completely overstepping their authority or just blatantly violating our fundamental rights as public land users, and owners of mineral estates. And one in particular against the only "legally" allowed entity to dredge in CA.

We come up with new ideas to help fund these causes, like the live raffle with the GPAA in Las Vegas next week. Guys, do you realize what we are giving away? Close to $20,000 in prizes and you don't have to be there. You can watch the raffle live right here in Facebook and hell, we'll even UPS the giant dredge to your doorstep if you win. I'd invest $5 in tickets to have a few chances to win....but I can't, you can.

Please call (209) 266-2844 (the call center) and purchase some raffle tickets. You're helping a great cause and you just might win something amazing next weekend.

Oh, and the picture here is what we'd really like to do to Governor Brown....in Oregon and California.

So here is a recent post.. So basically when you support AMRA you are supporting Lawyers.. truth is AMRA supports B.S.. AMRA supports AMRA!! They give very little to "All these important cases that they lead you to believe your donations are going too" .. Actually more money is given to other groups like PLP WMA then actual cases.. But anyway AMRA didn't want to become a group that always begged for money.. Just look at their actions!! one fundraiser after another.. Honestly the only thing changing in this regard is the Fundraising and begging are coming more and more frequently...
They have changed their mission and purpose many times.. Now you are donating to a "GENERAL LEGAL FUND" .. JUST B.S.. Anyway they can change their tune as many times as they like I think people are becoming more and more aware that AMRA is all "Convenient Rhetoric" and that the AMRA is no different from the Gpaa or other pay clubs except the fact that they BS'd their way into a NON Profit Status.. And that would be ok if they actually supported the mining community but honestly I know for a fact that the mining community gets jackshit from them and that these important court cases get even less then that..

 

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[QNCrazy]

. . .

 

[goldenmojo]

Vic. I am having trouble understanding. Who exactly is the mining community and if AMRA was so inclined to give to this community what method would they use to distribute the funds?

 

[Goodyguy]

My Tnet New Years Resolution.. I will take a year off from expressing my criticism towards all groups . I hope that 2017 is different. But i ain't gonna hold my breath. I suspect people are tired of hearing it. I'm tired of saying it.
To all i hope 2017 brings you fortune and success in all of your endeavours..

So much for resolutions
Hey you almost lasted four months.

GG~

 

[MadMarshall]

Vic. I am having trouble understanding. Who exactly is the mining community and if AMRA was so inclined to give to this community what method would they use to distribute the funds?

Mining community for me is individuals who wish to exploit the mineral resources of the land for a profit. I cant really say who they all are,, though I can say you know them when you meet them..
I aint gonna give no thought to what AMRA could do for the mining community.. they aint done nothing positive or beneficial for the mining community in the 5 years they been around that I know of..
The very foundation of their ORG is recreational land use and they flaunt it well. They just need to stop pretending they are anything but a pay to play club.. get some integrity and drop the Non profit Status.. They most certainly don't represent the mining community and Values as I understand them.. Also if they want too hold fundraisers and take donations for a cause it would be nice to know that they actually did what they said.. But when it comes to AMRA very little of proceeds went to the cases they claimed to be raising funds for. No doubt the reason of this new wording" LEGAL FUND" believe me it pays to be general in the NON Profit expeacially when you are BS ing people..

I ask AMRA this? how much of your donations over the last 5 years did you contribute to Court cases such as Rhinehart or Walker or these others? Truth is they wont answer? They are ashamed to answer because very little money was allocated to these important things. These" important things" are just a pathetic income for worthless men.. Criminal in my opinion...

 

[Goldwasher]

So much for resolutions
Hey you almost lasted four months.

GG~

we could only be so blessed to never hear his drivel. But, alas he has changed his mind

 

[Goldwasher]

"Sense of entitlement"...ha ha ha...

From the dude who puts himself above everyone whenever he can point it out. For the sake of pointing it out.

True piece of work

 

[MadMarshall]

we could only be so blessed to never hear his drivel. But, alas he has changed his mind

Rainy cold days I suppose..
Drivel? that's the word you chose. My silly nonsense is actually fact based.. You are more then welcome to provide facts to counter my claims? Or even your opinions.. I actually enjoying reading your posts..

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Obey our rules or face consequences. If some find they can't log in for awhile it is because you ignore warnings and kept insulting and talking down to other members.

Sent from my P008 using Tapatalk

 

[B H Prospector]

I have a question. When I first joined this forum umpteen years ago the members here listened and helped greenhorns with mining questions and techniques. What happened to those helpful people? I will confess I too have gotten caught up in the political and belittling banter and name calling. Treasure Hunter called me on it a couple of years ago and I imposed a self exile from here. I just recently returned hoping things have changed. They haven't. The threads that have real mining questions are usually pretty short and the ones with the bickering seem to run for ever until a monitor puts a stop to it. The exchange of mining ideas seem to be gone. I don't think anyone needs this much drama in their lives that you go out and manufacture it. You don't like clubs?, find don't join one. You don't like the AMRA?' fine don't support them. But don't put down someone who does. No one is putting a gun to your head to join one. I don't particularly like 99% of reality shows so I don't watch them but I also don't put down or criticize those who do. Let's get back to teaching and learning from each other.

Live Long and Prospect

 

[mytimetoshine]

I agree. The general forum is a disaster. Last year it was trolls and fake profiles intentionally starting viral threads. that is much better recently, But there are members here that post on literally every single thread. They answer questions that were never asked and give advice when none was needed or warranted.

They think there helping but they actually hurt the forum. Just like you said. actually prospecting threads get little to no action but if you want to rehash wether its legal to high bank in Ca over and over till your blue in the face your good. lol

I already know what the response to this will be. like a broken record... " I'm only trying to help newbies not do it wrong" or whatever.

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[goldenmojo]

I have a question. When I first joined this forum umpteen years ago the members here listened and helped greenhorns with mining questions and techniques. What happened to those helpful people? I will confess I too have gotten caught up in the political and belittling banter and name calling. Treasure Hunter called me on it a couple of years ago and I imposed a self exile from here. I just recently returned hoping things have changed. They haven't. The threads that have real mining questions are usually pretty short and the ones with the bickering seem to run for ever until a monitor puts a stop to it. The exchange of mining ideas seem to be gone. I don't think anyone needs this much drama in their lives that you go out and manufacture it. You don't like clubs?, find don't join one. You don't like the AMRA?' fine don't support them. But don't put down someone who does. No one is putting a gun to your head to join one. I don't particularly like 99% of reality shows so I don't watch them but I also don't put down or criticize those who do. Let's get back to teaching and learning from each other.

Live Long and Prospect

BH Thanks for all the valuable help you gave me through your posts when I first started mining and joined this forum. Hopefully you stay around for awhile sharing the wealth of knowledge.

 

[mike(swWash)]

Plain and simple.
Don't believe......then don't give.
Don't like the subject....then don't read.

And just because it's on the internet....it aint always true, (insert buyer beware here)!

 

[Goldwasher]

Sorry. I just try to express my thoughts and back them up woth life experience or why I feel the way I do about it. The forums are here to discuss things like legality and potential pitfalls. I do it in real life so, and people are very thankful so I do it here too.

I tend to stick up for the guys getting bashed especially the beginners and weekend warriors. As well as club members who are smart enough to make their own decisions. End up leaving myself open for criticism. I'm bad for getting people into panning if they want and selling them things they want to buy. Such a terrible dude I know.

I do not feel bad or will I apologize for talking about high banking or sb 637 or mining law or what rights anyone has if they are trying they "make a wage" or not. Or feel bad for pointing out that it is opinion, that clubs and "recreational" prospecting is ruining small scale mining.

Because it affects me or will if it gets worse. I spend time researching it and taking part in the fight for our rights. I make phone calls to agencies, Work with the county and my chamber of commerce to make sure that I don't get people in hot water and have it come back to me.I share some of that here to try and help. But, according to some I'm just mining the miners I guess. Though the bulk of my revenue is from general river and camping supplies.

I post occasional finds( more than most members actually) and try to talk about how I get them even if it is just a small part of what I find. So, that others can see it isn't that hard. As a way to share knowledge. Encourage people. Spread the fever. I have spent hundreds of hours helping people in private and answering questions as best I can with never ever a thought of telling them they should pay me. Extended numerous invites for people to come to our claim for free as an easy way to avoid having to find an open spot, when out to California for a short trip.

I have so much going on in my life, that it's nice to sit for an hour before I get going and chime in on some threads. The one thing I have learned is there will always be a few who criticize, while contributing very little to the conversation. They will label others point out their own virtue but, not actually lend any real substance. So, keep on keepin on. I am not losing a wink of sleep over it.

I am interested in a case by case breakdown for three instances of how a club has "ruined " something for the "community".

I don't mean opinion. How about start to finish, cause and affect. With names dates and before and after. Of how someone was pluggin along on their merry way working open land or their claim, and how a club came along and "ruined" it for them.

For the bigger picture please show how everything was fine and small scale prospectors had no issues or enemies or people trying to stop their activities in totality until clubs and associations came along and started their own anti mining bills. A timeline and list of club created anti mining bills would be greatly appreciated.

While were at it a list of who is allowed to make gear and sell it, Who is authorized to buy and use it , and the qualifications required to get to that point. Who is allowed to show others how to pan and how are they supposed to determine who they help further along. Who is allowed to locate a claim and what land should they be able to do it on and how much work are they supposed to do and how often to maintain title.

I realize there is already a system in place for these things. Though it appears that this thread and others is about a reset. So, I'm interested in the plan.

 

[MadMarshall]

GW
Your sarcasm is duly noted.

I personally take no issue on people like yourself and the actions you take nor do I discourage letter writing or participating in the support of the financial burdens that often come with court cases.. I do not take issue with the retail side nor the individuals who take it upon themselves to show people the ropes. I understand business and have no quam with individuals who partake in such. But I do have a problem with Mining Activism used as a platform to support these individuals.

 

[Terry Soloman]

The sad fact is the "Small Mining Community," is too small to fund a legal case, or make a difference in changing or maintaining laws. Snake oil salesmen that have the cure for all the ills of the small mining community are either clueless, or they prey on the clueless. Small mining needs to grow support organically by spreading its roots into other popular outdoor pastimes, and creating a larger base.

Raffles and yearly dues won't buy the beans and bacon, let alone "make wage."

 

[Goldwasher]

GW
Your sarcasm is duly noted.

I personally take no issue on people like yourself and the actions you take nor do I discourage letter writing or participating in the support of the financial burdens that often come with court cases.. I do not take issue with the retail side nor the individuals who take it upon themselves to show people the ropes. I understand business and have no quam with individuals who partake in such. But I do have a problem with Mining Activism used as a platform to support these individuals.

Disclaimer....No sarcasm, disrespect or insult intended with the following comment

All due respect it sure doesn't sound like that OFTEN

If you had came to the forum after your inquest and complaint with info in writing. Many here, myself included would look at it totally differently.

No rehash I have read everything you say. I can even understand why V.A.M feels as he does.

But, that's how he feels. I don't think you get that Shannon gets his tnet info from others who may read it and pass it on. your posts here on the subject are mainly for your own sake. I don't mean that as a dig either.

If I was in your spot I would have called him directly FIRST. But, thats just me. I have talked to him several times it's not a hard situation to set up. It might be if someone comes at him like you have without all the info and a pocket of accusation, I'm pretty sure you know how that feels.

Do your thing. But, I just happen to think you could go about it differently and more directly.

Sorry for giving you hell over it just trying to illustrate I guess.

 

[oldbones]

The sad fact is the "Small Mining Community," is too small to fund a legal case, or make a difference in changing or maintaining laws. Snake oil salesmen that have the cure for all the ills of the small mining community are either clueless, or they prey on the clueless. Small mining needs to grow support organically by spreading its roots into other popular outdoor pastimes, and creating a larger base.

Raffles and yearly dues won't buy the beans and bacon, let alone "make wage."

Though I am new to prospecting, I've been a member of the 4 wheeling community for years. It would be nice to see these two communities link up, since we are fighting the same enemy. More resources to fight with. So many trails have been closed due to frivolous lawsuits by environmentalists, and they are the same issues that miners face. Too much silt in the water, eroding the land, frogs, turtles ect. that might be harmed. Keep Public Lands Open to the Public is our stance.

 

[Hard Prospector]

I have found some great gold on AMRA claims and I appreciate all of your hard work standing up for the pick and shovel miner.....Thanks Todd!

 

[Oregon Viking]

I think rather then file a complaint you should sue them!
I can help set up a raffle for legal fees.